How does alcoholism kill people

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soundchaser59

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Water is also a solvent.
Is it your intention to imply that water harms the human body as badly as alcohol does? Or that alcohol is as harmless as water?

The human body dies without water.
The human body does not die without alcohol. The more alcohol you put in the more quickly the human dies. Part of that damage is due to the solvent effect of alcohol on the connective tissues and fatty acids that keep everything working correctly. Alcohol will dissolve bonds in minutes or hours that water would take years or decades to dissolve.

But I'm guessing you already know all of this.
 

Toto'sDad

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I was angry at the littering. Unfortunately, emojis don’t always express the content to which they were aimed.

I apologize and will change it to sad.
No problem FR. I didn't understand the emoji. You are right about the litter. When the oil fields were booming, the first pile of cans would be not far from the store where the beer was bought. It was even worse back when beer was still sold in bottles. Then a short way, there would be another scattering of empties, this would repeat, repeat all the way into town. Fortunately, or unfortunately, the oil fields are NOT booming, and the litter has been reduced considerably.

My wife and I patrol our daily dog walk for trash. We live in a nice neighborhood, but there is always stuff to pick up from people passing through. There are several of us who do the cleanup, so that things stay pretty nice.
 

buster poser

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Is it your intention to imply that water harms the human body as badly as alcohol does? Or that alcohol is as harmless as water?

The human body dies without water.
The human body does not die without alcohol. The more alcohol you put in the more quickly the human dies. Part of that damage is due to the solvent effect of alcohol on the connective tissues and fatty acids that keep everything working correctly. Alcohol will dissolve bonds in minutes or hours that water would take years or decades to dissolve.

But I'm guessing you already know all of this.
No, neither of those statements match my intended meaning, thanks for asking. I meant that in and of itself, a fluid being a solvent doesn't make it inherently bad and alcohol's solvent characteristics aren't among its worst as I understand it. Cheers
 

cyclopean

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And most people don't think of it, but remember alcohol is also considered a solvent. You can imagine what chronic solvent ingestion can do to the various organs in the body. IMO there is nothing good that can come from ingesting alcohol, despite what they say about the occasional glass of wine.
You don’t think community, connection, and a good night out are good things?
 

BigDaddyLH

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You don’t think community, connection, and a good night out are good things?

Guys, guys, guys...

I think the problem here is that some people have issues with alcohol addiction and overuse, and others don't. If you have issues, it's natural that you would think any alcohol is always a bad thing. I remember someone here once writing that if he even has a sip of beer, the night end with handcuffs.

Some things are true for some people and false for others.

My wife's family rings the changes for addition. One aunt is addicted to gambling, but there's also the alcoholic, the drug addict, the serial philander etc... About half the family needs a big old intervention! And yet, others don't have these problems. I don't think it's entirely a matter of will. I think some people are just wired a certain way that gives them a proclivity that they'll have to fight against.
 

cyclopean

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Guys, guys, guys...

I think the problem here is that some people have issues with alcohol addiction and overuse, and others don't. If you have issues, it's natural that you would think any alcohol is always a bad thing. I remember someone here once writing that if he even has a sip of beer, the night end with handcuffs.

Some things are true for some people and false for others.

My wife's family rings the changes for addition. One aunt is addicted to gambling, but there's also the alcoholic, the drug addict, the serial philander etc... About half the family needs a big old intervention! And yet, others don't have these problems. I don't think it's entirely a matter of will. I think some people are just wired a certain way that gives them a proclivity that they'll have to fight against.
If someone says “i get nothing out to drinking”, that’s fine. Being around alcohol has lead me to being in friendships, and bands, and given me insights, and I’ve picked up a lot of freelance work through being out and about at bars.
 

BigDaddyLH

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If someone says “i get nothing out to drinking”, that’s fine. Being around alcohol has lead me to being in friendships, and bands, and given me insights, and I’ve picked up a lot of freelance work through being out and about at bars.

What's a safe amount to drink? I think we all know someone who drinks too much, but what about the rest of us? My wife tells me there are new Canadian recommendations coming down the pipe, and her patients aren't likely to follow them because they are so strict: the new recommended limits are two drinks per week for women and four drinks per week for men.
 

