I played the Fender Tone Master amps today

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by Otis Fine, Sep 10, 2019.

  1. MilwMark

    MilwMark Poster Extraordinaire Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    9,962
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2013
    Location:
    near Arnold's
    Right! Except it’s $300 less.

    But the whole, well, I could buy a “real” amp, and an attenuator argument always cracks me up.

    Also, for the 99% (made up but probably low) of gigging guitarists who don’t “tube roll” or swap speakers or clip bright caps or do other mods, the lack of ability to do those things is a non-issue.
     
    Alamo, PigBoy and unixfish like this.
  2. MilwMark

    MilwMark Poster Extraordinaire Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    9,962
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2013
    Location:
    near Arnold's
    I think the point people are missing is with the Tonemaster (if it sounds great and has great dynamics) I can play it on 7-8 volume, and get that glorious, clear, dynamic Twin breakup, and the 2x12 fullness and spread. But run it at 12w or 22w so the venue doesn’t kick me out. Or if I want clean pedal steel sound I can run it at 40w or even the full 85.

    The beauty of digital (unlike a tube amp attenuated) is they can preserve the full tone, punch and dynamics when stepping down.

    A couple guys I know and trust at shops, have been stunned by how great these are. We’ll see when I get one. But these guys are typically very realistic about the pros, cons and value of gear in their assessments. Several of them are tube snobs in their own bands. And they are gushing.
     
    VWAmTele, Alamo, TeleTex82 and 2 others like this.
  3. beninma

    beninma Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

    Age:
    42
    Posts:
    2,278
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2017
    Location:
    Massachusetts
    You're assuming a digital amp somehow gets past the issue of a speaker needing to be running at a certain level to sound good.

    A really good attenuator/power scaling design in the tube amp should be competitive. Again maybe there's something about the classic sound of a Fender that makes that hard to do because you need some kind of new modern speaker design that can sound good pushing less air. Maybe a brand new 21st century tube amp design that doesn't have to sound exactly like an old amp gives the designer more flexibility at different power levels.

    But make no mistake about it, Fender spent vastly more money on engineering to get these to work and sound good. It would have been way cheaper to design new tube versions with attenuators/power scaling built in, and they would have sounded really good.

    Fender went with the digital option because:
    - Weight
    - They think there's a market of people who dislike tubes and love digital
    - These have a way bigger profit margin once you amortize the huge engineering cost than the tube amps do

    Once they pay off the (millions?) in engineering cost they'll be making a lot more money on one of these than the tube version even though these cost $300 less.
     
    Wildcard_35 and Cerb like this.
  4. RetroTeleRod

    RetroTeleRod Poster Extraordinaire

    Age:
    55
    Posts:
    5,692
    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2012
    Location:
    Oklahoma, USA
    Next thing you guys will be wanting me to give up my tube driven computer. Heresy! ;)
    [​IMG]
     
  5. Matthias

    Matthias Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,959
    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2003
    Location:
    UK
    I get more and more excited about these. I really want to see if these are built to last on the inside before spending that much though. Anyone taken one apart online yet?
     
  6. bftfender

    bftfender Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    4,120
    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2017
    Location:
    York PA
    learned a huge lesson on a Super Reverb RI .popular opinion is pretty neg towards them...sure not what i hear coming back from the mix's in studio. Of all the amps i have..its like a base...it does exactly what i want ..at any level i want it to. and get this cardinal sin...when i got it the power tubes are 2 dif manufactures...i aint changing a thing on this amp,,,

    what ever works for anyone...that is the correct amp !! when you play something & cant stop,,,who cares about cloth wires...period correct this....what matters it what is sounds like,,,
     
  7. EsquireBoy

    EsquireBoy Tele-Meister

    Age:
    38
    Posts:
    204
    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2019
    Location:
    Paris, France
    For the longest time I’ve been kind of a tube snob. Since I’ll have to play guitar in the evening most of the time this year, I bought a little Yamaha THR5 last week. I cannot believe I waited so long to really give a chance to modeling amps... Although I had found ways of getting a good sound on my little 5f2 at bedroom volume, the THR5 sounds better at this volume.
    My point is: if I had not owned a bigger amp for gigs and band practice already, I would surely have bought one of these Tone Masters instead of the THR5. I would have get a 2 in 1 amp, able to play in my bedroom and outside for gigs.
    Although it is a bit painful to admit, I am converted.
     
    mkdaws32 and MilwMark like this.
  8. EsquireBoy

    EsquireBoy Tele-Meister

    Age:
    38
    Posts:
    204
    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2019
    Location:
    Paris, France
     
  9. 4pickupguy

    4pickupguy Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    9,125
    Joined:
    May 12, 2013
    Location:
    Fort Worth, Texas
    Played one of these at Guitar Sanctuary last weekend. I swear my Ethos sounds better. The DRRI I was there to look at was much better.
     
