Fulldrive 3 and Korg pitch black tuner not playing together well

Discussion in 'The Stomp Box' started by kohoutec, Oct 18, 2018.

  1. kohoutec

    kohoutec Tele-Meister

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    I picked up a Fulldrive 3 on eBay recently and stuck it on my board for band practice a couple of weeks ago.
    I had the Fulldrive after the tuner, and found with the both the Fulldrive and tuner on (so signal was muted) I got a humming sound that vanished if I turned the Fulldrive off but with the tuner still muting signal.
    Last practice I stuck my cheapo Caline Pure sky in-between then, so tuner>Pure sky>Fulldrive. No hum at all with both the Fulldrive and tuner on.
    I don't get a hum with the pure sky and tuner on either.
    Can anyone explain this? I admit to not knowing that much around the intrecacies of pedals but wondered if there was a logical explanation, or do some pedals just not get along?

    It's slightly annoying as I wanted to use the pure sky after the Fulldrive as a boost (and use the Fulldrives boost to just thicken up my OD).

    Don't really want to buy a different tuner but I guess it might be the answer, going to try band mates TU-3 at next practice to see if it has the same problem with my Fulldrive
     
  2. MilwMark

    MilwMark Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Seems there's something wrong with:

    1. your patch cable on the input side of the FD3.
    2. The FD3.
    3. Seems unlikely it's something wrong with the tuner, given it works fine otherwise.

    Before anything else, try a different patch cable.

    Good luck.
     
  3. kohoutec

    kohoutec Tele-Meister

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    Sorry meant to say I tried swapping patch cables out already. I did initially blame the Fulldrive, and whilst it seems like the most likely candidate I don't really understand who the problem goes away when it's in a different place in the chain?

    It's not noisy when disengaged and tuner off, the problem only occurs in the one specific scenario.
     
  4. Guitarteach

    Guitarteach Poster Extraordinaire

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    How are you powering them?

    Daisy chain cable? Battery? Separate PSU?
     
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  5. MatsEriksson

    MatsEriksson Tele-Holic

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    Now, try the same but with batteries only.
    The FD3 works with battery too. Remove any power adaptors that runs the FD3 AND the Korg Pitchblack. As fresh batteries as they come.

    1. You do not have daisy chained your power supply to your pedals have you?
    2. You do not have "switching" power supplies do you? (ouch! qualified guess is that you do...if you have any ps).

    Because, from their manuals:
    KORG PITCHBLACK:

    Options (sold separately): AC adapter (9V, 600 milliamps) 600 mA for a PitchBlack?! huh!?
    Current consumption: maximum 30 mA. Phew! 30 mA.
    It has a 9v out, so you can use that muscular power supply to run other pedals. Whether you use this or not, we can't tell.

    FULLDRIVE FD3:
    Power consumption: max 13 mA.

    Both are 9v and minus center. 13 mA + 30 mA = 43 mA in total if daisy chaining but no big deal here. But if you use an Power Supply from Voodo or any other make, make sure this 43 mA is not the straw that breaks the camels back. While you power supply may provice 500 mA or less, or even more, make sure the total of your pedals doesn't exceed the power supplies total limit. Say all of your pedals before reached 480 mA in total, and then you latch on something that has 13mA or 30 mA on top of that, and then you are overshooting the current capactity which manifests itself as a hum. Or on some digital pedals, not working at all.

    Daisy chaining power cables are prone to start hum too. It depends on how the different pedals has grounded their chassis or not. Which you can't tell or guess by looking at the minus centre and plus centre polarities.

    So take those two pedals away and try them in isolation first, with batteries only.

    Come back here.

    But as you said:
    Yes, it can happen. It's far and between though, but now and then it happens.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2018
  6. kohoutec

    kohoutec Tele-Meister

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  7. MatsEriksson

    MatsEriksson Tele-Holic

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    Good, because this can happen (from Strymons white paper on power supplies):
    [​IMG]

    Ground loops can also be a major problem when using power-hungry digital pedals. Due to the dynamic current needs of processors, digital pedals (Korg Pitchblack is a digital pedal of some sorts) tend to demand current that often varies at audio frequencies. For well designed, properly grounded pedals, this noisy current is isolated to the power supply cable, away from audio circuits and signal grounds. When there are ground loops, however, there are multiple ground paths to the power supply. In this case, some portion of the noisy current will return to the power supply via signal grounds, injecting noise into the audio path through a process known as Common Impedance Coupling.

    You can test, try, and do the following too, with both connected:

    1. Use as long cables as possible move both of them at a greater distance:
    a) from each other
    b) from the Benton power supply.

    You may to change patch cables, and power supply cables to this. Also you can "angle" the pedals differently from each other to hear/see if there's any change in the hum. Make sure that the actual plugs of the power supply cables are the same and fits firmly in the output jacks of both FD3 and Pitchblack. But I guess this would be the same when trying it out with the other third pedal that you used.

    I don't know if Harley Benton power supply is SMPS (Switched Mode Power Supply) or not. Nothing states it either on the Thomann site. Galvanic isolation it says only.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2018
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  8. Alamo

    Alamo Doctor of Teleocity

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    I don't know about that either just wanted to say the Power Plant jr is a direct clone of the T-Rex Fuel Tank. if that is of any concern.
    [​IMG]
     
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  9. beninma

    beninma Friend of Leo's

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    I would definitely try the Tuner after the Fulldrive. I would have guessed the tuner had a buffer in it and the Fulldrive wants to be before a buffer but the Korg Pitchblack claims to be 100% True Bypass.

    If you search the forum you'll see people debate whether the tuner should go at the end or beginning of your input chain.

    I have been running my tuner at the beginning since I started playing but just switched to putting it at the end. As long as your drive pedals and such are off for tuning the tuner is unaffected and the drive pedals seem to often be a lot happier in front of the tuner.

    That's me though, my guitar holds tuning really well and I don't leave an "always on" drive on or something where I'd be annoyed at having to turn it off to tune.
     
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  10. InkStained

    InkStained Tele-Meister

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    In my experience, the FD 3 likes to have its own power supply. Even with an isolated output on a Voodoo Labs ISO 5, my FD 3 wasn't behaving. I had to get a Fulltone power supply to fix the issue.

    Kind of a bummer, because I really like the Fulldrive. A great pedal.
     
  11. bluesholyman

    bluesholyman Tele-Afflicted

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    I remember having some weirdness with an FD3 w/r/t power supply. I think it had issues when it was powered on the same line as other stuff (1Spot in this case.) Giving it is own supply seemed to help. Its a great pedal.
     
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