Toto'sDad

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If someone says “i get nothing out to drinking”, that’s fine. Being around alcohol has lead me to being in friendships, and bands, and given me insights, and I’ve picked up a lot of freelance work through being out and about at bars.
I sold a lot of farm equipment in a bar back in the day when that was the way business was done. I had some great times in bars, and drinking. I also got stomped clear into the ground by the gendarmes on not one, not two, but three different occasions. Our last go around completely cured me of wanting any further encounter with them. It's been well over forty years since I had my last treatment, so it was pretty effective.

The lure of alcohol is so great, that even though I never had any further problems with the police, it was because I became very clever at drinking, and when and where I drank. I did this for about fifteen years before I finally quit drinking on my own, because it was time.

I've stated before, if I could drink "sensibly" as the ad says, then I'd do it. Problem is, the longer you drink, the more it takes, and eventually, the volume of booze one consumes moves it well out of the "sensible" zone.
 

cyclopean

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I sold a lot of farm equipment in a bar back in the day when that was the way business was done. I had some great times in bars, and drinking. I also got stomped clear into the ground by the gendarmes on not one, not two, but three different occasions. Our last go around completely cured me of wanting any further encounter with them. It's been well over forty years since I had my last treatment, so it was pretty effective.

The lure of alcohol is so great, that even though I never had any further problems with the police, it was because I became very clever at drinking, and when and where I drank. I did this for about fifteen years before I finally quit drinking on my own, because it was time.

I've stated before, if I could drink "sensibly" as the ad says, then I'd do it. Problem is, the longer you drink, the more it takes, and eventually, the volume of booze one consumes moves it well out of the "sensible" zone.
If your tolerance gets higher, drink to your tolerance.

Alcohol helps to make friends and make connection, and it brings people together. Also sharing alcohol you made yourself is a wonderful way of connecting with other people.
 

Toto'sDad

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What's a safe amount to drink? I think we all know someone who drinks too much, but what about the rest of us? My wife tells me there are new Canadian recommendations coming down the pipe, and her patients aren't likely to follow them because they are so strict: the new recommended limits are two drinks per week for women and four drinks per week for men.

Seems backwards to me, I could hold my booze pretty good, but my ex-old lady could drink me under the table. She used to drink vodka all day long from a tall tea glass. After drinking all day, she was ready to go dancing and do some serious drinking.
 

cyclopean

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What's a safe amount to drink? I think we all know someone who drinks too much, but what about the rest of us? My wife tells me there are new Canadian recommendations coming down the pipe, and her patients aren't likely to follow them because they are so strict: the new recommended limits are two drinks per week for women and four drinks per week for men.
A safe amount is what isn’t causing problems in your life. That varies wildly by person.
 

Toto'sDad

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If your tolerance gets higher, drink to your tolerance.

Alcohol helps to make friends and make connection, and it brings people together. Also sharing alcohol you made yourself is a wonderful way of connecting with other people.

I am not saying you are wrong. In your situation, it's a good thing. The world is full of people that alcohol is for them a bad thing. It's just part of the human condition.
 

BigDaddyLH

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A safe amount is what isn’t causing problems in your life. That varies wildly by person.
I kinda agree. But a safe amount is also what doesn't do long-term damage to your body, and you may be unaware of what is going on for years, thinking "it isn't causing problems in my life", until the damage becomes apparent. That's what the guidelines are about. Yes, they are "one size fits all", but it's a starting point.
 

Toto'sDad

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I kinda agree. But a safe amount is also what doesn't do long-term damage to your body, and you may be unaware of what is going on for years, thinking "it isn't causing problems in my life", until the damage becomes apparent. That's what the guidelines are about. Yes, they are "one size fits all", but it's a starting point.
For the longest time when I was sipping on a glass of Jack straight, I thought whiskey was actually good for me. I now kind of laugh at that attitude, but then I used to think cigarettes were good for me. After all, most doctors recommended camels for themselves.

 

BigDaddyLH

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For the longest time when I was sipping on a glass of Jack straight, I thought whiskey was actually good for me. I now kind of laugh at that attitude, but then I used to think cigarettes were good for me. After all, most doctors recommended camels for themselves.



Yes, doctors can be wrong, but what's the alternative?
 
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