Explain hype surrounding Fender Princeton

[toanhunter]

the princeton is a studio staple for a reason, they sound perfect in a mix, it just gets the job done, but it also has enough headroom to play reasonable size gigs it's a bit more powerful with projection on stage than a champ. I like princetons with a G10 alnico gold speaker.

 

[srblue5]

I already answered on this a while back but I'll circle back...

I wrote before that I sometimes have struggled with getting a good sound out of my PRRI. It can be a bit finicky to set -- with the stock 10" speaker, it flubs/farts out at too high a volume, sounds too thin/lifeless at too low a volume, and doesn't play nice with all overdrive pedals -- but golly when I set it right, it's my favourite sounding amp. And all at a pretty reasonable volume.

I've come to accept its quirks over time. It's raspier/snottier than a Deluxe Reverb or bigger Fender amps. Cleans are not as lush as larger amps. It doesn't have enough headroom in certain settings. But it sounds great at relatively lower volumes -- great for recordings or modern quiet-stage gigging -- and captures a great '50s rock 'n' roll/blues vibe that no other currently available non-Custom/limited run Fender amp I've come across does so well.

If I want something louder, cleaner, smoother (overdrive-wise), I have other options.

To put it in perspective, I'm planning on using my Tonemaster Deluxe Reverb for a few upcoming gigs this summer because it's the amp that will consistently deliver. But I'm trying to figure out if I could get away with bringing the PRRI instead for at least one of those gigs because it's more fun to use.

 

[Jazzy-Will]

Super interesting post! I have the Tweed Guitar center FSR with the Celestion G12-65. I went to a GC and I played both. I was going to buy the Bordeaux, but I decided to sleep on it. When I went back (a day or two later at most) the Bordeaux had been bought by someone else.

I love the Tweed version but your post sure makes me wonder "what if". FWIW I am not sure I thought the Bordeaux version looked better, but I definitely think I slightly preferred the way it sounded. Both were great though. IIRC the Jensen is more vintage correct?

There is an argument to be made that a Fender combo doesn’t sound like a Fender combo without a Jensen or Oxford. I don’t know if that’s true, but I will say that’s it’s a much better sounding amp with the Jensen C12n.

 

[Maguchi]

Why do YOU like your Princeton or Princeton Reverb?

I am interested in knowing why you select this amplifier over other similar amplifiers in terms of tone and volume. Why the Princeton?

It güd amp.

They're a great size and power range for filling a room at home with sound.

The circuit has sweet high frequencies and classic midrange. At higher volumes the beautiful compression is apparent and the amp easily starts to overdrive with a clean boost. The 10 inch speaker is detailed and full.

Yep. The Princeton Reverb is just the first step up the Fender line that both has great tone, clean and driven, and is full-featured. It has everything in a small package. Oh, and by the way, the tube bias trem on the Prince kicks the opto trem on the larger Fender amp's butt.

Sehr gut!

 

[SnidelyWhiplash]

There is an argument to be made that a Fender combo doesn’t sound like a Fender combo without a Jensen or Oxford. I don’t know if that’s true, but I will say that’s it’s a much better sounding amp with the Jensen C12n.

An amp sounds great with whatever speaker one desires. The smaller Fender combos usually didn't have Jensens as OEM & the less said about Oxfarts, the better. Use whatever speaker makes your ears happy.

 

[scelestus]

There is an argument to be made that a Fender combo doesn’t sound like a Fender combo without a Jensen or Oxford. I don’t know if that’s true, but I will say that’s it’s a much better sounding amp with the Jensen C12n.

An amp sounds great with whatever speaker one desires. The smaller Fender combos usually didn't have Jensens as OEM & the less said about Oxfarts, the better. Use whatever speaker makes your ears happy.

In general, I agree with Jazzy-Will if only because having multiple amps gives you the benefit of keeping OEM speakers and experiencing them with all their quirks. In other words, I don't know if Fenders sound better with Jensens or Oxfords, but to me they sound more like classic Fenders.

Still, Snidely Whiplash is not wrong. One of the best sounding amps I've played was a special edition PRRI with a Celestion Gold. So if something works for you, rock it.

 

[Uncle Daddy]

There is an argument to be made that a Fender combo doesn’t sound like a Fender combo without a Jensen or Oxford. I don’t know if that’s true, but I will say that’s it’s a much better sounding amp with the Jensen C12n.

I put a c12q in mine. Low sensitivity and not heavy in the low end. Perfect.

 

[Uncle Daddy]

 

[Recce]

many famous and great songs were recorded with said amp. those sounds are familiar and better than the champs we mostly grew up with. so, we can conjure a recognizable, known good sound, in a small house friendly box and that is easy to carry, not too loud and won't frighten the animals. What's not to like?

This. Mine sounds great. No problems.

