Help need to convince my dad for a new guitar?

Discussion in 'Other Guitars, other instruments' started by fbarroso, Jan 3, 2014.

  1. Triton Thrasher

    Triton Thrasher Tele-Afflicted

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    Well, his dad is, for some strange reason, reluctant to spend five grand on a toy for the kid.

    Wow. But how does that help him persuade his dad to be enough of a dick to buy him a five grand toy?
     
  2. Chriss945

    Chriss945 Tele-Holic

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    My dad has a Gibson 335, it's a lovely guitar, but I wanted my own so I looked around a bit and found the 'Epiphone ES-335 Pro'

    It's a class guitar and absolutely wipes the floor tone wise and playability-wise with my dads Gibson. And he'll be the second to admit that after me! He's even borrowed it to use for his steely dan tribute band.

    I would seriously do a google search for this epiphone, I'm sure in the states they're more widely available than here in the UK. It cost me £270, which roughly translates to about $350. Absolute bargain at that price and is miles better than the dot!
     
  3. stevopacnw

    stevopacnw Former Member

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    Wow, really? I can afford a lot of things that I'm reluctant to spend money on...mostly because I'd rather use the money for something else. Review your Econ 101.
     
  4. spikypaddy

    spikypaddy Tele-Afflicted

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    My thoughts on your situation are a bit like this...

    When I first started playing, my folks bought me a dirt cheap 3/4 size classical - more like a toy than a guitar. I was told that of I stuck at it and improved, they'd get me an electric, since that was what I really wanted. After 2 years they bought me a secondhand Encore Strat copy - which kept me happy. 4 years later I wanted a Strat. At this point they told me I was on my own. But I'd been doing a paper round and saved some money, and by the time I was 15 I had the money to buy my MIM. From then on, I paid for all my own gear. I'm 30 now, I've got a 3 Mexican Fenders, a Gibson SG Classic ans a couple of other relatively inexpensive guitars. I wanted my next purchase to be a semi-hollow. A guy I know is selling a cherry red figured ES-335. Even at 30, working two jobs and with no kids I just cannot justify the £1500 it would cost me, so I'm going for an Epiphone - which plays as well as most Gibsons!

    What do I hope you get from my experience? Firstly, a genuine American ES-335 is a lot of money - and extremely hard for most folks to justify. I've only ever had one car that costs more than a used 335 - and I've had my fair share of cars!

    Second - ignore the brand on the headstock. My little cheap Encore Strat copy is hands down the best sounding Strat I have ever played - and with pickups, mods and the initial purchase cost my first MIM Strat has over £1000 in it. But it gets blown away by a guitar the cost my folks £60 used and most people see as a "beginners" instrument. The Epiphone I'm getting has features I would struggle to find on a guitar that cost 3 times as much, looks drop dead gorgeous and sounds great.

    Third - take the time to save and get a guitar you've paid for entirely with your own money - it will feel so much more like your own guitar than if someone else bought it. I didn't appreciate my budget Strat clone for many years, until years of playing and trying various different guitars made me realise the true intrinsic value of it as an instrument, rather than its cash value.

    Finally - don't underestimate the value of buying a budget instrument and upgrading it over time. My first MIM was a well built guitar, but lacked a bit in the sound department - until I swapped the electronics, and changed little bits and pieces over time. It's also fun to mod and gives you a better feel for what you really want from an instrument, as well as creating an instrument that is more personal to you.
     
  5. MrCairo46

    MrCairo46 Friend of Leo's

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    Dude why are you posting at 3:45 am?????
    When I was your age I had my heart set on $700 Fender 135 Bassman and it's 2x 15 cabinet. Dad heard the price and said "you're out of your ever loving mind". Of course I bought it. And I kept it hidden for about a year. I paid for it all my self. Today, I'm now the father of 3 lovely daughters. I don't think we parents are here to simply GIVE you what you want. Why ask???? Why be so dependent??? Go out and earn it and then practice your fingers off cause you'd better play up to that guitars $ price tag.
     
  6. telemaster7082

    telemaster7082 Tele-Afflicted

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    Something I just thought of - when I was 17/18 I really wanted a real LP. I had gone through an Epiphone, and I hated it! But I figured all the answers had to be in that Gibson.

    Finally made enough money, went out and picked my favourite color.......color.

    What a mistake. I mean, it looks great on the stand, but I find myself reaching for my CV50's 9/10 times.

    I have almost gotten rid of that LP a number of times, been through a pile of different pickup choices. Finally settled on a set; however, Im still never perfectly happy with that guitar.

