Gretsch honey dipper square neck info

[authorizedbootleg]

Hi all, I am relatively new to resonator guitars. I play a Gretsch Bobtail square neck mostly tuned GBDGBD this has a spider bridge. I wanted to try steel/brass bodied resonator and recently bought a Gretsch honey dipper square neck guitar. I bought this second hand and it was delivered with strings slack. I tuned this up to my normal tuning GBDGBD and it sounded terrible. I looked at the bridge and the the bass string side was down lower (not level) I took strings and resonator cover off to look at the cone which was collapsed on the bass side of the bridge. I got in touch with the seller who said it was alright when sent to me and it was me tuning to GBDGBD tuning with quite heavy gauge strings that has collapsed the cone. Shouldn't these guitars be tuned to this tuning ? My Bobtail with spider bridge is fine with it ? Being new to this type of cone / bridge any info etc would be appreciated

 

[dented]

First of all, welcome. Secondly how long did you wait before messing with the guitar after it was delivered? I've had guitars totally messed upon delivery but I let them assimilate themselves to normal temps and environment and they were much easier to work with. One of the biggest PITA was a resonator.

 

[Happy Enchilada]

I recently switched to 11-52 (light top heavy bottom) Ernie Balls for my steel-body resonator and it plays SO much better. A friend who is a dobro wizard encouraged me to do this. Suddenly I'm bending notes behind the slide more, etc.
So you might try that going forward after you get the cone replaced on this one.

Also, you may try a different open tuning. I like Open G and Open E and sometimes Open D.
Whatever tuning you go with, it's like learning a foreign language.
I'm in the process right now of figuring out where some of the cowboy chords I have been using in G and D for 50+ years are on the fretboard in Open G. Not as much fun as it sounds (teaching old dog new tricks).

I traded a guitar I wasn't thrilled with on my roundneck Dean steel-body resonator (the plain one).
It's an amazing instrument.
But then, every Dean I've owned has been thus.
I got down in the weeds trying to figure out how to electrify it, which is a complex problem with resonators.
Then I found a YouTube video with a dobro expert who was discussing how to do this.
He started out by saying that it's often smarter to just NOT install electrics in a resonator and use a mic.
I did this for decades with an acoustic ...
So I might just do that. Ockham's Razor: The simple solution is always the best.
Meanwhile, I loves my plain Jane Dean!

 

[guitar_paul1]

Yes, welcome.
Unfortunate situation you've got there.

What gauge strings?

You might find a discussion of this topic here:

Gretsch G9202 sounds like poop - Discussion Forums - Reso Hangout

www.resohangout.com

Or even better, here is your exact model under discussion:

Gretsch Honey Dipper

I bought a G9202 on eBay practically unused for 1/2 price and liked it so much I bought a G9201 as well (new). I like them both, but the problems started on both when I changed the strings. The string holes in the tailpiece on both are too small. I eventually managed to get all of the strings...

www.gretsch-talk.com

 

[authorizedbootleg]

First of all, welcome. Secondly how long did you wait before messing with the guitar after it was delivered? I've had guitars totally messed upon delivery but I let them assimilate themselves to normal temps and environment and they were much easier to work with. One of the biggest PITA was a resonator.

Hi, Thanks for your reply. It was left for quite a few hours before I had the time to tune it up and try it.

 

[authorizedbootleg]

I recently switched to 11-52 (light top heavy bottom) Ernie Balls for my steel-body resonator and it plays SO much better. A friend who is a dobro wizard encouraged me to do this. Suddenly I'm bending notes behind the slide more, etc.
So you might try that going forward after you get the cone replaced on this one.

Also, you may try a different open tuning. I like Open G and Open E and sometimes Open D.
Whatever tuning you go with, it's like learning a foreign language.
I'm in the process right now of figuring out where some of the cowboy chords I have been using in G and D for 50+ years are on the fretboard in Open G. Not as much fun as it sounds (teaching old dog new tricks).

