Enough nonsense! Let's see those 12 strings.

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by Otis Fine, May 7, 2020.

  1. jhundt

    jhundt Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    66
    Posts:
    12,267
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2003
    Location:
    Netherlands
    that is exactly the guitar that I play every day, the one that stands next to my seat at the table. The one that makes me want to play everything on a 12-string.

    It was hanging on a wall in a house in Durgerdam where I worked, many years ago. I retrned to the house several times to do more work, and the guitar never moved. One day I mentioned this to the owner, and he said "that old thing? Nobody plays it, why don't you take it?"
     
    Otis Fine likes this.
  2. archiemax

    archiemax Tele-Meister

    Age:
    68
    Posts:
    401
    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2016
    Location:
    Phoenix AZ
    [​IMG]

    Still got both of these; the electric hasn't been out of its case for years & I forget what Japanese brand it is....Lyle or Ventura or something. Bought it cheap as a fixer, nobody wanted to buy it on Ebay so I kept it. Switched out the stock pickups for railbuckers with series/parallel switches on the upper bout; still got the originals around here somewhere. The acoustic's a top-of-the-line Yamaha from way back when with "rosewood" (laminate) body. I put a piezo & EQ setup in it & it's got Martin silk & steel strings. Another picker I know liked it so much that I found another identical Yamaha & fixed it up like mine. He loves it.
     
    Otis Fine likes this.
  3. jguitarman

    jguitarman Tele-Afflicted Silver Supporter

    Age:
    65
    Posts:
    1,718
    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2003
    Location:
    No CA
    IMG_1760.jpg This is my Mosrite Celebrity from the mid "60's. Its all original and has very low action which for me makes it very playable. I love to see the reaction from other musicians who played in that era and remember Mosrite. I have an older musician friend who came to a rehearsal where I played this guitar. He commented that he painted guitars for Mosrite back in the day and very likely painted this one.
     
  4. fakeocaster

    fakeocaster Tele-Afflicted Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    1,721
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2003
    Location:
    Enniscorthy, Ireland
    IMG_0340.jpg
    Had a great one years ago and foolishly sold. I recently replaced it with this Sigma
     
    Otis Fine likes this.
  5. Thorby Bislam

    Thorby Bislam Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,452
    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2011
    Location:
    North Yorkshire
    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]
    A pawn shop find from cash converters. It is a new guitar, so new that the protective film on the pickguard was still there. Not a mark or ding on it. Top is solid wood. Maple I think. either that or it's a good veneer job. Back/sides are probably laminate, not well up enough on woods to be sure. It's a chinese made budget model of course but how else would I get a new 12er for £40? Plays fine, lots of jangly 12er goodness. Not too much bottom end for a dread, I think the top end drowns it out.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: May 9, 2020
    Otis Fine likes this.
  6. Dreadnut

    Dreadnut Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    65
    Posts:
    1,510
    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2019
    Location:
    Grand Rapids, Michigan
    I had the Granddaddy of 12 strings, a 1980 Guild F-512. Bookmatched Indian rosewood back & sides, AAA bookmatched Sitka Spruce top, all the deluxe inlays and accoutrements, sounded like a Steinway; I regret selling it but the neck was so wide it caused me pain in my fretting hand especially on barre chords.

    [​IMG]
     
    santos, telemnemonics and Otis Fine like this.
  7. JDB2

    JDB2 Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    491
    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2017
    Location:
    Arizona
    Ok, I posted pics of my Rick 610-12 yesterday at #61. Here is my 360-12.

    IMG_7444.jpg IMG_7456.jpg IMG_7453.jpg

    It is a 1998 model to which I've made a number of modifications for playability, serviceability, and tone.

    These mods help capture the tone of a "vintage" Rick: Rick toaster pickups, flatwound strings, and a push-pull tone pot that engages a cap acting as a high-pass filter on the bridge pickup. The vintage-style toaster pickups are different from the stock hi-gains in that they have alnico magnets and fewer winds, resulting in lower output but more treble harmonics for an airier sound. Hi-gains are nice pickups, particularly on 6-string Ricks IMO, but they simply don't sound as bright and jangly as the old style ones. The cap inserted by the push-pull pot was present on 1960s Ricks and results in a shrill, anemic sound when the bridge pickup is played alone (IMO), but when both pickups are together it sounds awesome. The neck pickup provides the warmth (dial it in and out with the 5th knob) and the cap produces a phase shift that gives a slight comb-filter effect, resulting in extra shimmer. Flatwound strings sound warm, yet bright, with less "clang" than the stock round wounds. With these mods, the modern Rick sounds as close as you can get to the vintage ones, although it still isn't a 100% match, because, IMO, the vintage Ricks have thinner, X-braced tops instead of the modern thicker tops. The fact that older Ricks have 22 fret necks rather than the modern 24 might make a difference too, because the 22 fret neck allows the neck pickup to be further from the bridge. Most of these changes phased in during the late 60s, early 70s, but I've read that the X-bracing persisted longer, maybe into the early 80s?

