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Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by TC6969, Oct 19, 2021.
"I want to hear you lock in with the drummer."
"No, the kick drum."
Suggest that the band work on arrangements together for each song.
Speak in terms of “what the song needs”.
Openly discuss dynamics, structure, and letting the song breathe. Mention from time to time that most effective songs hang together by “what you don’t play”. Make this a big deal for the entire band.
Unless they don’t like the guy. In that case, suggest they move on to another player.
How Do You Reel In A Bass player? My wife hates it when people still call me Player.
With something shiny that spins and jingles.
Cover band or original music?
If it's a cover band then it's easy by just saying, that's not how the song goes.
My Bass player is great. If he wanted to constantly do runs and walking Bass lines he'd have no issues. However, he'd be leaving the drummer to hold down the fort.[/QUOTE]
No need to beat around the bush, just tell him what's up. Something like,
"Hey man, you're really coming along fast! I can't believe how good you've gotten and how fast, everybody's seriously impressed. But now you've got a little problem that we all went through- you gotta learn that just because you CAN play something, doesn't mean you SHOULD. Everybody goes through that stage- I sure did, but dude, you gotta lay back some. When you step out, it should MEAN something, you know? We're glad to have you on board- you're doing great, you just gotta learn not to whip it all out on every song."
He probably knows he's overplaying to some degree, but it feels so good he'll just keep doing it unless somebody says something.
Pay him to play what you want him to play.
Tough situation. You don't wanna kill the enthusiasm.
Maybe emphasize that groove and pocket are what is needed most, and to really pick your spots to do anything flashy, which will make it even *more* impressive. Less is more.
Just ask. If he’s argumentative then there’s no reason to attach any longer professionally. Musicians have to know the rules before they can break them
Give him sheet music to read.
Well, if you're asking the question, it frankly means you don't know how to communicate as a band. It's not easy but it is not complicated either. It is mature, clear, direct communication, nothing fancy about it.
I was going to say "Victor Wooten"
Have you recorded any of your practices/performances? Video is also extremely helpful. Record a song and have the whole band critique the recording. Try working on a song that calls for a lot of space, fewer notes. Let the bass player do it his way and then suggest playing like the original artists recording.
Great suggestions. If it’s a cover band have him play the parts note for note. Then give the band a feature tune where they can stretch out and be introduced. And all of this too…
Talk about Jamerson, McCartney, Sting. They know how to serve the song. Sometimes the part is busy, sometimes it is real simple. I have played bass for 25+ years and it took way too long for me to figure that out. Most of the time, simple is better.
I'm a bassist. The advice that would make the most sense to any "good bassist" is to tell them to stay in the pocket and lay down a solid foundation. You don't have to be boring, you just have to play what fits well. A bassist worth their salt will know to play what the music dictates and not just play every note they can think of. There are tasteful ways to "add flavor" to lines and it is almost always subtle (assuming this is NOT a prog band). As people have mentioned, Sting, McCartney, Jamerson, there are tons of bassists who were amazingly good, played subtle but very effective basslines, and it did the music a world of good. You can play amazing basslines that have subtle awesomeness and it doesn't step all over the mix.
A good friend of mine is a fellow bassist as well. He played me something he and his band recorded and I was immediately annoyed with what he was doing. He wasn't slapping or playing the wrong style of music, but he was WAAAAAAY overplaying the notes in the scales. The guy was a music teacher, so he knew how to play every note in all of the scales, but the skill he certainly lacked in that project was to "read the room." It is vital for a bassist to know where to be in the vibe of the song and if they aren't there, they need to know that it's not working.
If anything, record something and play it back. Make a note of how it stands out too much or it's drowning out the mix and tell them to hang back a bit.
And if they are a good enough musician, they'll see the point and probably be pretty happy about not having to work as hard to get an even better result.
That's how I roll, at least.
Let him go full Les Claypool. There, I said it. Let the dude have some fun. I'm mainly kidding but I do love Claypool and Primus.
Just sit the guy down and talk to him about your issues in a respectful manner, don't talk down at him. I'm sure he'll understand and you'll all be able to come to some kind of compromise if he's a reasonable human being.
The Bass Player needs to be all about the Drums.
If he isn't, it is time to order Pizza until you find one you can work with.
I just saw Primus Sunday night at the Greek in LA. A girl sitting behind me was going on and on about the drummer from Tool. I told her I never got into Tool, but my friend is a drummer in a Tool tribute band.
Maybe he is training....
I had a bass player that learnerd some slap and then he put slap on everysingle song. We are friends so we talk... hey mate, modern slap bass dosn't fit in this CCR song. He said that he wanted to know where to fit that. So we did some sessions just for him, and we recorded it... he was happy, calmed and by himself he listened and saw he was overacting. Now, from time to time, he slaps 2 seconds in a song, we look each other and laugh, is like a joke but in gigs he has to have his moment or couple of moments
That is the point
I completely disagree with that. Why not? In some songs I don't play any lead and let thast to the bass
Start making low grumbling voices and grunts.
The hardest harshest criticisms I’ve been given I had the sense to realize at the time were great information that I needed to listen to. At the time it didn’t make them any easier to swallow but I looked at the people giving them and I had a ton of respect for them as they were much better and much more successful than I at the time. I also had the extreme displeasure of having to let a couple people go. Both were pretty bad at the time with one guy insisting on paying for dinner at the same time I’m letting him go and he’s telling me how bad his money problems are, and the other was a younger rhythm player in an original band who was crushed, as I heard from his cousin later. Both guys went on to become very well-known pretty much worldwide known players. The first guy was a drummer who insisted on playing too much and too loud for the pretty much dance/club band that we were. He’s a well-known and well respected jazz player now and already was back then, And my first love is jazz but bringing it into a group that had been playing with different members over 10 years and at this point probably 30 yrs now, at many Southland clubs, With one gig at one club even enduring all this time, we want to go in and work through the gig in the proper fashion, and don’t have a whole heck of a lot of time to reel somebody in who is bashing, and trying to impress with Elvin Jones different time signatures inside each other. The other kid became a shredder after a deep funk, and subsequent locking himself in his room and Wood shedding, Presumably as his cousin led me to believe in a I’ll show them fashion. He became one of those guys on the roster of A record company known for fast shred guitarists, I think out of Las Vegas. He put out albums and toured. I just thought of this, as a bass player maybe if he’s not hip to them, maybe go through the discography’s of Jerry Scheff, and also his son Jason Scheff, bassist for later versions of Chicago, and the elder Jerry a veteran of thousands of albums and sessions, including both Elvis Presley and Costello, Roy Orbison, Bob Dylan, the Doors, And countless songs you hear thru the day on radio and television. One puts it in the pocket, with the most seemingly perfect parts, like James Jamerson , and the other in my humble opinion can be heard to ‘ over play a little‘ but only on live recordings, there’s no way they’re letting him wank on a pop recording! Ha! If he doesn’t hear the difference and see how that plays out at this time…. I guess he could make like the young bull, run down the hill and play all the notes on one cows song, or he could mosey on down that hill and play on all of the cows records.