Chip in lacquer sunburst...

Discussion in 'Finely Finished' started by Engine Swap, Feb 18, 2020.

  1. MilwMark

    MilwMark Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    10,783
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2013
    Location:
    near Arnold's
    Cool. Eric, do you expect chips like in the OP to just "grow"? I have a couple old nitro beaters and my experience is they don't. I may get new chips if I bang other spots. Or they existing ones may grow if I bang them hard enough to create a new chip. But otherwise they are stable. My shop says the same thing. Curious for your take on that.
     
  2. Chunkocaster

    Chunkocaster Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    9,725
    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2018
    Location:
    In space with Ziggy
    Paint it with the same black lacquer and clear with a brush and then sand it smooth and micromesh/ polish then buff. Very easy fix and will be nearly invisible.

    Wet sanding to level and working through micro mesh makes the difference between a crappy repair and a pro repair. You could goop paint on there with your finger and it would still come up nice if levelled properly and polished/ buffed.
     
    Engine Swap and ladave like this.
  3. ladave

    ladave Tele-Holic

    Age:
    56
    Posts:
    792
    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2017
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Looks like a fun project to me.

    Those are pretty big and totally understand wanting to repair...even if you are expecting natural relicing in the future. There are chips and then there are chips.

    Wondering how well one of the lacquer pens from stew mac would work to fill it Paint looks pretty thick for nitro.
     
  4. Vibrolux59

    Vibrolux59 Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    373
    Joined:
    May 30, 2019
    Location:
    PNW

    I'm sitting in a kitchen with cabinets I built and lacquered in the mid-'70s that has been in constant use all these years and still looks great. The point is that it's all about care. I can name 30 or 40 cabinet shops in my area still shooting lacquer every day. Thousands of employees that's industry.
     
  5. eallen

    eallen Tele-Afflicted Silver Supporter

    Posts:
    1,857
    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2013
    Location:
    Bargersville/Indianapolis, Indiana
    Well, for those size chips I am guessing you didn't just "bump" it. With that in mind, anytime a significant impact happens it tends to crack the finish around which is usually what continues to flake off. Finish doesn't just "flake off". It is already cracked and continues to crack until it falls off.

    If it were mine, before I did a repair, or even if I were leaving it, I would take a very small brush and dab some lacquer thinner into the bare wood are. That will help melt any loose are back to to wood as well as micro cracks. Another option is thin CA but it can be hard to control if not used to it.

    I agree with chuckocaster. I would mix my own black lacquer and use it. Fingernail polish is assuming you don't have any lacquer.

    Eric
     
    Engine Swap likes this.
  6. Steve Holt

    Steve Holt Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,372
    Joined:
    May 29, 2016
    Location:
    Kansas
    I'm not taking sides on this one, but I'd like to see you name 30 or 40 cabinet shops in your area. Round these parts there are definitely a few. But 30 or 40 is a lot!
     
  7. fasteddie42

    fasteddie42 Tele-Holic

    Age:
    30
    Posts:
    954
    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Location:
    Tip of the Mitt

    I don't quite understand where the confusion or disagreement is.

    At no point have I said that cabinet makers don't use lacquer, I said that the widespread use of NITROCELLULOSE lacquer was moved away from i.e. the automobile industry once better alternatives were developed.

    I'm sure there are thousands of vintage style cars/hotrods/etc. still shot with NITRO because "that's where the tones is", but the fact is the overwhelming majority of automobiles are not shot with NITRO.... same with furniture and same with guitars.
     
    Steve Holt likes this.
  8. Freeman Keller

    Freeman Keller Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    75
    Posts:
    2,925
    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2018
    Location:
    Washington
    Here is a G&L that was dropped off the stage onto a gravel drive. It had damage to both sides in several places. The repair was done with multiple applications of StewMac black CA, then scraped back and polished. If I was going to do it over or had to match color other than black I would have used GluBoost. the SM CA takes forever to cure. I also should have stained the bare wood while I had a chance.

