Help Me Buy A Looper

Discussion in 'The Stomp Box' started by Doghouse_Riley, Nov 6, 2017.

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  1. Doghouse_Riley

    Doghouse_Riley Tele-Afflicted

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    I've gotten a lot of use out of my RC-3 but it's time to upgrade. I want to be use this for live solo gigs and trigger pre-recorded bass and drum tracks that run on one channel and send out to the PA and then make guitar loops with the second channel and send that out to a guitar amp. Also do more "traditional" looping, i.e. making it all up on the spot. Presets are a must, 40-60, enough for a whole show. I also want something quieter than the RC-3.

    I'm hoping someone here has some insight into some of these loopers. It can be difficult trying to figure out just what each can and can't do.

    My list so far:

    Top 2-
    EHX 22500 - seems to have what I need. Used price around $220.

    Pigtronix Infinity - also seems to have what I need but somewhat limited with 50 presets. But gets lots of rave reviews as the best sounding looper on the market. Used price $300.

    Also considering:
    Boss RC-300 - 3 loop tracks. 2 things I don't like: a) subsequent loops are limited to the length of the first loop. b) expensive used price around $400.

    EHX 45000 - 4 loop tracks. Looks nice but a little pricey at around $400 used.

    Boomerang III - this seems to be the Cadillac of loopers but a) expensive used $500+ b) hard to find.

    Looked at but rejected:

    Digitech Jamman Stereo and Soloist XT

    Ditto x2 & x4

    Boss RC-30


    Thanks for any suggestions/ideas/comments.
     
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  2. SolidSteak

    SolidSteak Friend of Leo's

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    I love the Boomerang, but if you want to "trigger pre-recorded bass and drum tracks that run on one channel and send out to the PA" the Boomerang will not do that. It's more of a live looper to sample on the fly, and it has no storage capability.

    If you plan to use it for "more "traditional" looping, i.e. making it all up on the spot," it's perfect for that and well worth the money IMO. It's like buying 4 Boss RC20's and syncing them up, either in series or parallel.

    Out of curiosity, what didn't you like about the Jamman, Dittos and RC30? IIRC the Jamman can use an SD card to store pre-recorded stuff like you want...
     
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  3. Doghouse_Riley

    Doghouse_Riley Tele-Afflicted

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    Yes, all 3 are excellent for storage. The Jamman has some really nice looking software to help organize it all.

    As far as I can tell they won't let you treat the 2 loops as separate, totally independent loopers. The loop length on both channels are dependent on the length of the first loop. In other words you wouldn't be able start with a 4 beat percussion loop in channel one and then lay down a 16 beat guitar rhythm on channel 2. Once you lay down the initial track you are limited to the length of that first track.

    The 22500 and the Infinity will let you do longer subsequent loops. The RC-300 and EHX 45000 won't let you do this.

    So for example, while performing I may want to do some percussion for one bar. I don't want to have to do it for 8 bars just so I can subsequently do 8 bars of bass or rhythm guitar. For me that really disturbs the flow.

    Hope that makes sense. And if I'm mistaken or there are workarounds, I'm all ears.:)
     
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  4. screamin eagle

    screamin eagle Poster Extraordinaire

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    If a Digitech Trio piques your interest, them PM me. I'll sell you mine for a good deal. It's got low hours on it.
     
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  5. SolidSteak

    SolidSteak Friend of Leo's

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    Oh, okay. So you need independent loops, sometimes of different lengths, and maybe some file storage?

    Setting aside the storage issue, I know the Rang does allow up to 4 independent "one at a time" loops of varying lengths in "Serial" mode, and "Serial-sync" mode uses the first loop as a "Master" and the other 3 can be played along with the Master loop, in the same length or multiples of the Master length. There's also "Sync" mode, which is like having a Ditto and stacking up to 3-4 loops but being able to turn them off independently - I think these all have to be the same length though. Then there's "free" mode.

    That sounds confusing I'm sure. But with the Rang you could indeed strum some "percussion" for one bar and then loop a 2, 3, 4 bar etc. over it I'm fairly sure.

    I mainly use Serial mode and sometimes Serial-sync. If you are interested, check out the manual for the Boomerang III:
    http://www.boomerangmusic.com/Manuals/E156ManualVersion35.pdf
     
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  6. popthree

    popthree Poster Extraordinaire

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    i have owned and loved a couple of different versions of the Boomerang loopers. They are super great live loopers but none offer some of what you are describing.. especially the "Presets are a must, 40-60, enough for a whole show" statement.

    you may want to do some research into a computer platform solution.. software running on a notebook, triggered by some kind of midi foot controller. i don't have a specific recommendation for you, and would actually, appreciate your feedback if you do find some interesting stuff in this vein.

    i'm actually starting to dig around myself because the venerable Mike Nelson of Boomerangmusic has sold his company, and I can't get an email response from the new owner.
     
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  7. popthree

    popthree Poster Extraordinaire

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  8. Doghouse_Riley

    Doghouse_Riley Tele-Afflicted

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    Thanks for all the great insights. Much appreciated.

    @screamin eagle thanks but the Trio is not what I'm looking for.

    @SolidSteak and @popthree The comments about the Boomerang make me think even more that it's not right for me. At least right now I believe I'll be doing more verse-chorus-verse type looping or just triggering pre recorded drum/bass tracks.