 

[toanhunter]

In general, I agree with Jazzy-Will if only because having multiple amps gives you the benefit of keeping OEM speakers and experiencing them with all their quirks. In other words, I don't know if Fenders sound better with Jensens or Oxfords, but to me they sound more like classic Fenders.

Still, Snidely Whiplash is not wrong. One of the best sounding amps I've played was a special edition PRRI with a Celestion Gold. So if something works for you, rock it.

yes, the speaker really matters a lot! I love alnico golds.

 

[Hey_you]

I like em so much I own two! (I keep one at my Mom's place for when I visit) 12" Celestion G12-65

 

[Jared Purdy]

I've had four: 2 PRRI, one original 74' Silverface and one 64' Hand Wired PR, which was by far the best of them all. I bought all of them for the same reason, and ended up selling them all for more or less the same reason. The first one I had I replaced the speaker with a Celestion Gold as I just couldn't stand the "flab" when the volume was turned up. However, I loved the size, weight and the built in tube reverb and tremolo. Ultimately I sold it as even with the speaker swap, it still flubbed out.

These purchases were over a period early in my electric guitar playing, so I guess you cold say I was "chasing tone". After trying out other amps (Mesa Lonestar Special and a Swart AST Master Mk II), I came back to the second PRRI, for the same reason as I bought the first one: size, weight and the features. I figured this time though, I'd just leave it alone. I got rid of the Mesa due to never being happy with the ridiculous array of controls and the weight. I will give it this though, the clean on that amp, is sublime, and the reverb is fantastic. The Swart is a mid-heavy amp that in as much as it's very well made, it has a mid bite that botherer my hearing.

The same time I had the second PRRI, a friend gave me his 74 Silverface which wasn't working. I replaced all of the tubes and had the speaker re-coned as it was torn and some work done by a local amp tech. In the end, both it and the second PRRI were sold for the same reason: flabby sound. I found the bass very unstable in both of them. All three of those PR's sound great at relatively low levels. That's what the PR is known for: tone, not volume or OD.

After mucking around with a couple of other amps (another Swart and a Blues Jr.), they both got sold and I was literally amp-less for several months. It was cathartic, I have to say. Well to be fair, I have Roland Blues Cube, and that's what I used for several months (it's got it's application, and it's not worth selling).

Cue the pandemic, and I was on the prowl again. I heard about the 64' Hand Wired PR and had a chance to check one out, new, right out of the box. However, I had heard via the grape vine to look for another speaker as the Jensen was described as ice picky and shrill, something that I'd say was an issue with both of the PRRI's that I had. I decided to go with an Eminence GA10 SC64, which was designed by George Alessandro with Eminence specifically for a PR style amp. That amp pretty well sealed the deal and the speaker swap did the trick. The tone was the best of any of the amps that I had mucked around with. It's still not an amp that does OD well, at least on its own, but a pedal can easily solve that problem.

As the pandemic appeared to be not going anywhere in a hurry, and we were all virtual prisoners, I decided to alleviate my boredom with another amp purchase, something that I had often wondered about, but never tried: the Fender Custom Deluxe. There was one store in the entire greater Toronto area that had one, new, though a floor model. Supplies were running out and there was no date on the horizon when new stock would be available. As soon as I plugged in, I knew I had found another tone to fall in love over. I was, and remain mystified at the interaction between the inputs. What appears to be so simple, apparently is not, at least to this amateur picker with zero knowledge of electronics.

Placing the two of them side by side, I named them Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. The PR of course is Jekyll, and the Deluxe, is Hyde. After some time, I realized that I was playing with Hyde far more than Jekyll. The monstrous tone out of the Deluxe is something on its own. It has a fullness that is way beyond the PR. I decided that in as much as I liked just about everything the 64' hand wired had, there was no point in keeping both as I don't gig, and I don't want to have two amps in the living room, where I like to pick, so the PR was put up for sale. As the pandemic raged on and there were no 64's available anywhere, I was able to sell it for the same price I paid for it.

It's been a journey, and I totally get why the PR is an enduring amp, in spite of its limitations: tone, tone, and tone. It's a grab and go amp, and takes pedals well, at least in my limited experience. It's got two on board, tube driven effects, eliminating the need for those pedals. I have read, and I'm not sure if it's true, but it is apparently the most used amp in recording history. That says a lot. There's also a tremendous amount of history, cache, and mojo in it, which is why so many people still buy it spite of there being clones out there that might be cheaper and better made - though I can't imagine there would be something better than the 64 hand wired with the GA10 SC64. Cheaper maybe, but not "better".

I highly doubt I'll be going for a fifth, as I have found the tone I have been lusting after. The deluxe is like a less refined, simpler, older "brother" to the PR. That being said, the PR is not an amp that I would bash, and I totally get why so many people gravitate towards it. My $.02 worth.

