Found source of buzz and hum in AB763 build (a noisy power transformer!)

joulupukki

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The bad hum and buzz is finally gone in the first version of my B-Verb amps (single-channel AB763 w/ bias trem)! I finally traced it down to a noisy power transformer. To confirm my suspicion, tonight I took the Mojotone Deluxe Reverb Power Transformer that was in Mk II (version 2 of this amp) and moved it into the Mk I after cutting out a hole in the chassis for it. Turns out, the Musical Power Supplies PT330M was the source of the bad hum and buzz this whole time! Grr!

Earlier, when troubleshooting the Mk I, I found that disconnecting the 6.3V heater center tap from the MPS PT and using an artificial center tap with two 100R resistors reduced some of the hum the amp had. But it still had way too much hum and a nasty buzz with the volume knob in certain positions.

I also noticed, and finally realized again late last week, that even with all the tubes removed, I was picking up noise on the chassis as soon as I would turn the MPS PT on. The noise was pretty easy to spot using an oscilloscope connected at the input and also directly to the chassis. After doing all kinds of things to trace the buzz and hum, that was the last straw. I’ve got another Mojotone Deluxe Reverb Power Transformer on order that I’ll put into the Mk II.

It is late so I wasn’t able to really crank up the amp and test out the reverb circuit, but I’ll do that tomorrow and return to give a report on that. I’m hopeful that the reverb circuit will also be significantly cleaner than it was before.

What a journey! :)

Last week, in hopes of squelching the buzz and hum with an improved layout and grounding scheme, I replaced the cap can with some high-quality Nichicon radial caps. I moved the bias circuit off the main board. I also modified the grounding of the different stages so that they each ground to the negative terminal of the filter cap for that stage (I had good luck with that design when building Mk II). Without redoing the entire board in Mk I, I drilled a number of holes to route many of the wires underneath like I did in Mk II. It’s a bit cleaner now but Mk I is definitely my hacked-up amp. I’m just really excited to finally have this solved!

Here’s an updated gut shot of Mk I:

IMG_1906.jpeg
 

joulupukki

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Journey indeed. More like through the wringer. Congrats!
Thank you! Very happy with the direction it's going now.

I just tested out the reverb circuit. It's so good now with no extra buzzing!

I also quickly hooked it up to my resistive dummy load and on the 8 ohm output, I'm measuring 39 Vac peak to peak output with a 1kHz sine wave, 23.75 W of clean output power before it goes into distortion. I've got a 0.1uF Mallory 150 cap arriving in the mail to replace the Orange Drop I temporarily had to put in the amp (because I melted one accidentally with my soldering iron when removing the bias circuit). Once that's done I think I can officially call this amp completed.
 

joulupukki

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Tonight, since the mounting holes are the same, I put the MPS PT into Mk II. Sure enough, the same annoying buzzing is there. Matt from MPS has a couple of ideas to try, including a different mounting/bells. I may try that. But another Mojotone PT should be here on Monday as well.

Strangely, the Mojotone PT does not like the orientation of the reverb tank. The only way I can get rid of the most hum from the reverb circuit is to tilt the reverb tank so the RCA jacks are pointing towards the sky. If I lay it flat like it’s supposed to be, it hums (yes … I’ve also tried spinning it around). Weird. It’s the same issue I was having with the Mojotone PT in the amp head. Mk I resides in the combo cab and it has this problem even with the reverb tank all the way on the floor of the combo cabinet.
 

2L man

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Next time you start measuring take AC voltage readings from rectifier tube anodes. If rectifier diodes are very different then PT EM stray field comes unsymmetric and stronger and interaction with OTs come stronger.

One volt or so difference can come when often PT secondary halfs have bit different resistances. Another might come from diode difference even the rectifier is fine. If there is more than 2VAC difference and you don't have another rectifier tube to test, cross changing secondary wires can be done but same time measure halfs resistances. Sometimes their resistances are very close each other but sometimes difference is more than 10% but that should not mean much with tube rectifier which internal resistance is much more.

I have two NOS rectifiers which diodes are different so they were poor buys. I think nowadays NOS tubes have gone thru many selections and the possibility to get good, which is not very expensive, is rare. Stronger diode pass more current and it should wear out faster and possibly after 1000 hours diodes balance better?
 

joulupukki

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These are the measurements I see on the PT’s secondary wires. Seems pretty balanced. I wouldn’t think it’s the rectifier tube itself in this case since I get the same behavior for both GZ34 tubes I have and I don’t get this same behavior with the Mojotone PT.

Resistance to ground (powered off)83.2 Ohms (pin 3)76.2 Ohms (pin 5)
VAC330.5 VAC (pin 3)330.2 VAC (pin 5)
VAC after 1N4007 diode166.8 VAC (pin 4)166.9 VAC (pin 6)
VDC after 1N4007 diode177.3 V (pin 4)177.4 V (pin 6)
image.jpg
 

joulupukki

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Could this be an issue…?

On the Mojotone PT each leg of the heaters measures 3.2 VAC (at least within a few hundredths of each other).

On this MPS PT330M, one leg of the heater line measures 3.1 VAC and the other 3.2 VAC.

Probably not much to worry about? I certainly wouldn’t think that issue would introduce the static/buzzing noise.
 

joulupukki

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Big update on this whole journey...

It's NOT the Musical Power Supplies Power Transformer. I just tested the MPS PT330M power transformer in my MK II (2nd version of this amp) hooked up to my audio interface, and the MPS PT330M is just as quiet as the Mojotone PT. So, really, it's something to do with the way the first version of this amp is built (the MK I).

I don't know if it's the cheap stainless steel chassis I built, the fuse holder sandwiched between the power tubes, some other layout or grounding issue, or what. I know it's not the tubes because I swapped every single one of them from MK II and MK I and MK I still had the same loud hum problem.
 
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