Headstock glueup

Discussion in 'Tele Home Depot' started by Caaspizza, May 22, 2020.

  1. Caaspizza

    Caaspizza TDPRI Member

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    Question for the builders:

    Is it an acceptable method to glue an extra piece of wood flat against the underside of a neck blank to get the needed room for the Headstock angle?

    Like so (I know these are two different kinds of wood, this is just for illustration)
    15901310585272115807266358578152.jpg
    Thanks for any thinking along!
     
  2. Marn99

    Marn99 Tele-Holic

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    You could do it that way, but honestly, I would do a more conventional scarf joint instead. Is there any particular reason why you want to do it this way?
     
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  3. EsquireBoy

    EsquireBoy Tele-Afflicted

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  4. guitarbuilder

    guitarbuilder Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Sure, It's like a scarf joint but in a different place. It won't help with strengthening the tilt back neck though, but as long as it's a good glue joint, you would be OK. Try to match the grain up with the scrap part of the cut off if you can. I did it on a guitar a few years ago to use a piece of wood I had. I'm not a huge fan of the normal scarf joint because of how it looks...like an import guitar. I prefer the Gibson look and the potential breakage :).

    With peghead ears on to hide the joint from the side, you'd hardly know it was there.

    extended peghead.jpg


    extended peghead 2.jpg


    extended peghead 3.jpg
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2020
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  5. bgmacaw

    bgmacaw Friend of Leo's

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    I did something like that on a 2 string cigar box guitar using the volute method. The headstock is oak the the neck is a carved poplar square dowel. It seems to have worked OK. I sold it about 2 years ago and the buyer hasn't mentioned any issues with it.

    2stringheadstock.jpg
     
  6. aadvark

    aadvark Tele-Meister

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    and you glue 'wings' on the side of the headstock as well?
     
  7. tubegeek

    tubegeek Tele-Afflicted

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    I think the "conventional wisdom" would be that you'd have excessive grain runout on the second piece as compared to the typical way of cutting a headstock. and that that might be weaker. I*think* the glued-on ears would go a long way towards making that a non-issue.
     
  8. guitarbuilder

    guitarbuilder Telefied Ad Free Member

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    I did glue on ears because the peghead needed to be wider than the glued up "paddle" was. Gibson glues ears on their pegheads in most cases that I recall with the exception of the old melody maker necks. If it's OK on a Gibson..it's Ok on one of mine. It also covers up the joint on the sides. The veneer covers up the joint on the top. The only place you'd see a glue line is on the back. You could put a veneer there if you wanted to. I don't care for the look of a back strap myself, so I didn't do that. You get to do what YOU like when you do this stuff. :).

    Here's a link to a pic of a Gibson peghead from the back.

    http://www.jrcooper.com/eguitars.htm
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2020
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  9. Caaspizza

    Caaspizza TDPRI Member

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    Thanks everyone for the replies!

    I thought of doing it this way because I don't have the precise equipment to do a scarf joint.
    I am definitely going to add the wings so the joint is covered up on the top and sides.
     
  10. Freeman Keller

    Freeman Keller Friend of Leo's

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    What you are showing will work but it is not a scarf joint and does not have the advantages of a scarf joint. Basically what you are doing as I see it is making the neck billet thick enough to do a sawn neck. The big advantages of the scarf joint besides being more economical of wood is that it puts cross grain at the weakest part of the head.

    A scarf joint is not that hard to make if you have a band saw, in theory it could be done on a table saw or by hand. The mating faces should be hand planed after you make the saw cut. The toothpick trick helps with glue up. I can point you to more if you decide you want to do it.
     
  11. guitarbuilder

    guitarbuilder Telefied Ad Free Member

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    If it isn't a scarf joint, I wonder what it's called? I don't think it's a butt joint. Maybe a variation on a lap Joint?

    It would seem to me that the two pieces would meet this definition after the angle is cut into them. Somebody call up Bruce Hoadley please.



    https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/scarf joint

    Definition of scarf joint


    : a joint made by chamfering, halving, notching, or otherwise cutting away two pieces to correspond to each other and securing them together after overlapping (as by gluing, bolting, riveting, welding, brazing)


    Other choices may be lap or splice joint variations too.
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2020
  12. Mahogany

    Mahogany Tele-Meister

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    What?
    Seriously, what?
     
  13. Marn99

    Marn99 Tele-Holic

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    I think they are talking about strength at the peghead transition. A neck like the one the OP pictured at the top of the thread would still have the grain runout at the transition like a Gibson.
     
  14. epizootics

    epizootics Tele-Meister

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    I was wondering about this one myself. Traditional scarf joints seem OK for a big headstock angle, but I really hate how fat into the neck shaft the glued-on piece goes when you use, say, a 7° angle.
     
  15. Freeman Keller

    Freeman Keller Friend of Leo's

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    A scarf joined head to the neck shaft (which is the way I will define it for this discussion) has two big advantages in my book over a sawn neck as Gibson, Martin and so many other do it. It is much more economical of wood - you can use a single 7/8 by 2-1/2 or 3 inch board to make your neck with almost no waste, and you do not have short grain in the weakest area of the neck where we think of the "Gibson break". It has other fabrication advantages - you can do a bunch of shaping of the head (if I'm doing a slotted headstock I always cut the slots before gluing the head to the shaft). There are two ways to do the joint - either with the head under the neck stick or on the end of it - both have their advantages. Scarf joined heads only apply to angled headstocks and while the angle doesn't matter I've built jigs to make mine at the more or less standard of 16 degrees.

    I built my early guitars with sawn necks and I've repaired more than I care to think about (fortunately not mine). I switched to scarf joints a dozen or more guitars ago and I'm always proud when someone runs their finger along the joint.

    I could show you these until the cows come in

    IMG_2012.JPG
    IMG_4857.JPG

    IMG_3386.JPG

    IMG_3411.JPG

    IMG_1355.JPG

    Seriously
     
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