Downsizing to One Car

CharlieO

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Well excuse me! Let me know how it works out for you next time you get delayed during a snowstorm in sunny Florida. In the meantime, I'll stick with my PZEV. Gees I tell ya. Peace. I'm outta here.
Read the numerous studies that have been published since the news media created that nonsense about getting stuck in an EV in a snowstorm. I believe that we have discussed this before, so I will go no further. Getting stuck in an EV in a snowstorm.
 

boris bubbanov

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I can't believe that "there just aren't enough charging stations around yet for us to be comfortable with that" unless you are taking frequent long trips into rural Minnesota or the surrounding states. Plugshare says that there are 1228 charging stations in Minneapolis-St. Paul-Bloomington. Consider how many will be available when you are ready to get rid of that Civic. And if you live in a house rather than an apartment or condo, you can easily charge at home and may never need a public charging station.

Having said this, I have been driving plug-in hybrids for the past 10 years. I don't see the sense in buying a "conventional" hybrid when plug-ins are available. I drive almost 100 percent electric, and have only driven 18 miles on gasoline since January 1.
See my comments below. Apologies.
 
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BigDaddyLH

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Having said this, I have been driving plug-in hybrids for the past 10 years. I don't see the sense in buying a "conventional" hybrid when plug-ins are available. I drive almost 100 percent electric, and have only driven 18 miles on gasoline since January 1.

I wish I had found a plug-in RAV4 when I bought the hybrid, but they were as rare as hen's teeth.
 

boris bubbanov

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I can't believe that "there just aren't enough charging stations around yet for us to be comfortable with that" unless you are taking frequent long trips into rural Minnesota or the surrounding states. Plugshare says that there are 1228 charging stations in Minneapolis-St. Paul-Bloomington. Consider how many will be available when you are ready to get rid of that Civic. And if you live in a house rather than an apartment or condo, you can easily charge at home and may never need a public charging station.

Having said this, I have been driving plug-in hybrids for the past 10 years. I don't see the sense in buying a "conventional" hybrid when plug-ins are available. I drive almost 100 percent electric, and have only driven 18 miles on gasoline since January 1.
I can believe it. Because, for us at least, that's the whole rationale for owning motor vehicles. To drive across the USA and Canada and camp and hike in weird places and leave the I-phone home or turned off and find the things out there that websites cannot tell you about. When you use liquid fuel, you rely on that fuel and basically nothing else. When you use electricity, you need an application to tell you where the juice is and you need to stay the course and cannot venture up Rio de los Pinos up towards the Toltec Gorge because there's almost nothing man made up there. You park the gasoline vehicle and hike from there.

Hybrids and E-vehicles are often great for commuting and other tasks in built up areas. But the best days of my last 30 years or so are spent as far away from all of that as possible.

No question, gasoline filling stations are being closed and for example, a big chunk of the Interstate from around Texarkana to Shreveport and beyond (I-49) just doesn't have enough liquid fuel service. The day may come when a fellow will need to advance research their trip if they don't carry an enabled, modern cellphone. And there's places around Las Vegas NV where gas stations are absurdly hard to find without help of some kind. But for the most part, these stations are plentiful and they release the explorer to concentrate on having a fun road trip vacation. No worries, like generations ago.
 
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BigDaddyLH

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I can believe it. Because, for us at least, that's the whole rationale for owning motor vehicles. To drive across the USA and Canada and camp and hike in weird places and leave the I-phone home or turned off and find the things out there that websites cannot tell you about. When you use liquid fuel, you rely on that fuel and basically nothing else. When you use electricity, you need an application to tell you where the juice is and you need to stay the course and cannot venture up Rio de los Pinos up towards the Toltec Gorge because there's almost nothing man made up there. You park the gasoline vehicle and hike from there.

Hybrids and E-vehicles are often great for commuting and other tasks in built up areas. But the best days of my last 30 years or so are spent as far away from all of that as possible.

Tools for the job. I rarely wore hiking boots to the office.
 

boris bubbanov

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Tools for the job. I rarely wore hiking boots to the office.
I hear you.

I'm frankly amazed by all the high ground clearance 4x4 trucks and Jeeps I see used as daily transportation. And often detailed to the point you can bank on it, these vehicles are never so much as been driven on a lawn. Certainly not on the forest and cattle tracks we like to investigate.
 

BigDaddyLH

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I hear you.

