"Gibson Says Self-Tuning Guitars Are Here To Stay"

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by Bongocaster, Jul 3, 2015.

  1. boris bubbanov

    boris bubbanov Tele Axpert Ad Free Member

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    They gotta say those words. Why, if they didn't say those words or words equivalent to that, that'd be tantamount to admitting the existing self-tuners are going to be discontinued any day.

    I don't think you can gather anything really about what they're saying. Gibson's talkers were in a situation where they had absolutely no choice as to what they could say, really. Gibson has done 100,000 things to piss me off, and this insistence at this time that they have not failed, for the record, doesn't change anything.
     
  2. moosie

    moosie Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Good point, Boris.

    Okay, so re-reading into that, I guess the tuners are on their way out :D
     
  3. boris bubbanov

    boris bubbanov Tele Axpert Ad Free Member

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    Aha.

    The whole scheme (and NOT just the e-tuners) is how Henry J intends to make life miserable for the Chinese counterfeiters. Because IMO these new offerings are different in much more than just the goofy tuning machines. If you are or were a counterfeiter, you can either reproduce some of the "Vintage" models or you can fire your workers and go on vacation for a while. Gibson was once an "easy" target and now it is a fugitive target for the fake-makers. They don't know whether to tool up for flat necked guitars with yucky nuts, or not.

    Other than the abrupt withdrawal of the Jimi Hendrix Gibson model line, a Gibson guitar is what Henry J says it is. Maybe his market research uncovers evidence that the "loyal actual buyer" will buy no matter what, and us "sometimes buyer/used buyer/complainer-moaner types" don't generate enough profit for Henry to care what we say or do.
     
  4. moosie

    moosie Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    That's what pisses me off, though. I would buy from Henry, if only the product was anywhere near what it should be. I don't prefer to buy used like many of you guys. I feel driven to it because of over-the-top pricing, and now because the guitar has been ruined.

    Henry's plan may backfire. He's singlehandedly blown up his company, and increased the value of secondhand pre-robot Gibsons.
     
  5. Itwang

    Itwang Tele-Meister

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    To me there are actually two Gibson Companies, Gibson Acoustic in Bozeman, and Henry's hot mess in Nashville.

    Gibson Acoustic is making world class guitars for competitive prices. Henry's hot mess is making really overpriced eye candy that is as impractical as it is expensive. Stay outta Bozeman Henry..................
     
  6. clintj

    clintj Friend of Leo's

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    For the record, I'm against the new "innovations". My tastes run to conservative and vintage in my gear, and the no-load tone control in my Tele is about as modern as I get. I really wish the new Les Pauls were made as nicely as my 12 year old ES-335; that's the best electric I've ever owned.

    Can you imagine the discussions if the internet and this forum existed when CBS bought Fender, and especially when the first run of solid state amps came out?
     
  7. MDMachiavelli

    MDMachiavelli Tele-Afflicted

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    I would be extremely surprised if it did.
     
  8. boris bubbanov

    boris bubbanov Tele Axpert Ad Free Member

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    From a distance, it sure seemed over the last decade that Henry J just has done one disastrous, ill advised, calamitous thing after another.

    And yet, I see no convincing evidence he's inflicted any permanent damage to the brand. There's something about the Gibson brand that makes people who want one make allowances for the insults and the improprieties and the inanities. It is like the brand is covered in Teflon, and Henry J can do essentially anything and he'll be forgiven quickly enough for it.

    In every large family, Grandma has a favorite and sometimes the favorite plays by the rules and sometimes he's a rogue, or worse. The more you remind Grandma that her grandbaby is a lying rascal, the more she digs in her heels and cements her love for that grandbaby. This is losing cause, hoping that Henry J can mismanage this company into the loss of his position.

    The world is Not Fair. Meanwhile, some nascent businessman who is everyone's true friend and volunteers long hours at Church and he makes one small mistake and he goes to jail. Or he gets diagnosed with late stage terminal lung cancer. So. I'm resigned to the fact that Henry J is a bum, has made mostly bad decisions for quite some time, would be a total bore to have a beer with, and is liable to outlive a heck of a lot of nicer people. Because the crazy features on these new Gibson models is really nothing new for him.
     
  9. JayJ

    JayJ Tele-Afflicted

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  10. supersoldier71

    supersoldier71 Tele-Holic

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    Fender had its CBS period, Harley Davidson had its AMF years. These things are finite. In H-D's case specifically, they may be a "lifestyle" brand to some extent, but they also figured out how to engineer and manufacture well-made, reliable motorcycles that people do actually ride. Henry J is finite: whether he cashes out and moves on, or dies in his office, I think the Gibson brand will survive him.