I traded a guitar I wasn't thrilled with on my roundneck Dean steel-body resonator (the plain one).
It's an amazing instrument.
But then, every Dean I've owned has been thus.
I got down in the weeds trying to figure out how to electrify it, which is a complex problem with resonators.
Then I found a YouTube video with a dobro expert who was discussing how to do this.
He started out by saying that it's often smarter to just NOT install electrics in a resonator and use a mic.
I did this for decades with an acoustic ...
So I might just do that. Ockham's Razor: The simple solution is always the best.
Meanwhile, I loves my plain Jane Dean!
View attachment 1045072

Thanks for your reply. I will bear in mind using 11 -52 strings on it when the cone is replaced. I am used to my Gretsch bobtail square neck which has a spider bridge and seems to be able to handle heavy gauge strings with no problem. With the honey dipper it doesn't have the spider bridge to support the bridge. It does seem a lot of pressure bearing down on the cone.

 

[authorizedbootleg]

Yes, welcome.
Unfortunate situation you've got there.

What gauge strings?

You might find a discussion of this topic here:

Gretsch G9202 sounds like poop - Discussion Forums - Reso Hangout

www.resohangout.com

Or even better, here is your exact model under discussion:

Gretsch Honey Dipper

I bought a G9202 on eBay practically unused for 1/2 price and liked it so much I bought a G9201 as well (new). I like them both, but the problems started on both when I changed the strings. The string holes in the tailpiece on both are too small. I eventually managed to get all of the strings...

www.gretsch-talk.com

Hi, I use 16 to 56 resonator strings. I would guess the strings that were on it when it arrived were quite heavy gauge also. The seller suggested that I shouldn't have tuned it to GBDGBD with heavy gauge strings as that was what collapsed the cone ?

 

[guitar_paul1]

Gretsch site says it comes with 12 to 53.
Seems like changing to 16 56 and tuning to high G might indeed cause cone collapse.

Stringjoy Guitar String Tension Calculator

The Stringjoy Guitar String Tension Calculator is the easiest and best tool to build the perfect balanced tension set of strings for your guitar or bass.

tension.stringjoy.com

Calculator indicates it would up the tension by like 30%.

Might also cause neck to bow but I guess on a squareneck who cares...
My suggestion is chalk it up to a semi expensive lesson, replace the cone and enjoy the guitar. By all accounts, they're good guitars.

No way to resolve whether you did it or original owner did it.

By the way, if you're careful, replacing the cone on one of those is pretty simple. Stew Mac has good instructional videos.

I have owned a 9200 Gretsch boxcar for a couple years and after a few minor setup tweaks I am very happy with it.

 

[authorizedbootleg]

Gretsch site says it comes with 12 to 53.
Seems like changing to 16 56 and tuning to high G might indeed cause cone collapse.

Stringjoy Guitar String Tension Calculator

The Stringjoy Guitar String Tension Calculator is the easiest and best tool to build the perfect balanced tension set of strings for your guitar or bass.

tension.stringjoy.com

Calculator indicates it would up the tension by like 30%.

Might also cause neck to bow but I guess on a squareneck who cares...
My suggestion is chalk it up to a semi expensive lesson, replace the cone and enjoy the guitar. By all accounts, they're good guitars.

No way to resolve whether you did it or original owner did it.

By the way, if you're careful, replacing the cone on one of those is pretty simple. Stew Mac has good instructional videos.

I have owned a 9200 Gretsch boxcar for a couple years and after a few minor setup tweaks I am very happy with it.

That's interesting ,thanks. Lots of different cones around ,some very cheap, others very expensive. Maybe someone that has found a good cone for a honey dipper square neck will give a reply ?

 

[guitar_paul1]

This looks like an interesting thread for your quest:

Gretsch Honey Dipper Replacement Upgrade Cone

I've been looking for a 9.5" replacement biscuit cone, biscuit and saddle for my Gretsch Honey Dipper. I've read a few things here about the National 'Hot Rd' and that's what I was I thinking too. But I've read threads talking about a height issue about whether the National would fit or not. I...

gretsch-talk.com

 

[W.L.Weller]

Gretsch site says it comes with 12 to 53.
Seems like changing to 16 56 and tuning to high G might indeed cause cone collapse.