I'm frankly amazed by all the high ground clearance 4x4 trucks and Jeeps I see used as daily transportation. And often detailed to the point you can bank on it, these vehicles are never so much as been driven on a lawn. Certainly not on the forest and cattle tracks we like to investigate.

I think that's odd, too. Aren't pickups the #1 family "car" in the US?
 

boris bubbanov

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I think that's odd, too. Aren't pickups the #1 family "car" in the US?
Could be.

In some places, cars vastly outnumber trucks. On the expressways at least, as the family truck is parked until the prices come back down. People keep a car around to go to Cinco de Mayo because there won't be room for a long pickup in the parking lot. Other folks take an old pickup to The Plant because the finish on their nice Lexuses would be destroyed (with all the funk coming out of those smokestacks). Saying, people own both and sometimes drive one as opposed to the other - hard to tell anecdotally what is actually going on based on sales numbers alone.

Driving across Oklahoma on I-40 mostly, I was struck by how many "company" pickup based vehicles there are out there on the roads. When you see huge numbers of trucks being manufactured, registered and sold, don't forget how many trucks are bought by businesses.
 

CharlieO

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Hybrids and E-vehicles are often great for commuting and other tasks in built up areas. But the best days of my last 30 years or so are spent as far away from all of that as possible.
Hybrids and plug-in hybrids can go anywhere that a comparable conventional gas-powered vehicle can go, from coast to coast, across deserts and up mountains. And Rivian, Tesla and Lucid are showing that you can get "far away from it all" with no worries. In fact, in some places access to electricity may be closer than access to gasoline.
 

boris bubbanov

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I saw a trailer-full of Rivians, on I-40 in Oklahoma headed west, the other day. I personally have not seen a Lucid (even though I have been trying to spot them all road trip long and around in SoCal). What I see is a lot of hybrids and plug in hybrids, Teslas and GM's e-products, just a heck of a lot more of them now in 2022, than I saw in 2019. I've also seen Chinese vehicles around the San Jose area that I didn't know were even available for sale here. California is full of all kinds of weird cars, except incidentally no Buicks, and if the Lucids are here I should be seeing them since now is the time to drive electric there - with the price of diesel and gas so high, you'd be a dummy to leave the e-car parked and use your other ride.

What you see, depends on where you are. You can get the impression there's massive market penetration, going some places - but in the places we camp and explore, ICE is still in charge and I submit, a lot of people might be open to change but they're going to wait. And wait some more. I'm trying to just report here, not advocate one way or another in this post.
 

boris bubbanov

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Do I have this right, that Lucid only manufactured 360 vehicles this quarter?

Trying to figure out how these guys are going to explain all these setbacks to their major investor ( 62% and who shall remain unidentified here ). No wonder I haven't actually spotted one for real (and I looked in the right places, believe me).
 

imwjl

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@boris bubbanov I saw a Lucid a week ago and that was quite a surprise. Getting passed by a Rivian yesterday was less of a surprise. The limited supply is no mystery. The whole industry and news around it have discussed the battery constraint issue for a long time. Last week VW announced being pretty much sold out for the year. Tesla's vertical integration is a help but they rely on others for materials.

For things @CharlieO and @BigDaddyLH bring up. Hybrids are solid reliable vehicles that have been around a long time and in all sorts of climates. The small EV niche isn't so new anymore. There about 6 years experience is why my boss is moving to more of them. The first pickup should be here soon.

The 600 mi range and way electric motors make it all wheel drive is why some high mileage pros I know now have or are getting latest generation Siennas supposedly becoming all EV in 1-3 years.

Look at Grand Marias, MN and Lac La Belle, MI on the map. It was quite a surprise this past winter to see EVs in addition to hybrids in those places. On a March trip in Duluth, MN I was surprised by how many EV Ford and VW I saw in addition to a few Teslas.

Far north EV owners I know think it's a gasoline or diesel powered vehicle that makes less sense after having the EV but for my use north of Duluth, MN or Wausau, WI are still shy of charge options.

The EVs I'd like are still coming. The rate of build out for charge infrastructure remains strong. Some of this technology is now under the Defense Production Act of 1950. For 70+ years now we can thank that act for a lot of things we take for granted - AL alloys all over, oil pipelines, semiconductors and public health stuff too. I predict we'll be thanking it for the stuff soon. Recent additions to that act include aiding fighting wild fires and making cars.

 




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