    The other mods are the "harp" tailpiece and the tune-o-matic bridge. Both of these pieces are drop-in replacement parts from Winfield Vintage. The harp tailpiece makes restringing easier than the original "R" tailpiece. This is important because the slotted headstock, while great looking and easy to tune, makes restringing a Rick 12 a PAIN. The harp eliminates one source of frustration from the process because it is easy to insert the strings into the holes and they stay put in the tailpiece while you thread them onto the tuners And IMO the harp makes the tone a little more bright and lively than the "R".

    The tune-o-matic bridge is much more stable than the spindly Rick bridge, resulting in a more bell-like tone, and makes intonation setting much easier because the screws turn more easily. I have tune-o-matic bridges on both of my Rick 12s and also my 360-6 and I'm very happy with them. However, the bridge still has the disadvantage of having only six saddles. I tried to install a Rick 12-saddle bridge but my tech couldn't make it work for various reasons. That said, usually intonation isn't a problem with six saddles on a Rick 12 if you use the string gauges recommended by Rick and included with their replacement string sets; experimenting with other gauges caused an intonation nightmare for me. And I have achieved the best intonation yet using the flatwound strings, which are a custom Thomastik Infeld set from Pickofthericks.com.

    Also, I've installed the new-style nut, available from Rickenbacker, which spreads out the string courses for less-cramped chording. That, coupled with flatwounds, very low action and a very straight neck, has made for a VERY playable 12-string.

    And of course I use a lot of compression when I play the 12 string. My compressor is a Wampler Ego, which includes a tone knob allowing me to boost treble for extra jangle.
     
    santos, jhundt, Otis Fine and 4 others like this.
  8. Ronzo

    Ronzo Tele-Meister

    Age:
    68
    Posts:
    303
    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2016
    Location:
    South Florida, USA
    I also have two, currently - an Epiphone DR-212 (an excellent instrument that punches way above its price range, IMO), and a Dean Boca 12 for electric needs. The Dean has humbuckers, and is voiced differently than I prefer. That said, it’s a great value at its usual asking price, and it gets the job done with appropriate amp settings.

    The 12-string that I wish I never let go is this Danelectro:
    A7C3F718-F3A6-4C7B-8225-429F4F23EC4E.jpeg

    If I could afford a Rickenbacker 12, I’d prefer the model Tom Petty had - a 620, maybe? Even though the sound I hear in my head is a 330/360.
     
  9. JDB2

    JDB2 Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    491
    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2017
    Location:
    Arizona
    The Rick 12 with Tom Petty on the famous Damn the Torpedos album cover belongs to Mike Campbell and its a model 620 (solid body) that happened to be a prototype. Tom Petty's Rickenbacker signature model is basically a 660, which is similar to a 620 with vintage toaster pickups and wider neck. A lot of people seek out 660s for the wider neck.

    When I've seen Tom Petty in concert and in all the pictures I've seen he has played the semi-hollow body models like 330s or double-bound 360s, all seemingly vintage models. I've never seen him actually playing a solid body Rick like his 660 signature model. Rickenbacker made his signature model a 660 to look like the 620 on the album cover even though the 620 on the album cover didn't belong to Petty and it isn't the model he typically played.
     
    Ronzo and Otis Fine like this.
  10. muudcat

    muudcat Tele-Holic Silver Supporter

    Posts:
    883
    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2010
    Location:
    Fountain City, Wi
    I had a '66 335-12 Gibby for a while and you're right they were a tight neck, probably as tight the Ric I have
     
    Otis Fine likes this.
  11. adjason

    adjason Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

    Posts:
    4,992
    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2010
    Location:
    virginia
    I've got a 70's Guild 12 string. I play it about 10% and a 6 string about 90% but it is a cool guitar and it unlocks some songs as I try to write
     
    aadvark and Otis Fine like this.
  12. jhundt

    jhundt Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    66
    Posts:
    12,267
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2003
    Location:
    Netherlands
    oh oh oh! That Yamaha is a thing of beauty.
     
    Otis Fine likes this.
  13. jhundt

    jhundt Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    66
    Posts:
    12,267
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2003
    Location:
    Netherlands
    interesting! Did he make/have this made special?
     