Stringjoy Guitar String Tension Calculator

The Stringjoy Guitar String Tension Calculator is the easiest and best tool to build the perfect balanced tension set of strings for your guitar or bass.

tension.stringjoy.com

Calculator indicates it would up the tension by like 30%.

I'd just like to highlight what @guitar_paul1 mentioned here about the tension increase, specifically on the lowest pair of strings. Standard sets of guitar strings were designed for standard tuning. A set of strings designed for "even tension" tuned to GBDGBD might look like 40, 30, 24, 17, 13, 11 low to high. Not sure if there are retail options for individual strings in your neighborhood, but you could approximate a set like that by using the low strings from an 8-38 set and the high strings from an 11-52 set.

I'd definitely not want to tune a .056" wound string up to the G that's found on the third fret of the sixth string on a guitar in standard tuning.

 

[Oscar Stern]

Stringjoy Guitar String Tension Calculator

The Stringjoy Guitar String Tension Calculator is the easiest and best tool to build the perfect balanced tension set of strings for your guitar or bass.

tension.stringjoy.com

I'd just like to highlight what @guitar_paul1 mentioned here about the tension increase, specifically on the lowest pair of strings. Standard sets of guitar strings were designed for standard tuning. A set of strings designed for "even tension" tuned to GBDGBD might look like 40, 30, 24, 17, 13, 11 low to high. Not sure if there are retail options for individual strings in your neighborhood, but you could approximate a set like that by using the low strings from an 8-38 set and the high strings from an 11-52 set.

I'd definitely not want to tune a .056" wound string up to the G that's found on the third fret of the sixth string on a guitar in standard tuning.

Why not drop the tuning down a Minor Third?

 

[Oscar Stern]

I use 7-38 Gauge strings but tuned up a Minor Third from Open E to Open G Terz Tuning (G, D, G, B, D, G) so I could have a Resonator 25.5 in scale Alto Guitar.

 

[Oscar Stern]

The 16-56 Gauges are really meant for Low Bass DGDGBD Tuning (also D Standard: D, G, C, F, A, D). They could be tuned E-E but I'd have to shorten the Scale Length from 25.5 inches to 21.5 inches like a Martin Terz Guitar.

 

[bottlenecker]

The 16-56 Gauges are really meant for Low Bass DGDGBD Tuning (also D Standard: D, G, C, F, A, D). They could be tuned E-E but I'd have to shorten the Scale Length from 25.5 inches to 21.5 inches like a Martin Terz Guitar.

.016-.056 sets are for open G (GBDGBD) dobro tuning on squareneck guitars that can handle the tension.

 

[Dave Hicks]

Never had any problems with Pearse 16-59s on a Boxcar (9200), but I tune to Delta G (DGDGBD).

D.H.

 

[Deeve]

I've got the round-neck version of the Gretsch metal-body reso, also acquired at a mark-down, due to a visually troubling (but functionally meaningless) neck repair.
So far, I've just used conventional acoustic guitar strings (13-56 "medium") and fooled around w/ string height via nut-lift for slide and via truss-rod adj for fingers.
Some minor fret-leveling to do at #13, but what business do I have up there anyways?
Peace - Deeve

 

[Oscar Stern]

The Tuning chart inside the package says so (G, B, D, G, B, D from Low to High) & it's basically a Perfect Fourth below the English Guittar. Also they used a 24.625 inch scale length (roughly the same scale length as a Gibson SG), that's a bit shorter than 25.5 inches which means the tension is less. I think for this particular Gretsch Resonator Guitar, I'd drop the tuning down a couple semitones like maybe a Minor Third so it's E, G#, B, E, G#, B.

 

[Bob Womack]

I have a round neck Honey Dipper Special that had a cone collapse. Long story short, I bought a Beard cone and had it installed and all is well. Long story: HERE for all about the guitar and HERE for the calamity and recovery. In th process, you've got yourself a piece of industrial art in the old cone.

Bob

 

[Tricone]

I have been using D'Addario EFT13. 016-.056 strings on my Mule tricone for over 3yrs. now. Tuned to open D the majority of the time. I do play in Open G and standard tuning also.
Never had any issues. The easiest and best playing guitar I have ever owned.