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Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by Stringbanger, Feb 18, 2020.
My girlfriend’s mom had a ‘68 T-Bird that was amazing.
Her Mom wasn’t too bad either.
“Hello Mrs Cleaver” - Eddie Haskell
Read your mind...sadly No.
My recollection was, the 1965 model year GTOs were a little more 2 dr. sedans, than 2 dr. Hardtops.
I know people who had GTO trim stolen off of their stock cars, and they replaced it with Tempest trim just so the thieving would stop. The best way to check these is to check the codes off the VIN.
I mean, I know some people who had a GTO that had a cancerous body and they transferred all the good bits onto a very similar, fresh Tempest one winter - and except for a few know it alls, nobody noticed. It was hard to blame a guy, so long as he held onto it and didn't sell it (because even if he told the next buyer, that buyer would lie).
My crowd bought '66 GTOs. And for the most part the stock motors had given their lives in combat, so to speak, and had various 400s in them by the time I went away to college. Eventually they all got used up. There were I think seven guys with various GTOs, plus my buddy Rich with the 66 LeMans OHC DeLorean 6 that he meant to install a V-8 in but I can't remember if he did.
Funny enough, right after this I looked again and found photos of '65 GTO coupes, and an unverified statement that ~8100 of the >75k 1965 production run were coupes---I guess the most I coulda been was ~89% right--LOL.
Definitely check the VIN.
Prior to 1966 all GTO's were manufactured on the same assembly line with the Tempest. The original designation was Pontiac Tempest GTO. In 1966 the GTO became a separate car model, with it's own assembly line.
I have an acquaintance who is a self made GTO expert. For most of his life he bought, sold, restored, and traded in them. One of his prized pieces was an original Muncie 4 speed, still in it's packing crate. He also had a couple of engines from cars that were totaled in wrecks. One was a Judge. He sold that one for a pretty penny to a man who owned a Judge with a replacement 350 in it.
It's the GTO or '55 Stude President, for me. Both are mighty handsome cars.
Hope they sell soon and get inside out of the PA winter, such as it is this year. The North ain't kind to old metal.
Thanks for posting these.
Very cool gallery of cars!
I had a friend who did a resto mod on an old bubble fender Chevy Pick up truck. I think it was a '55 model.
This is not the truck but looks to be about the same body style as my friends.
He got the truck out of his granddad's pasture where it sat for twenty years after it lost its place in the barn. He was lucky as all the windows were intact so the exterior rust (patina really as those metal parts are THICK) was really the only issue. He took the bed off, all the fenders off, pulled the old junked motor and slapped a 350 crate motor in it with a five speed tranny. Got a new rear end, added some nice wheels, sanded the entire truck down to the metal and then decided to do a satin finish on the truck in black which made him do even more body work. He had to rewire the entire vehicle as the mice had eaten all the electrics and he had to redo the entire interior.
I asked him one time what kind of $$ he had in it. He wasn't quite sure as he basically got the shell for free, but he estimated that he had $15K+ in parts and bits. I said, "Wow not bad, you got this ride for 15 grand?". He then shook his head and said he figured he has almost 1000 hours of his time as it took him over two years to complete working a little at a time. I told him that I was thinking of doing the same thing and he shook his head and told me he was a chevy event the weekend before where a guy was selling a similar truck for $12K. My friend told me to let someone else work for $2 a hour doing the restore and then cash in when he goes onto the next build. I still remember that conversation but I still want to have a project in my garage...
My son who has passed brought his Goat over to the house one time, and said lets go for a drive. He took us out east of town pulled over and said, okay you drive, he said when you hit third gear I'm gonna do something, hang on when I do. When I got 'er going pretty good, he hit a switch, and the nitrous oxide system kicked in. It was unbelievable, low gear acceleration in third gear. I have never experienced that situation again, not even in my younger sons Corvette which has a 383 crate engine. Close, but man that nitrous oxide is some kicker. The Corvette is pretty wild though, when the Crate was dropped in a five speed was added. That crate engine make fifth gear feel like passing gear.