This is an old thread that keeps popping up, so I thought I'd add an update as I can't edit my old post: I did buy another 64 hand wired PR. One came up used on a local buy and sell and the price was too good to not take advantage of. That was about two years ago. True to form, I changed the speaker in it to an Eminence GA10 SC64, my preferred speaker for that amp.

More time with my three electric guitars (LP, Strat and Tele) and with the two amps (PR and tweed Deluxe) and I've come to better appreciate what they do when paired with each other. In as much as I love my LP, it's mid heavy (compared to a Tele or Strat) and when paired with the Deluxe, at least in my home setting, the mid punch is too much for my ears and setting. I mix them up from time to time, but my preference with the LP is reinforced every time I plug it into the Deluxe. I prefer the sound of it with the PR. The Strat and the Tele work well with either amp, but with the Deluxe, they both seem to have more punch. Also, and conveniently, I leave the PR and the LP in the living room on the main floor of my house, and the Deluxe and the Strat and Tele in the basement.

 

[cyclopean]

it may be bad for th

I just bought my fifth ( a Custom 64' Hand Wired - my second one). Clearly I need to keep it in the coral.

e fish.

 

[68goldtop]

Hi!

I like em so much I own two! ...

Me too



cheers - 68.

 

[Telecaster1954]

I’ve two also but both non-reverb. I’d rather have one of both…..

One is a really clean, all original 1966 while the other is a 1970 all original except the baffle and grill which got replaced for unknown reasons. I bought it for $350 around 2008 or so.

 

[Grandfunkfan]

I fell for the hype. It was supposed to be the holy.grail for cleans and low wattage for managing volume. Reviewers mistook cleans for bright. The cleans were o.k. but not anything special. The 10 inch speaker wasn't any help either. Some how it managed to have a flubby bottom end that you could not turn down enough. It needed mids, but didn't have a mid control and the biggest issue was no master volume. I should have known just by looking at the e.q. layout, but I really liked the idea of a small amp I could crank. With no master volume I couldn't control the volume and even when I did, I didn't get any tube saturation anyway, don't know what the deal was there, small transformer maybe. IMHO the blues jr is a far more useful amp and overall just a more versatile better sounding amp. I've been playing Fender amps since the late 70s and this was easily the least practical amp I've had. I'm sure it's a good pedal platform but what's the point of paying for a premium and and then have to throw a bunch of pedals at it?

 

[dukewellington]

I fell for the hype. It was supposed to be the holy.grail for cleans and low wattage for managing volume. Reviewers mistook cleans for bright. The cleans were o.k. but not anything special. The 10 inch speaker wasn't any help either. Some how it managed to have a flubby bottom end that you could not turn down enough. It needed mids, but didn't have a mid control and the biggest issue was no master volume. I should have known just by looking at the e.q. layout, but I really liked the idea of a small amp I could crank. With no master volume I couldn't control the volume and even when I did, I didn't get any tube saturation anyway, don't know what the deal was there, small transformer maybe. IMHO the blues jr is a far more useful amp and overall just a more versatile better sounding amp. I've been playing Fender amps since the late 70s and this was easily the least practical amp I've had. I'm sure it's a good pedal platform but what's the point of paying for a premium and and then have to throw a bunch of pedals at it?

Mistaking high freqs for cleans, that’s a good observation.

For me, an amp isn’t doing “clean” unless it can also be quite loud at the same time. At least my Princeton Reverb cannot do that.

The flub — that’s almost in the Princeton handbook. An EQ pedal and possibly a new speaker help, but I also feel like the two controls for bass and treble are enough for me to find the amp’s middle freqs just fine. I roll back the treble quite a ways when I play, though.

 

[Uncle Daddy]

I fell for the hype. It was supposed to be the holy.grail for cleans and low wattage for managing volume. Reviewers mistook cleans for bright. The cleans were o.k. but not anything special. The 10 inch speaker wasn't any help either. Some how it managed to have a flubby bottom end that you could not turn down enough. It needed mids, but didn't have a mid control and the biggest issue was no master volume. I should have known just by looking at the e.q. layout, but I really liked the idea of a small amp I could crank. With no master volume I couldn't control the volume and even when I did, I didn't get any tube saturation anyway, don't know what the deal was there, small transformer maybe. IMHO the blues jr is a far more useful amp and overall just a more versatile better sounding amp. I've been playing Fender amps since the late 70s and this was easily the least practical amp I've had. I'm sure it's a good pedal platform but what's the point of paying for a premium and and then have to throw a bunch of pedals at it?

And when you do finally get any breakup, it's all blatty.

 

[keithb7]

I have owned a few. I had a ‘73 or so that had the magic. I traded it for an original Blonde Vibrolux.
I kept my 6G3 clone that I built. Its wonderful but not quite enough when jamming with the boys. My 100W Marshall takes over then. I had a brand new PRRI that I put a 10” speaker in. It was good in smaller venues but left me longing as it seemed lacking. Perhaps building my own PR is my next one.