    IMG_5265.JPG

    IMG_5296.JPG

    If I had stained the damaged area it wouldn't have those two little light spots

    IMG_5297.JPG

    ps - I started to read some of the other posts but decided instead to show you how to fix your guitar.

    pps - if you are interested in pursuing this I can give more information.

    ppps - since your guitar is not lacquer I would not recommend drop filling or over spraying with lacquer whatever a cabinet maker might say. Unfortunately if it was lacquer the repair would be easy
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2020
    Steve Holt and Engine Swap like this.
  9. Engine Swap

    Engine Swap Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    145
    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2014
    Location:
    Chicago
    Hi all - thanks for the replies. Very helpful.

    There have been a few hints that the finish isn't lacquer. How can I tell?

    To the best of my memory, this was an allparts body I bought back in 1996. Pretty sure I chose a lacquer finish, but I honestly don't remember. Besides poly, what else could it be?
     
  10. Vibrolux59

    Vibrolux59 Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    373
    Joined:
    May 30, 2019
    Location:
    PNW
    Grab a Seattle phone book. (and keep in mind for every shop in the yellow pages there are a couple of more than are not) I worked in the trade for 50 years I have no reason or anything to gain by bullshitting you. You guys are funny.
     
    Steve Holt and Engine Swap like this.
  11. BorderRadio

    BorderRadio Poster Extraordinaire Silver Supporter

    Posts:
    8,980
    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2014
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    This thread got weird.
     
  12. Steve Holt

    Steve Holt Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,372
    Joined:
    May 29, 2016
    Location:
    Kansas
    Like I mentioned not taking sides. You took me wrong and that's okay but let me explain I'm fascinated by supply chains and demand for goods. When I was in the grocery business I could look and see how many cases of each product came out of my warehouse every month. Now we were a small store and part of a small cooperative warehouse, but during the spring season they were moving 1 million cases of strawberries a month! And this was just for about 800 grocery stores in the Kansas, Missouri, Nebraska area. All the while I'm thinking where are all these strawberries coming from because that doesn't even cover the needs of the giants like Walmart and Kroger who must have been moving 10s of millions of pounds of strawberries per month. It's still mind blowing.

    So anyway, when I see someone claim they can name 30 or 40 Local cabinet makers my brain starts turning thinking, who's buying all these cabinets?? I understand where you thought I was piling on, but you can take your snark back, because I certainly wasn't coming after you.
     
  13. Freeman Keller

    Freeman Keller Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    75
    Posts:
    2,925
    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2018
    Location:
    Washington
    Remove a tuner or a pickup or the trem cover (assuming there is over spray in the body). Put a drop of lacquer thinner or nail polish remover on the finish where it won't be seen. If it softens it is lacquer. If it doesn't it is pre, post pr UV cured poly-something.

    Report back
     
    Engine Swap likes this.
  14. Vibrolux59

    Vibrolux59 Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    373
    Joined:
    May 30, 2019
    Location:
    PNW

    I've dealt with cabinet shops in the greater Seattle area from Auburn Wa to Everett Wa there are far more than 30 or 40, there are 30 or 40 I have had experience with and met the management. There is a lot of wealth in this area I've had the luxury and good fortune of doing work for the Gates, Bezos, Howard Shultz, Paul Allen when he was still living and many names you wouldn't know. There is plenty of wealth in this area to support many designers, inferior desecrators, and custom cabinet and furniture makers or has been in the past 50 years. I have no idea why that would be amazing. Boeing, Microsoft, Starbucks, Amazon, Fluke, etc..it just goes on and on. I wasn't being "snarky", just being straight. I offered an informed point of view and was met with doubt. That's offensive in my world. I have zero motivation to BS the members of this forum but have encountered this before. It's odd IME.
     
  15. schmee

    schmee Poster Extraordinaire Silver Supporter

    Posts:
    9,533
    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2003
    Location:
    northwest
    Are you sure it's lacquer? Looks like poly to me. Lacquer is seldom that thick that I have seen. Poly chips like that in big chunks.
    It is possible to fix it yourself if you have patience and don't hurry. I've done it a few times.
    -Paint or stain the bare wood black, thin paint. Let it dry good.
    - Fill that thick chip with Epoxy, tape around it so you dont get it everywhere. Take a piece of wax paper and put it on wide tape. Stretch the tape over the repair so that you dont have a big lump of epoxy when hard.
    -Let it harden well. The Wax paper wont stick to the epoxy.
    -Sand, grind the excess epoxy flush. I use a dremel and small disc sometimes.
    -You may have to epoxy again to fill any bubbles or hollow spots.
    -Wet sand it smooth with progressively finer paper. Protect the surrounding area.
    -when it looks nice shiny wet, polish it with a Foam Polishing wheel (Stew Mac) and some polish like 3M Finesse It.
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020
    Engine Swap likes this.
  16. EsquireOK

