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Do You Think a Mid Control is Necessary?

Discussion in 'Amp Central Station' started by Dan_Pomykalski, Sep 29, 2020.

  1. Dan_Pomykalski

    Dan_Pomykalski Tele-Meister

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    It depends on how the single tone knob is implemented. Most amps with a single tone control are tweed style tone controls, which I’m not a huge fan of. I’m a big fan of the single knobbed Supro Thunderbold/Big Muff tone control though.
     
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  2. Fiesta Red

    Fiesta Red Poster Extraordinaire

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    No, it’s a P-90 armadillo.
     
  3. Dan_Pomykalski

    Dan_Pomykalski Tele-Meister

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    That armadillo is a pickup? That’d need a crazy route...

    Also, how hot is that P-90? I bet you could fit an incredible amount of coil on that thing...
     
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  4. loopfinding

    loopfinding Tele-Afflicted

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    I don't like the mid control, it's too much to fuss with. What I prefer is bass and treble, and then some sort of scheme where the mids either are flat (like on most tweeds) or scooped (like on a blackface or marshall). The two-knob style non-stack in the tweed era (like in the bandmaster) will produce a scoop at some settings. On a blackface you can switch in the value of the mid resistor to something stupid like 100k to get a flatter mid response. Gets the job done and not much to think about.
     
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  5. Jakedog

    Jakedog Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Then why don’t they have any mids? I’m not being a smartass, I honestly don’t understand how if this is true, they can be so scooped out and empty sounding. Or is it just that they completely over emphasize bass and treble frequencies so it appears that they have no mids?
     
  6. loopfinding

    loopfinding Tele-Afflicted

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    The higher the resistance of the mid resistor, the less leak to ground. Like I said in my post, stick a 100k or 220k or something in there and the scoop is barely there. 6.8k is scooping a fair amount. Even Marshall and Vox scoop a fair amount of mid too. For real deal uncompensated mid you usually have to look to the 50s.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2020
  7. David Barnett

    David Barnett Doctor of Teleocity

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    The two-knob BF stack is like a 3-knob one with the Middle turned up to about "4", not maxed.

    Except on a Champ, which has larger resistor (15K) and a bit more mid.
     
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  8. Marc Morfei

    Marc Morfei Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    Maybe, but the Pro Jr and 5e3 both have a single tone control, and those amps both crank pretty good.
     
  9. loopfinding

    loopfinding Tele-Afflicted

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    the single tone is all you need for single coils, but it’s just a mudfest with neck humbuckers. count me as a hater of the BMP control though.
     
  10. Marc Morfei

    Marc Morfei Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    It's weird, I have a PRRI and I never thought it sounded all that scooped. I keep the bass & treble around 4/5 and it always sounded great to me, especially with a couple pedals in front. But just last week I got a 5e3, and holy **** it's night and day, the mids punch you in the face. I said oh, now I get it, that's what everybody means by "scooped."
     
  11. Jimclarke100

    Jimclarke100 Tele-Afflicted

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    The amp I play most is a Champ clone. I’ll have to say a mid control isn’t needed the amp; Nor is a bass; nor a treble.
     
  12. G.Rotten

    G.Rotten Tele-Afflicted

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    So let's say I have a new amp or an old amp in a new place & I want to fine tune my sound.

    With either a 2 control or a 3 control I will likely start with the tone controls in the middle of their adjustments, set the volume to what's appropriate & then start tweaking.

    If you're me odds are you want more Mid. On a 3 control I turn up the Mid.

    On a two control I turn down some Treble & turn down some Bass then turn up the volume to compensate.

    I've never owned a 2 tone amp but AFAIK that would be the process, yes?

    I haven't been actively avoiding amps that don't have a Mid control but I've never been using my Mid control & thinking to myself "Gee, I wish this was harder".
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2020
  13. Kevin Wolfe

    Kevin Wolfe Tele-Holic

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    Same here!
     
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  14. RadioFM74

    RadioFM74 Friend of Leo's

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    I'm pretty happy with the Treble and Bass of my BF amp, and even with the simple roll-off tone control on my old Epiphone amp. Actually happier than I'd be with a miss control… too many variables ;D
     
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  15. Tornado

    Tornado Tele-Meister

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    It can be usefull, and you don't have to use it. But I must say that a treble control to me is the most important. On most amps I don't feel I have to dial off or enhance the bass control or the mid control if it is there..
     
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  16. Frodebro

    Frodebro Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Leo Fender was obsessed with pristine cleans, and the BF amps were the result of this. Earlier Fenders had much more prominent midrange, but also got dirty pretty easily.

    The downside is that, although the cleans were all nice and sparkly, the guitar is a midrange-voiced instrument and taking away the midrange makes it harder for the guitar to find its place in a mix.

    I was all about scooped mids and gnarly, head banging metal tonez until I started working in a band, and that was when I discovered that the most important knob on your amp is the one labelled "MID". That is also when I discovered that less distortion is better.
     
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  17. G.Rotten

    G.Rotten Tele-Afflicted

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    Exactly!!!!

    Thank you.
     
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  18. David Barnett

    David Barnett Doctor of Teleocity

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  19. Dan_Pomykalski

    Dan_Pomykalski Tele-Meister

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    It’s largely because of how the circuit’s designed. Read Rob Robinette’s page on how the TMB tone stack works. I If you replaced the 6.8k resistor with like a 1k resistor, you’d definitely notice that there are less mids than there normally are (which seems ridiculous, I know).
     
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  20. Dan_Pomykalski

    Dan_Pomykalski Tele-Meister

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    At that point you might as well just remove the tone stack all together and just put in a single coupling cap. Once you get past like 50kish, the bass and treble controls don’t do anything anymore.
     
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