    Otis Fine likes this.
  14. jhundt

    jhundt Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    66
    Posts:
    12,267
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2003
    Location:
    Netherlands
    I can't remember a session where I did NOT play a high-strung Nashville tuning. In the SF Bay Area, very few guys were familiar with it.
     
    telemnemonics, Otis Fine and Skub like this.
  15. Mosstone

    Mosstone Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    182
    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2018
    Location:
    I only know my speed
    This is the Rickenbacker 330/12 I owned about 12 years ago. Looked gorgeous, sounded good, but the narrow neck and string spacing made it impossible to play for me (and I have 'average' size hands). I also didn't like that they put the octave strings below the heavier strings, and the lighter strings constantly broke on this guitar... I think I only owned it for about 6 or 7 months before I sold it.

    RicEdit.jpg

    After that, I went without a 12-string until I built this last year:

    12tfullangrsz.jpg

    chameleon 12 body rsz.jpg

    It has a "chameleon" or "flip-flop" paint job that transitions from dark blue to purple, depending on how the light hits it. I had the PG made out of clear acrylic, and back-painted it in "Champagne Gold" (like Rickenbacker used to do).

    The neck pickup is a GFS Retrotron "Nashville", which are supposed to sound like Ric single-coils, and the bridge pickup is a GFS "Li'l Puncher". My original plan was to put the matching Retrotron in the bridge position, but I couldn't find a Tele HB bridge plate that had holes for both string-through and top-loading. I went with the Li'l Puncher because I don't think single-coils and humbuckers work particularly well together.

    chameleonrsz.jpg

    This was probably my most demanding build ever, and it's still a work in progress, but I like it a lot better than the Rickenbacker.
    I mostly want to replace the tuners. I bought these because they were the lightest ones I could find (I was worried about neck-dive with the thinline body), but I don't like the BIG white plastic tuner buttons. I have since acquired a set with smaller, nickle-plated buttons, but I haven't gotten around to installing them yet (I'm waiting for the strings to need changing before I do that).

    12-chameleoon headstock.jpg
     
  16. rocking rooster

    rocking rooster Tele-Holic

    Posts:
    538
    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2011
    Location:
    Somerset UK
    Hi JDB2, love both of your Ricky 12s, particularly the 610/12. Back in the 80's I had a 330/6 in Mapleglow with all black hardware like yours. It seems to be quite a rare combination, particularly on my side of the pond.
    Just for your information, on the filmed gig Live From Gatorville, Tom used a 660/12 for one song, American Girl, the last number of the night. On all the other songs as you say, he used a semi-hollow 330 /360.



    I'm also sure I've seen another live clip with him playing a 660/12 with Mike Campbell also on 12 string with a different model Ricky. I think the song was Listen to Her Heart but I'm not totally sure about this.
     
    JDB2 and Otis Fine like this.
  17. Mid Life Crisis

    Mid Life Crisis Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    5,064
    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2007
    Location:
    Cambridge, England
    I have two.

    The electric is an Italia Rimini. This is a superbly-built instrument and amazing for the price. I have modded it a bit by making a new nut so it can be strung Ric-style with the octaves below. It also has Thomastik Infeld flats that have been on there since 2015. It hardly ever goes out of tune.

    The other mod it has is a result of an accident I had with it after a gig. I leant it up against my car whilst packing up and it fell down. I didn't play it for a couple of weeks but when I did it was out of tune and the action was high...you guessed it, the neck had come off. The guitar isn't worth much so I tried to glue the neck in but it came out again. In the end I converted it to a bolt-on to hold the neck in place (don't shoot me) which it has done for five years.
    IMAG0570.jpg

    My other is this beautiful Takamine (I can't remember the model number!). So easy to play, sounds lush and again stays in tune wonderfully.

    _20180516_140603.jpg
     
    P Thought, jhundt and Otis Fine like this.
  18. backporchmusic

    backporchmusic Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    4,577
    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2006
    Location:
    USA
    I'd love a Ricky but it's not in the budget. Instead I got a 2018 Epi Riviera. It's a limited edition, not all retailers have/had it but it's not a rare thing. No fancy pickups or anything, just a basic Chinese Epi 12 string. But it plays and sounds great.

    20200511_104733.jpg
     
    Jlwctn, santos and Otis Fine like this.
  19. matmosphere

    matmosphere Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,021
    Joined:
    May 27, 2015
    Location:
    earth
    Hey OP, did you grab one? Those Dano’e aren’t too expensive ;)


    that sounds like an issue with the user not the instrument.
     
    El Marin and Jlwctn like this.
  20. Otis Fine

    Otis Fine Tele-Afflicted Silver Supporter

    Posts:
    1,052
    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2016
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    @matmosphere - Before I started this thread I had never heard of Nashville tuning. Since I really only want a 12 string for recording purposes and because I just happen to have a surplus of guitars, I’m going to try that and see if I like it.
    If I don’t, I’ll buy a Mosaic pedal.
    If that doesn’t do it for me THEN I’ll consider getting a 12 string or two.
     
IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.