1. Win a Broadcaster or one of 3 Teles! The annual Supporting Member Giveaway is on. To enter Click Here. To see all the prizes and full details Click Here. To view the thread about the giveaway Click Here.

Ever leave in a few clams? Avoid the perfection trap!

Discussion in 'Recording In Progress' started by burntfrijoles, Apr 12, 2021.

  1. burntfrijoles

    burntfrijoles Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    8,357
    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2010
    Location:
    Somewhere Over The Rainbow
    One of the downsides of digital recording is that you can become obsessed with seeking the “perfect track.” It’s a trap. Don’t let perfect be the enemy of good!
    I spent the better part of 4 hours today trying to lay down the Entwistle bass to “Substitute” for a backing track.
    It’s not that difficult but I’m a crappy bassists and the transitions are tricky at 140 BPM. I punched in to correct glaring spots but I left in a few :eek: or :oops: notes. They’re buried in the rough mix I created. Anyone paying attention could spot them but they aren’t worth anymore time/effort to fix. I can5 notice them when I play so why bother?
     
  2. EsquireOK

    EsquireOK Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    5,262
    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2011
    Location:
    U.S.A.
    It's not about the recording media used. It was no different with tape.

    One of my favorite almost-falling-apart guitar solos is in this song. He almost falls off the cliff at a few points. But it sounds great in the end – like it's bursting forth so furiously that he can barely keep it together...but he does. It's that great "playing right on the edge" feeling.

     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2021
  3. Axegrinder77

    Axegrinder77 Tele-Afflicted Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    1,593
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2019
    Location:
    Springtown
    It's the slight "flaws" that make things sound good, sound human.

    Rick Beato did a John Bonham analysis video, far from "perfect."

    I'll take Bonham over a drum machine any day!
     
    Skydog1010, MilwMark, drewg and 4 others like this.
  4. Skully

    Skully Doctor of Teleocity

    Posts:
    13,025
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2003
    Location:
    Glamorous NoHo
    Clams? Never. Imperfections, looseness? Hopefully.
     
  5. Digital Larry

    Digital Larry Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    2,893
    Joined:
    May 30, 2017
    Location:
    Silicon Valley, CA
    I meant it to sound like that! ;)
     
    Maguchi, drewg and burntfrijoles like this.
  6. GoldDeluxe5E3

    GoldDeluxe5E3 Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,429
    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2015
    Location:
    Concord, California
    Did anybody say "Clams"?
    [​IMG]
     
  7. Manual Slim

    Manual Slim Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    3,216
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2017
    Location:
    Up around the bend
    My style is based on outright quahogs.
     
  8. burntfrijoles

    burntfrijoles Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    8,357
    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2010
    Location:
    Somewhere Over The Rainbow
    I had to look that up!
     
    Alamo and Manual Slim like this.
  9. Rich_S

    Rich_S Poster Extraordinaire Gold Supporter

    Posts:
    5,003
    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2006
    Location:
    Potsdam, NY
    I learned pretty quickly that soloing tracks and listening for perfection will drive you nuts. "Good" is good enough, and the minor imperfections you hear in a soloed track disappear in the mix.

    If a mistake or clam or whatever is obvious in the mix, THEN you need to fix it.
     
    drewg, stinkey, Telecaster88 and 3 others like this.
  10. still_fiddlin

    still_fiddlin Friend of Leo's Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    2,914
    Joined:
    May 6, 2009
    Location:
    Texas
    I would never finish a mix if I had to fix everything I could hear. Listening to those over and over build character :)
     
  11. DwaynHarris

    DwaynHarris TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    13
    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2021
    Location:
    St Louis mo
    I don't have a choice, leave them in or don't get it done.
     
    Maguchi, drewg, eddiewagner and 5 others like this.
  12. studio

    studio Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    7,927
    Joined:
    May 27, 2013
    Location:
    California
    Besides, nobody really cares about imperfections
    or inclusions in the songs they're listening to.

    Take JJ Cale albums. Not the best production
    value around, but damn, those songs are gold!

    Besides, people want to hear tidbits of the room
    or people chattering etc. The Beatles did it,
    and it made the music much more inviting.

     
    Digital Larry and DwaynHarris like this.
  13. Alamo

    Alamo Doctor of Teleocity

    Posts:
    12,216
    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2006
    Location:
    Berlin
    Clams can blend right into linguine and make a perfect dish.:)

    but if you, or anyone else, roll their eyes each time one gets to the offending min:sec: mark :rolleyes: that's when it needs to be fixed.
     
  14. burntfrijoles

    burntfrijoles Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    8,357
    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2010
    Location:
    Somewhere Over The Rainbow
    Again, it can’t be overstated: don’t let perfection be the enemy f good.
    I bet I have dozens of unfinished recordings because I nit picked them. Now I only create backing tracks for covers but I try to make them good enough to be used at a gig 3ven though I don’t perform.
    I stopped nit picking my efforts a while back and I completed a much larger share of my projects. When I play over them it’s hard to find the mistakes. A lot of small “oops” can get buried in the mix.
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2021
    Maguchi, Digital Larry and studio like this.
  15. GoldDeluxe5E3

    GoldDeluxe5E3 Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,429
    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2015
    Location:
    Concord, California
    There's an actual recording of a guy giving birth to a clam in Lou Reed's famous "Heroin". If you want to hear it, listen starting at 4:40. The moment of birth occurs at 4:47. The song would not be the same without this clam.
     
    lathoto likes this.
  16. ElJay370

    ElJay370 Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    51
    Posts:
    1,682
    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2018
    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    The king of clams....

     
  17. drmordo

    drmordo Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    46
    Posts:
    1,048
    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2019
    Location:
    Miami, FL
    That's one of the things I love about Ian Astbury - on every Cult album there's one moment where his voice just collapses under the strain.

    My recordings are probly too human. I'm not interested in perfection.
     
    Coffeemutt and drewg like this.
  18. SuprHtr

    SuprHtr Tele-Afflicted Silver Supporter

    Age:
    64
    Posts:
    1,181
    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2019
    Location:
    Rocket City
    I heard that the Name Traveling Willburys originated during recording. "We'll bury it in the mix"
     
    sleekpicker, srblue5, drewg and 2 others like this.
  19. JRapp

    JRapp Tele-Holic

    Age:
    63
    Posts:
    729
    Joined:
    May 20, 2019
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    I know a guy who records 6-7 solos and then splices the parts where he didn't screw up. He is incapable of playing a decent solo in one pass in the studio or live. You have to develop the skill of organizing and executing a good solo and you usually have some time (minutes? 15 seconds?) to do that on stage or in the studio. The occasional clam is all part of the deal and may even be a fortuitous thing.
     
    studio likes this.
  20. Skully

    Skully Doctor of Teleocity

    Posts:
    13,025
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2003
    Location:
    Glamorous NoHo
    Damn, that would probably be me, too. I mean, sure, I probably play the solo through fine at times, but I'll likely still comp it to get the optimum nuance of each musical moment.

    Playing a solo all the way through without screwing up is very important live, but in the studio, not so much. If your ambition is to be a studio musician who is expected to deliver in the moment, every time, you'd better be able to deliver those one take solos in the studio. If your band is on the clock in a studio, it's good, too, but I'd wager you that most solos you hear are pretty heavily comped. The same goes for lead vocals. Splicing different takes also promotes looseness and helps create the illusion of spontaneity, if it's done correctly.

    All that matters is the end product. People listening won't care if it took you 15 minutes or 15 days.
     
    Alamo and studio like this.
IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.