    I pretty much keep it around for 2 reasons ;

    1) a reminder, dont just buy it because you think it is going to give you a certain sound

    2) because I will probably never own another one in my life, and it is a nice guitar.

    Be careful what you wish for. I thought I was going to transform into Jimmy Page the second I got that guitar home....
     
  7. hecubus

    hecubus Tele-Meister

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    I read the title of the thread and was expecting something like, "My Dad is a great guy who works really hard and spends all of his money on his family and securing our future. As a result he has been playing the same broken down guitar for over 30 years. Please help me convince him to buy a new guitar becasue he definitely deserves it."

    Boy, was I off.
     
  8. gtrguru

    gtrguru Friend of Leo's

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    Great advice on this thread. I had to get a job when I was 15 because there were things like guitars and cars that I wanted. I wish my parents would have bought me a guitar.
     
  9. Chriss945

    Chriss945 Tele-Holic

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    Also, a grown adult calling a 14-15 year old a 'spoilt brat' over the internet is beyond contemptible. And the kid handled it better than most people would have.
     
  10. Scantron08

    Scantron08 Tele-Afflicted

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    Said insulting poster did take it too far by using that term, but I think it was his execution, not his message, that was in error. Many here have given the same message, but in a much more constructive way.

    And I agree the kid handled it with mucho class.
     
  11. TheHoneyMonster

    TheHoneyMonster Tele-Meister

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    fbar, when i was your age (god, i sound old), i wanted the most expensive ESPs and the top drawer Gibsons (which i could not have, of course). cue lots of poor quality cheap guitars. i got my '72 TDRi for Christmas when i was 15 and my ideas of guitar buying slowly started to change. this guitar is the most expensive i had ever owned (£500) and i told myself that if i never spent more than this on a guitar whilst not dumpster diving the dregs of unknown budget guitars i could have my cake and eat it. so now i have 5 electrics (3 currently, 1 being repaired and 1 on the way) and an acoustic, i am very content at present with this arrangement. so what my rather long and incomprehensible story should tell you is that you should go for the guitar type you really, really want, but never go overboard with how much you are going to spend and a little compromise is a small price to pay for a great guitar, so go for something like an Epiphone Sheraton, Ibanez AS, Hagstrom Viking or, at a push, a Yamaha SA. all top quality guitars that are slightly nicer, albeit pricier than a dot, are still WAY less than a Gibson (and my money is the Yamaha is better than the Gibson). just my .02
     
  12. jimash

    jimash Friend of Leo's

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    I do not question the OP's motives or abilities.
    I just think he has his sights set too far too fast.
    An Epi ( and I prefer the fancy sheraton to the needs improvements dot ) or Guild or that nice Hamer on this very site are all acceptable to pros.
    Add a Super Champ XD and bases will be covered, for less than a 335 .
     
  13. brianswindall

    brianswindall Tele-Afflicted

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    I've seen them used on Craigslist for $1800 - mint.
     
  14. jimash

    jimash Friend of Leo's

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    Just as a shopper's note , for that 1800 bones you could just about swing a brand new Guild Starfire ( which I see the kid tu®n up his nose at but they are nice) and a new '68 model Princeton.
     
  15. chesire

    chesire Tele-Afflicted Ad Free Member

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    We're reaching the point in this thread where there is too much content and many are reading the first few pages and then jumping to the end. I'll summarize:

    1. The original question could have been phrased better
    2. Seems like a good kid who handled some questionable responses in a classy fashion
    3. Got a lot of the same advice and received it gracefully
    4. Is considering an EPI because of the aforementioned advice

    This thread summary was provided as a courtesy to all new thread arrivals and will be repeated as necessary... hopefully by someone else.
     
  16. Lobomov

    Lobomov Friend of Leo's

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    C'mon .. a 14 year old comes to the internet to find support for making his dad shell out 4k on an ES-335 and it's an offence to call him a spoiled brat. Yeah .. it is harsh, but seriously ... also at that point, suggestions about getting a cheaper guitar where rejected by .. I feel those money could be better spent towards an ES-335. Also as said these are the internets .. you only have the writtten language .. I prefer to be blunt.

    Now he is leaning towards the Dot, which is something else and makes much more sence. You never know, maybe my post contributed to this?
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    Now that we are talking business and not just asking Dad to shell out 4k ... tbh, it sounds like looks mean as much to you as tone .. fair enough, go with the dot, if that is the case.