Yeah, Nitrous Oxide was a sure way the check and find out, if your build was really as tight as you thought it was. I never had one, but when friends put such a system in, then they realized the motor mounts and body to frame mounting, brakes and suspension were just not going to cut it. It really pulls back the curtains on the limitations of fun 40s, 50s and 60s Resto-Mods.
I sure agree with this. I have heard, various versions of this story, from so many guys. Some would say ah, I needed someplace to go to get out of the house as my daughters were fighting, or my wife was bugging me, etc.
We just go and practice some more, right? I quit fooling with older restorations ever time I tried to go and get more serious about guitar, again. Time is limited. Few are the guys with time for all of this.
I hear you. I had to pull a motor in a truck once and the only guy I knew that had a lift was an old friend of the family. I went over and used his shop, he seemed to enjoy shooting the breeze while I worked. He mentioned one day that he and his wife were celebrating their 40th wedding anniversary. I was two kids in and looking at maybe either year anniversary coming up so I asked him the secret to a long marriage.
He threw his arms out at his shop and said, "this!"
I noticed later that he spent a lot of time in the shop.
So the secret to a long marriage? THE SHOP!!
It's a race to see if my Mustang, F250 or I are antiques first...I'm probably closest and the least collectible.
Sweat equity, as I mentioned in a follow-on post, is the only way to make money on these. If you're not equipped, you'll spend less buying one that someone else restored.
In 64 and 65, the GTO was a Tempest with specific options. It didn't become a separate model until 66. The GTO was available as a convertible and as a coupe (two-door).
First rule- if you are thinking of "doing this" and even considering the $ value when finished, forget about it now.
the only reasonable excuses are basically so you can "get the closest to what you want" "done the way you want" with the pride of I did it myself"
90% never get far into it without realizing its a far more labor and money intensive project than they ever imagined.
Most lose interest. It sits and usually gets sold far from any stage of completion. Or sits and deteriorates to a complete loss in value. A rare few get semi completed and repeat above cycle. An even rarer few get completed and of those, one often realizes it isnt really what they wanted, or worse- "now I am too old to enjoy it"
Its amazing what a small percentage the few you see cruising around enjoying their work represents.
Now.... Imagine after all those hours, you have an object you fear to park anywhere and cringe at thoughts of someone who might so much as touch it.... The fun is minimized.
Trust me. I know.
Now, all that said-
Good news on the Goat example is most GTO specific parts are avail in top quality reproductions.
if the Goat were confirmed legit. And-
If it was a southwest low rust car-
the asking price would be an easy grab. No questions. Even with a missing motor/trans.
as it stands, even if a legit Goat, if its a PA region car its probably a matter of almost buying nothing but a title and vin plate.
Even then, for some people, its worth it. If thats your thing.
Again. Finished resale value? Novelty question only. Forget about it.
Example. I have a 67 Mustang GT fastback that I have owned for 43 years. I have pretty much rebuilt it from scratch 4 times over the years and it may happen again yet. Estimated investment over time? About 8 times what I could hope to sell it for.
I've got a 69 Alfa Spider I drove back from Texas in '85 or so. Wife at the time wanted me to sell it because we were starting a family and a two seater just ain't practical. I told her I'd paint it first and we'd make more money, my evil plan was tear it apart so it wouldn't sell and keep it for a restoration project when I got older.
Well . . . . .
I'm 55 now and I've hauled that damned thing around all these years through a couple of divorces. I'm not going to restore it.
Finally decided to sell it for whatever it's worth as is and just buy a decent running BMW Z3. Wanted one when they first came out and they're cheap now. Like under ten grand, which would be a drop in the bucket on a restoration.
That T-Bird is calling me... my first car was a '66 T-Bird.
My current fun car is the exact opposite: a vintage Miata!
Porsche guy here. I've owned all kinds. My current one: "78 SC Targa