    I own one Gibson, two Epiphones and a Kramer re-issue (made in the Epiphone plant), but I certainly won't be buying any Gibson electrics anytime soon.

    If I buy a Gibson, it'll be used until Henry either leaves or dies.
     
  11. moosie

    moosie Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Been on my short list for some time. I've nearly gotten over the headstock. :rolleyes:

    When I bought my (used) ES-330 last fall, I was in the market for a Heritage. Leaning towards a 175-equivalent. I hesitated because I was reading about differences in construction affecting tone. Maybe it was the 175/575, maybe it was 335/535 models, I can't recall, but Gibson is of course laminated maple/poplar/maple. Heritage is solid, carved maple. While that's really cool, the comments I read consistently said, or implied, that it would be a mistake to buy a Heritage, thinking of it as a direct Gibson replacement. They sound different.

    That said, they're so tempting. Construction looks phenomenal (from a distance, I've never held one). Down to the same quaint fingerboard binding technique, resulting in nibs covering the fret ends. I love that.

    The result in this instance was that there weren't enough Heritages to readily choose from; I had some concern over tone (more known vs unknown than anything); and I have slight but real hesitation over the headstock.

    Sure, straight pull headstock is a better design, but based on what I grew up with, they're not graceful IMO. PRS comes closest in a straight-pull 3x3. That alone isn't a reason to not buy a great guitar. But it does make me ask this critical question of myself:

    If I buy this (insert guitar here, say Heritage 575), will I be done, or will I still, and forever, have a Gibson 175 on my GAS list.

    I'm not sure, but I fear the answer would be that I'd still forever want that Gibson.

    I asked the same thing when I bought the Martin OM over the Eastman, though that seems less of an equal comparison.

    Henry should be thrilled, of course, with this kind of brand loyalty.

    When I hear "brand loyalty", I think "sucker". I have no feelings for Gibson the company. It's all about the product. The higher end guitars are very well known quantities for me -- "benchmarks". I'm a conservative boomer, and just want to buy the guitars I didn't get to buy when I was a teenager.

    Of course, those reissues are very pricey today. But that's okay. I feel Fender's CS and PV lines are reasonably fairly priced. Especially the PV (at the usual sub-MAP pricing found ... all over). And while Martin's pre-war Marquis line reissues (V=vintage) aren't cheap, the quality is beyond compare.

    Gibson Historics and archtops are right up there, in terms of quality, and being representative of their era. But Henry's taking advantage on the pricing. He's not trying to make a living over the long term (Martin). He's trying to make a killing in the short term. He's publicly peeing in the punchbowl, and then serving.

    So I bought my lightly used ES-330 -- perfection itself. Got to permanently cross one off The List. I would have preferred to buy new, at a reasonable price. Instead, Henry got nuthin' from me, and that's how it's going to stay.
     
  12. Bongocaster

    Bongocaster Friend of Leo's

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    They are going to put the robo thingy on the acoustics next is what the official Gibson line is.:(
     
  13. greytop

    greytop Tele-Holic

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    "...self tuning guitars are here to stay"....on the wall at Guitar Center
     
  14. 61fury

    61fury Friend of Leo's

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    Like how the governments put all that weirdness on money.
     
  15. moosie

    moosie Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    That would be the Les Paul hologram. Not easy to counterfeit, and no one wants to.
     
  16. gpasq

    gpasq Friend of Leo's

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    It doesn't leave any marks at all. I like the neck. Couldn't care less about the nibs. The nut's not bad, we'll see if it lasts, but for the moment, I prefer it.
     
  17. MrTwang

    MrTwang Friend of Leo's

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    Just saw this...
     

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  18. tecelaster

    tecelaster Tele-Meister

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    Ooh, I want one now! Does it fire rockets out the headstock?
    Nah, only joking, of course.
     
  19. john_cribbin

    john_cribbin Tele-Afflicted

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    Just sounds like a great marketing plan to sell more Epiphone's .....
     
  20. maxvintage

    maxvintage Friend of Leo's

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    I'm not a Gibson guy and haven't been following this, but there are so many things wrong with the idea of auto tuners

    First, tuned to what? Any experenced guitar player knows that you can't get a guitar in tune in all keys--you need to retune for key changes. It's just a fact of tempered tuning.if you are a studio guy, you're used to retuning to suit the key and the specific chords. So right away the makes the autotuned guitar useless for some kinds of work.

    Second the biggest weakness of gibsons has alwasy been the headstock/neck transition, where you have a thin neck and a tilted headstock and a truss rod nut. Adding weight to the back of the headstock is a recipe for more broken headstocks. This might work ona fender but I can't imagine a guitar less suited for this than a les paul
     
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