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    Now if we are talking tone, first of all ... tone is a very peculiar thing, since a lot of it resides in the fingers. So basically just because you play the rig of one of your heroes will not make you sound like your hero. My greatest hero when I was your age was Mark Knopfler .. I can make any guitar sound like him .. as long as it doesn't have a too heavy string guage, tho in principle you need a fiesta red 1960s Stratocaster .. or at least single coils.

    But that being said .. lets move on further ....
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    I personally love the Gibson ES tone myself. My main guitar for ten years was a Howard Roberts Fusion II - We are talking a hollow body with a center block just like the ES-335, tho it has a slightly deeper body. The neck pickup is fantastic.

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    I've replaced it with a Tele. I liked having the Fender feel and scale, but after a while I missed the neck pickup of my Gibson. I threw in a nice humbucker into the neck (a Mule from Bare Knuckles pickups) and now my Gibson and Tele sound almost identical. The BK pup on the Tele is actually slightly more dynamic than the Gibson, so I'd say the Tele wins marginally on points.

    My Tele has a better Gibson tone that my Gibson at this point, tho both are amazing at that thick fat old school bluesy jazzy sound.

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    So what am I saying. The same as a poster above me. The ES-335 has a center block, so it is actually not that far removed from a solid body guitar. If you just want to get close to the ES-335 sound, then just finding a guitar that you like and when you can afford it drop in a couple of high-end pups and maybe new pots and you're done. You don't have to buy expensive hand wound pups like I did. I'm pretty sure you can find two Gibson Classic 57s or whatever they put in ES-335s used at a good price.

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    Personally I wouldn't give ******* about looks. I'd find the guitar in my price range that feels best in my hands, because that is really what matters most and mod that in time.

    Else don't mod but slowly trade upward .. it is going to take you some years, but once you hit something like the Les Paul Studio .. you are actually holding a very good guitar in your hands and a lot of what you get from more expensive guitars is in the finish department.
     
  17. LeroyBlues

    LeroyBlues Tele-Holic

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    Yeah, that's me, thanks for saving me having to wonder what has happened, because I sure wasn't gonna read six pages of replies.
     
  18. moosie

    moosie Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Snap.

    fbar, after hearing more from you, I have little doubt that you'll be successful in whatever you do. If I read correctly, you're saying you can come up with maybe $2k over the next... summer was it? Well, hell, you can very likely get your 335 all by your lonesome. Then next year you can ask that XMAS gifts be applied to your 6L6 amp fund :) (it never stops, you know that, right?)

    If you're brand new to craigslist, be very careful of all manner of scams.
     
  19. Jakedog

    Jakedog Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    + a bazillion.

    My dad bought me my first guitar. $89 for a brand new Samick acoustic. That was AFTER I used his guitar to learn a bunch of sings from his 70's EZ chord songbooks. He always wanted to get me better stuff, but never had the money. It really bothered him that I was out gigging for money at 14 years old with junk stuff. Never bothered me. I was making cash, and pretty soon had some pretty nice stuff.

    My mother, my teachers at school, my pastor, my scout leaders, all told me it was a hobby, and not a career. My dad was the only one who was ever in my corner. I miss him a lot.

    I'm forty years old now, and except for a couple of short spaces, I've played guitar for a living since I was fourteen. It can definitely be done. If you have the balls to do it. I'm not rich or famous, and I never will be, but I make a living. I have a decent car (2011 model, very nice) I live a decent house, my three kids eat three squares a day and don't have holes in their clothes. My wife works too, it's not all me, but the point is, I'm living proof that it can be done.

    I would have thought a site full of guitar players would have been a little more focused on that part of the kid's post. The part where he has a dream, and he's not being supported in it. Personally, I do believe that if he wants that guitar, he ought to get some gigs, or a job and buy it himself. But I didn't think in a million years that people on this site would be so discouraging to a fourteen year old kid with dreams of being a rock star. I was that kid. You know what? Although I came real close several times, I never got there. But wouldn't trade the last twenty six years of my life for anything. Even when it was bad, it was awesome.

    I'm starting to suspect we may have too many guitar owners around here, and not enough guitar players.
     
  20. Fernandomania

    Fernandomania Tele-Afflicted

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    My parents made me earn things so asking Dad wasn't an option for me. Sometimes I hated it when other kids would get things just by asking their parents but in retrospect I'm glad that they taught me to value hard work. When you work hard for something, you'll value it even more. Stick with the Squier and save for the ES-335.

    I'm a grown man with kids and the ES-335 has always been one of my dream guitars. I just barely ordered one this week. I've had an Epiphone Dot and a Sheraton II before but this will be my first real ES-335 so if it doesn't happen as a freshman in high school, you'll survive somehow.
     
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