    A computer platform is interesting. I'm not sure about making it hands free though. Also, I have several songs that I want to be able to do live looping on the fly too.

    I'm still between the Infinity and the 22500. I wish I could play with both for a couple weeks then decide which to keep.

    Keep the comments coming. This is helpful to me.
     
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  9. Doghouse_Riley

    Doghouse_Riley Tele-Afflicted

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    Yes it does. Ok, now I got to read up on this.
     
  10. popthree

    popthree Poster Extraordinaire

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    this quantiloop thing looks like a very interesting option to me. there is a midi bluetooth footcontroller by iRig that looks to be what you'd need to go along with it. the app is $9.99 and the controller is $99.99. that is a lot cheaper than a Rang.
     
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  11. popthree

    popthree Poster Extraordinaire

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    i think there is going to be another piece of hardware required. some kind of iRig cable that accepts and sends 1/4" or something to that effect.. the in and out for guitar to amp stuff.

    ex:
    http://www.ikmultimedia.com/products/irig2/
     
  12. Doghouse_Riley

    Doghouse_Riley Tele-Afflicted

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    @popthree it also needs an iPad 2 or better which I don’t have. IPad, app, midi footswitch and iRig gets it up to the price of the EHX 22500.

    Also, I don’t know about the iRig 2 but I had a similar device and it was noisy and not very robust. The jack got wonky quickly. Not road worthy.

    It’s still a consideration but I need to know more about the guitar>iPad interface. I’m also leery of relying on the 1/8” output jack on an iPad. Or is there a noiseless Bluetooth option?
     
  13. popthree

    popthree Poster Extraordinaire

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    no doubt, the 1/8" output from the ipad would be the weak link.

    for me though, this may be the answer. live performance with this setup would be rare.. maybe a strange art show once a year or something.. mostly just me weirding out in my little music room and then recording the result. and i already have an ipad2.

    i actually downloaded the (free) quantiloop app last night and tinkered with it. by default it uses the onboard mic of the ipad. i made a few voice only loops rather quickly. it definitely has the right feature set for me.

    • Input Impedance: 380 kOhms
    • Frequency Response: 20Hz-20kHz +/- 0.2 dB
    • Instrument Input Connection: 1/4" Jack
    • Amplifier Output Connection: 1/4" Jack
    • Device Output Connection: 1/8" TRRS Jack *******weak link*****
    • Headphone Output Connection: 1/8" Jack
     
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  14. Mark Grant

    Mark Grant Tele-Afflicted

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    I have the Infinity and absolutely dig it. So many reasons why are easily viewable on the killer demos that the piggies have on their web. Bought the extra pedal to undo and reverse as well. Had an RC-2, Ditto now this Infinity. The midi connectivity is huge as well as the output to the mixer.
     
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  15. Doghouse_Riley

    Doghouse_Riley Tele-Afflicted

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    Well, I pulled the trigger on the EHX 22500. It's a birthday present to myself. I got a demo model from Sweetwater. The price sold me, $248. $200 less than the Infinity. I don't use midi (so far) which seems to be the main difference between the 22500 and Infinity.

    Thanks for all the comments. It really helped me make my decision.
     
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  16. Obsessed

    Obsessed Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Jamman Stereo. No need to look further. It is awesome playing the bass and drums through a bass amp and then loop over with rythum and lead guitar into a guitar amp. Don't be too concerned about the size, because to do "live" shows, you would want an extra footswitch box with other loopers (not required, but it helps eliminating mistakes). It has enough memory to handle a gig's worth of full length backing tracks. If you are doing covers (and I'm a crappy drummer) I figured out how to download free backing tracks through iTunes into Digitech's Manager software to download into the Jamman. You can even switch "tracks" during a song for complex or improvisational songs by getting a $10 aftermarket add-on "switch". Biggest downfalls are no batteries and lousy built in drum sounds.

    Edit: Dang, you bought a looper while I was typing this.
     
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  17. popthree

    popthree Poster Extraordinaire

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    Obsessed- how many simultaneous loops can you get going with the jamman stereo?

    that is something i really need in a looper.

    i like to create layers, say, drum sounds, bass, keys, washes, etc, in separate loops that i can activate here and there and allow them to run sync'd with other loops i have going. it doesn't look to me like it does that, but maybe i don't understand it.
     
  18. Obsessed

    Obsessed Telefied Ad Free Member

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    I'm not sure if there is a technical limit, but I must say as more layers (loops) are added, things seem to get washed out compared to recording tracks on a computer. I'd say 6 might be a reasonable number, but of course it probably depends on what you are recording. It has a XLR input, so I throw in some sound effects using a mic and they are very clear. Again, it is like a band where once you throw in a bunch of "layers" or loops as you refer, you will need to adjust your guitar lead to stand out in the mix.

    Just to add, if you are not needing exactly what the Op wants, you should look at the Trio+. It is a song writing machine, but I still run it into my Jamman Stereo for memory purposes. Hope that helps.
     
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  19. popthree

    popthree Poster Extraordinaire

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    i'm not talking about layers on the same loop. i'm asking if it will allow separate loops to run at the same time. there is a very distinct, and profound difference.
     
  20. littlebadboy

    littlebadboy Tele-Afflicted

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    Some loopers are tone suckers... which is why I gave up my Boss RC20XL. I now have a TC Ditto X4. Couldn't be happier! It is True Bypass and easy to use.
     
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