  10. Cerb

    Cerb TDPRI Member

    Age:
    39
    Posts:
    90
    Joined:
    May 3, 2019
    Location:
    Sweden
    I think they can sell the modeling amps with a much higher profit margin than they can with tube amps. The modelers are based on software and I bet that the circuitry is identical or at least very similar between the two amps in question. Other than the marketing department there shouldn't be anything preventing Fender from putting both of them in the same circuit and build them into one amp.
     
  11. MilwMark

    MilwMark Poster Extraordinaire Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    9,962
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2013
    Location:
    near Arnold's
    I agree with you about working the speaker. But IME feeding it 12 watts is plenty to do that.

    I wonder how the .2w setting on the DR will be?
     
  12. beninma

    beninma Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

    Age:
    42
    Posts:
    2,278
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2017
    Location:
    Massachusetts
    Yah I totally agree.. the modelers can use way cheaper everything and they can use tiny components on PCBs that are pick and placed & wave soldered by a robot. Once they've got the design they're just buying the chips and the robot places them on the board then someone plugs it all together into the chassis.

    That engineering cost to build all these algorithms though... I'm sure they figured that out (how many units to justify the cost) but software ain't cheap. The linked video earlier in the thread the fender rep claims these amps have about 4x the compute power of the Mustang amps... 4X the compute power is dirt cheap too compared to the engineering cost.

    Of course the most expensive thing is the old fashioned hand wired PTP tube amp cause no one is going to build a robot to build that kind of amp.
     
    Cerb likes this.
  13. WTRT

    WTRT TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    44
    Joined:
    May 8, 2009
    Location:
    Maryland
    Had an impromptu jam session and was playing the Yamaha THR5 and an ASAT as lead while a friend played on a Pathfinder 15R and another was playing a Typhoon through a 1x12. It was plenty loud and even kept up when an electric bass was brought into play as well. Yes, an acoustic drummer would have probably blown us out, but for four guys in room it was rocking... I don't plan on ever selling that Yamaha or the Pathfinder. When you find a great solid state amp, you have found a great amp.
     
  14. Fretting out

    Fretting out Tele-Holic

    Age:
    27
    Posts:
    624
    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2019
    Location:
    Land of Mary
    I just want to know how well they take pedals I have a champion 100 I know it’s cheap but the dang thing hates pedals I’m on board with these new tone masters if pedals work well
     
    Lef T likes this.
  15. VWAmTele

    VWAmTele Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    3,072
    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2005
    Location:
    FL
    I'd love to hear what that .2w sounds like on 10 - just for grins.
     
    scelestus likes this.
  16. Strato50

    Strato50 Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    52
    Posts:
    1,353
    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2017
    Location:
    Port Arthur TX
    They just never learn. They’re chasing one tone. “Tubes”. Lol
     
  17. TeleTex82

    TeleTex82 Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    3,165
    Joined:
    May 4, 2010
    Location:
    San Antone
    I think they're just about done chasing...
     
  18. alnico357

    alnico357 Tele-Holic

    Posts:
    661
    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2015
    Location:
    Arkansas
    I don't need a new amp. My main gigging amp is a 2010 DRRI Electric Blue. I had a 80 lb Twin with JBLs in the past. If I was faced with a new amp purchase I would not hesitate to try the new DR or Twin. Weight is a factor for me.
     
    Lef T likes this.
  19. Strato50

    Strato50 Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    52
    Posts:
    1,353
    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2017
    Location:
    Port Arthur TX
    I believe it when I hear it and see them on stages. And not some metal band.
     
    Bones likes this.
  20. Strato50

    Strato50 Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    52
    Posts:
    1,353
    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2017
    Location:
    Port Arthur TX
    This is Fenders attempt to keep up with the other amp modeling crowd. Why don’t they just make an affordable Vibroking and be done? Oh wait they’d never sell anyone another amp. Lol
     
    Bones likes this.
IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.


  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.