Finish on Vintage Blonde Ash Telecasters.

[Digiplay]

I have always wondered about the finish on vintage blonde Telecasters


On a side by side comparison of a blonde ash 50's RW and a blonde ash AVRI 52, the AVRI 52 top blonde finish seems more transparent, and you can see the grain of the wood through it, whereas the RW top blonde finish looks more like a solid paint color, and you don't see the grain of the wood like on the AVRI 52, just the outlines of the grain.

Did vintage 50's/60's era blonde Telecasters have a white primer undercoat, and if so, it would have been impossible to see the actual grain through a solid primer, just the outline of the grain

If so, does that mean the RW blonde finish is more accurate than the AVRI 52 blonde finish?

 

[EsquireOK]

There were at least three different ways that the blonde finishes were applied in the classic Telecaster era.

The first had a clearcoat that yellowed quite a lot, and quite rapidly. This is the classic black guard look.

The next yellowed a lot less. This is the classic white guard look.

The one after that was more opaque. This is the classic ‘60s Tele look. Sometimes it’s hard to tell it apart from Olympic White.

None of these changed exactly at the points I mentioned. They are just associated with those generations of Telecaster.

And none of them used primer.

 

[Rufustelestrats]

This was fenders replication of the white guard translucent blond. It is just dark enough in the middle to see just some grain. The edges are more opaque and looks like a white burst.

 

[Digiplay]

There were at least three different ways that the blonde finishes were applied in the classic Telecaster era.

The first had a clearcoat that yellowed quite a lot, and quite rapidly. This is the classic black guard look.

The next yellowed a lot less. This is the classic white guard look.

The one after that was more opaque. This is the classic ‘60s Tele look. Sometimes it’s hard to tell it apart from Olympic White.

None of these changed exactly at the points I mentioned. They are just associated with those generations of Telecaster.

And none of them used primer.

When did Fender start using the primer EsquireOK?

 

[Rufustelestrats]

They always used fullerplast regardless of the color, but unless it is a metallic color there is not a general use of primer. The reuse of bad paint blanks did create the paint over phenomenon but not used on the light translucent colors.

 

[Digiplay]

So which finish is more accurate, the blonde ash RW 50's or the blonde ash AVRI 52?

 

[Rufustelestrats]

Both per the period produced.

The butterscotch is accurate up until late 52, then it became more white blond. Look at the tele Vince Gill has or many others from 52 till about 65

 

[EsquireOK]

When did Fender start using the primer EsquireOK?

Never on blonde...or else it wouldn't be blonde, but just "white."

Neither of those finishes you are asking about are "accurate" recreations of what any of these guitars looked like when they were new. And both have urethane sealers between the wood and the lacquer, which is very much inaccurate for any '50s Fender.

Fullerplast started being used on everything in 1963...but even it wasn't urethane. It was a form of catalyzed varnish, but not a urethane. It's far less durable than urethane.

When new, the blonde color was pure white with perfectly clear clear coat over it. If you had sprayed it thickly enough that no wood showed through, it would have been a pure white. But there was a very slight amount of warmth that came from the color of the wood peeking through. Any other colors you see on "real" ones are the result of lacquer yellowing over time.

The most accurate as-original blonde you'll get on a Fender reissue is on the AV Series '58 (produced late 2012 through the end of 2017). They nailed the just slightly warm white, the amount of grain show-through (though there was always variation), and they used a lacquer based sealer. The AV '52 blonde is too warm and too opaque. The AVRI '52 showed lots of grain (usually), but was a very intense orangey tint. The AV '64 blonde is identical to the AV '58 blonde...which is inaccurate for '64. It should have a Fullerplast sealer to be accurate, and it shows too much grain. '64 was during the period in which the blonde was usually sprayed nearly (or totally) opaquely. The Jimmy Page Mirror model is a fairly decent recreation of '60s Fender blonde: very white, without a lot of grain showing through, and a catalyzed finish as a sealer (though the J.P. uses urethane, which is not quite accurate; it should be Fullerplast).

