Cavalier Oildale

Discussion in 'Just Pickups' started by Rob DiStefano, Jul 8, 2019.

  1. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    Spec-wise (resistance), the Oildale and Fender Nocaster bridge pickups are very close. And both use A3 mags. You may not hear much, if any difference, between them.

    The Bakersfield has A5 mags, fewer turns, and a little lower resistance. The Bakersfield should sound a little bit sharper/brighter and sparkly in tone.

    If you play with a good bit of over-drive or distortion, you may not hear any difference between the three.

    That said, the Fender Nocaster is machine fed during winding (extremely consistent). The Cavaliers are human hand-fed during winding (scatter-wound, somewhat uneven). When playing clean, those who pay close attention to tone seem to notice the difference in tone with the scatter-wound. I think the scatter-wound pickups sound a little richer/more complex in tones/over-tones. You're not so likely to hear this, though, if you play with very much over-drive.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2019
  2. revelation2012

    revelation2012 Tele-Meister

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    Thanks. That's very helpful.
     
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  3. rigatele

    rigatele Tele-Afflicted

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    Both machine and hand winding have two main factors that can influence the tone - wire tension and turns per layer. A higher tension and more turns per layer both increase the average proximity of adjacent wires in the coil. That, in turn, increases the coil capacitance, which decreases the treble response by lowering the resonant frequency. However, that difference is not very great. The coil capacitance is usually less than the guitar cord capacitance, and those interact. With the volume knob up all the way, the two actually just add. So this particular coil characteristic is a very minor contributor to the overall sound. Generally, tension and TPL are higher in a machine wind (but not necessarily so, as the machines can be adjusted for both). "Scatter wound" pickups generally have lower tension and TPL, usually by design - the whole point being to increase the treble. Also, the winder can vary the parameters. But the difference is only "with all other things being equal" and there are many other factors that play a much bigger role in shaping the tone.
     
  4. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    rigatele... indeed. As I mentioned, some players may not even notice the subtle tonal difference between machine wound and scatter-wound. But if you play a very clean, clear style (especially solo - not in a band setting) there are tonal differences which may be heard and appreciated (and recorded).

    My appreciation for hand-fed scatter wound is in part for the potential increase in highs and an overall “richness and complexity” of tone.

    In a band setting and/or some EFX engaged (esp overdrive), these subtleties are less likely to be heard, if at all.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2019
  5. rigatele

    rigatele Tele-Afflicted

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    Thing is, and I stress that it is not a quality measure but a question of "flavour", the capacitance of the Nashville that I measured was extremely high, 417pF. Compare with the NoCaster at 125pF. I have not had a chance to measure the Oildales, or any other Cavalier Tele pickup set. The Lion King was also quite high, at 390pF. This is no doubt a big part of the reason those pickups also have a quite low loaded resonant peak frequency. Rob would probably assert that it makes little difference but I find it quite interesting because it means that lots and lots of people actually prefer resonant tones that gravitate down in frequency from the typical 3kHz that you usually see on a Strat. This illustrates that low capacitance as a goal in itself will not benefit many people.

    Personally, I also play very clean and mostly into a DAW, and my musical style demands a clearer, more trebly and flat response, but without completely giving up the resonance provided by Alnico poles. That is why I have Cavalier Phoenix Firebird replicas on my main guitar. Those have a much higher response around 4kHz, even higher than a typical Strat. But the resonance is tamed somewhat by using 250k pots.
     
  6. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    I'm running my Cavalier Phoenix Firebird neck pickup (genuine article, but 4,200 turns vs. standard 4,500 turns) with an 880k Volume pot and a No-Load tone pot.

    I have no idea what the resonant peak is with this pickup, nor what the capacitance is. (I don't have the tools to take those measurements.) But going by my ears - I'm very much enjoying the tones with that set-up. Nice and sparkly bright.
     
  7. rigatele

    rigatele Tele-Afflicted

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    The standard Phoenix has a resonant peak of about +5dB and a capacitance of 185pF. Your peak will be higher because of the higher value pot. But the capacitance value can't be compared directly with other types of pickups - that would be an apples to oranges comparison.
     
  8. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    By peak, do you mean the frequency at which output is the greatest will be higher?

    Or do you mean that the peak frequency itself will have higher output level?
     
  9. rigatele

    rigatele Tele-Afflicted

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    The resonant frequency is largely independent of the load resistance value. The effect of a higher resistance volume pot is mostly an increase in the amplitude, the frequency may shift slightly but almost immeasurably. To be unambiguous, I would refer to the Q but that term isn't as well known. To illustrate this point, I show a simulation of the Phoenix, with the equivalent loads that would be produced by 250k, 500k, and 880k pots:
    dhart_phoenix.png
    The actual peak responses are much lower, because of eddy current losses. However, you can see the general effect of the response.
    Green = 250k Blue = 500k Red = 880k

    As you can see, the frequency doesn't change much, only the amplitude of the peak.

    Ignore the red, green and blue dotted lines They are the phase response, not relevant here.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2019
  10. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    Gotcha... resonant peak stays about the same frequency, but the volume (amplitude) is increased, making it (and other similar frequencies) more "present" to the ear.

    4 kHz is a pretty high frequency (as far as human hearing goes), but plenty audible. That's the "sparkle" is do enjoy. :lol:

     
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