    EsquireOK Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    3,384
    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2011
    Location:
    U.S.A.
    FWIW, if you’re good, you can get the touchup looking close to perfect, especially if the original finish is lacquer. Caveat: like I said, if you’re good. That’s a huge “if.” You need to use multiple thin black drop fills, with sanding after each. Then the same with clear. You finish with wet sanding to perfectly sculpt/smooth the fill, followed by a blending spray of clear over the area. Then a smoothing wet sanding pass, then a buffing of the entire body.

    If you take your time and do it right, it’ll be near perfect. If you don’t want to invest days into a perfect repair, then you can half-ass it, and it’ll probably be just fine for most people’s purposes.
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020
  17. BramptonRob1958

    BramptonRob1958 Tele-Meister

    Age:
    61
    Posts:
    133
    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2019
    Location:
    Brampton Ontario
    I get why you’re upset, the first accident is always heartbreaking!

    As others have posted, trying to correct finish and appearance issues often results in a bigger mess than when you started. Unless you’re extremely talented and don’t yet know it, the job is probably better left to a professional.

    I’ve been down this road before. I’m not saying you can’t tackle the challenge, however, you’re already told us that the chips bother you. How will you feel if the finish looks worse after you’ve gone down the DIY rabbit hole?

    On the other hand, don’t beat yourself up for the chips, stuff happens to guitars! I think it adds mojo and character! When I see Strat, Tele or Les Paul that is pristine, I assume it hasn’t been played or has been a “Case Queen” or maybe it doesn’t play well.

    When I purchased my 58 AVRI Tele, it already a few cosmetic issues like your chips. Turned out to be one of the best playing Tele’s I’ve owned.

    Our guitar idols often look like they’re playing classic pristine copies of iconic guitars, nothing could be further from the truth. Examined close up and personal you’d be shocked to see the wear and cosmetic condition. It just means they’ve been played!

    Whatever you decide, I hope it turns out well.

    Good Luck.
     
    Engine Swap likes this.
  18. old_picker

    old_picker Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,284
    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2006
    Location:
    Melbourne Australia
    like others have said it aint lacquer - test an area with thinners or acetone on a cotton bud and see if it goes hazy or sticky
    100-1 its poly

    danger there is that it will start to break away around the edges if adhesion isnt great. so I would wick a little runny CA around the edges of the ding to stop it checking more. then tackle it with some black nail polish or lacquer or even a black texta.

    I can tell its poly because of the thickness of the finish. you will have the devils own job of filling that up so you can level it out.
    BTW the famous stewmac method is not recomended - CA goes as hard as a rock and a lot harder than the finish

    If you tackle this be prepared to accept that you may end up with an even bigger mess than you started with
     
  19. Engine Swap

    Engine Swap Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    145
    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2014
    Location:
    Chicago
    Not lacquer. Put a drop of mineral spirts on a small spot under the jack. Like water off a duck's back.

    Funny, I thought I had sprung for a "nicer" finish back when I bought this in 1997. Thanks to those with the knowledge to point this out and suggest I test it.

    Anyhoo, is nail polish still an option?
     
  20. Freeman Keller

    Freeman Keller Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    75
    Posts:
    2,925
    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2018
    Location:
    Washington
    Its pretty rare to see true lacquer on production guitars anymore, the catalyzed stuff is so much easier and in many respects its probably the best finish for an electric guitar. Nail polish is basically a lacquer solvent and in my opinion is not an option. The product that I had used on the G&L that I showed you is

    https://www.stewmac.com/Materials_a...ac_Super_Glues/StewMac_Tinted_Super_Glue.html

    Many repair people use this stuff

    https://gluboost.com/flexible-repair-finish-products/

    Both StewMac and Gluboost have how to info on their web pages, I suggest you read them before you go any further.
     
    Engine Swap likes this.
IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.


  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.