Here's a Page, which is the closest you'll get to the '60s blonde look. And the poster above shared a picture of an AV '58, which is the closest you'll get to a '50s white guard blonde. If that '58 was a bit less opaque, and more wood grain and wood color showed through, you'd have a fairly accurate black guard era blonde. Fender has never really nailed black guard blonde in a repro, IMO.

And here is an AV '64 (same as AV '58 finish) next to a Jimmy Page Mirror. As you can see, "variation is standard" with blonde finishes. In this case, the '64 shows less grain than the Page...even though the Page is whiter.

 

[Marn99]

The original blonds did not have a white undercoat, it was clear. The original finishing schedule circa 1951 is as follows according to Leo's notebook.

Primer coat: 60:40 mix of DuPont #1362 primer with DuPont Duco #3661 thinner
Grain filler: 2:1 mix of DuPont #563 6825 natural filler mixed with DuPont #200 thinner
Color coat: 60:40 mix of Harper's L-804 Blond shader mixed with #1362 thinner
Sealer coat: DuPont Duco #1991 sealer
Clear coat: 9:1 mix of DuPont #1655 clear lacquer with DuPont #3661 thinner

Again, this is how it was done in 51, and throughout the 50's if my memory serves me correct, but don't quote me on that part. The reason why you see the change to white blond in 54 is because DuPont started to add more and better UV inhibitors in their lacquer, so called "water white" or "water clear" lacquer. The earlier stuff is the same, it just yellows much more over time. The best way to replicate a blond finish, in my opinion, is to make a modern adaptation of the original finishing schedule. The biggest mystery of the original formula, and one of the most important parts to replicate, is of course the color coat. We currently know very little about the Harper Stain and Lacquer Co. and the products they made other than that it was based in South Gate, CA and got bought out in the 70s, according to George Fullerton, the stuff was a milky white color. I've seen a 1:9 mix of opaque white lacquer and clear lacquer used as a substitute to great effect. As for Fullerplast being used as a sanding sealer, that didn't start until around 63, before that in the late 50s and early 60s, they used a oil based (as in petroleum, not natural oil) sealer called Homoclad, which is still made by Sherwin-Williams, though the formulation has almost certainly changed. Fullerplast was a conversion varnish, and it could be used as either a sealer or a clear coat. Rickenbackers after 1958 are actually finished using Fullerplast for that glossy clear coat.

 

[Digiplay]

Both per the period produced.

The butterscotch is accurate up until late 52, then it became more white blond. Look at the tele Vince Gill has or many others from 52 till about 65

Please forgive my not fully understanding your response Rufustelestrats


Are you saying the RW finish (it looks more like solid paint) is more accurate for a Tele made up until late 52, and the AVRI 52 finish (a little more transparent) is more accurate for Tele's made after late 52?

 

[Rufustelestrats]

The butterscotch was a result of the top finish and the color coat turning yellow and creating what we call blonde. They formula changed about Nov-December 52 where they used a different more uv friendly nitro finish and the blond under coat was more white, less yellowy. So the originals were more yellow, after late 52 until the 60s they were white burst looking with translucent edges and more transparent middle to the finish. The 60s introduces mostly opaque finishes to hide any imperfections in the wood.

 

[Rufustelestrats]

The 58 I posted has much more grain showing but the camera will not capture it as the white overwhelms what the camera can see. I have adjusted this one to emphasize what my eye sees, but it shows like this in normal light.

 

[cbnutt]

Ok so the 52 real blackguards we see today didnt start as yellowish but just as white as the latter ones we see that are still white today ? The switch in the clearcoat was what stopped them from turning to the yellow we see today when looking at a real 52 ?

 

[Rufustelestrats]

@cbnutt yes. I have seen original black guards that did not look like TV yellow JRS from gibson, but for the most part over time they have turned darker. Here is a shot of a broadcaster showing the shadow of the pickguard, and the color change.

 

[Rufustelestrats]

I forgot to mention that the reissue broadcaster seems lighter than the AO or the AV 52 teles.