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Can any of you tell what kind of speakers I have in a cabinet by looks?

Discussion in 'Amp Central Station' started by FortyEight, Nov 17, 2020.

  1. FortyEight

    FortyEight Tele-Meister

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    Ugh......

    so what about my idea of only trying one speaker with the head?

    And yeah, the amp can choose different ohm settings and it's on 8ohms right now.

    Well at least that explains why I can't get a good sound. Maybe the head has potential.....
     
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  2. FortyEight

    FortyEight Tele-Meister

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    I might actually be able to just reroute the exisitng wires. I'll have to have a better look but it's defnitely not wired the way that drawing is. I can tell just from the picture.
     
  3. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Yes, you can run one speaker to see IF this speaker arrangement is the problem. Fwiw, a properly wired 16 ohm load working with an OT that I lookin for an 8 ohm load will not necessarily sound thin as you describe. That sound you describe is either the particular speakers, the wiring—-out of phase, or a problem with the amp.
    Can you run an external speaker fr9m that Vox? If so, try one of these speakers with that amp to hear what the speaker does with an amp that is known to you.
     
  4. FortyEight

    FortyEight Tele-Meister

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    Now my vox isn't working. I used the headphones last night and it won't click back over. Cutting in and out. Grrrrrrrr...... It's annoying. I'm gonna try some contact cleaner first but if that doesn't work I gotta find a replacement rather quickly. I have about 300 bucks.... I think. I gotta check again. I don't really want to spend it all on myself with Christmas coming up though. Ugh.

    If I felt like I could love my Rumble 40 for guitar I would just use that. But there's something about it that I'm not sure if it's good to go. I do want to see how it sounds in a mix though.

    I wish the Rumble had a speaker out line so I could try a guitar speaker hooked up to it. Actually the other night I had my vox going into the rumble and both were on and it had a cool sound.
     
  5. FortyEight

    FortyEight Tele-Meister

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    Now my vox is working fine. Note to self, don't use the headphone jack if you want it to be consistent. LOL.

    It seems fine now but it was all goofed up last night after unplugging the headphones. I am getting some electrical contact cleaner and gonna use it on the connections.

    Now... I ran both the Laney Head and my Vox through just one speaker. And I will say the head sounded better. It's still not exactly what I would call "good". I think the clean still sounds a bit thin and dead. The distortion was a bit more alive but pretty noisy if you went high gain with it and it didn't sound that good lower gain. But it sounds better than before with the cabinet wired wrong.

    Now, comparing the stock 8" bulldog to 1 of the eminence 12" I'd say the 8" is much brighter. And the 12" more lower end and a bit more muddy. But that was all knobs being the same. I seemed to be able to EQ the 12"er to a very nice tone. I think I like how they sound. What was really good was the 2 of them together. Which would work for live or if you were gonna put a mic further out. I typically don't do that but I could try that.

    So.... I'm still unsure as to where to go. Wire it all back up to 4? Separate them out. I don't really need a 4x12 cabinet for guitar. But maybe 2 of them on would be good. Is the wiring for 2 of them the same as the 4? I have enough wires to do 2 speakers but there were not enough in there to wire it properly. So I need to get more. LOL. I'm not sure how they had it wired. It feels like they were just haphazardly wiring them. Well maybe not but it was not done like picture above for sure.
     
  6. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    If you want to run only two of them on Laney, you can wire them in parallel for a 4 ohm load or in series for a 16 ohm load. I prefer parallel because if one speaker goes down the other speaker continues working. In a series circuit, if one speaker fails, the whole circuit is dead....and the amp sees an open circuit, which is quickly a problem for the OT. I would wire the cab up in the manner above..series/parallel for an 8 ohm load just so it is properly wired and functional as it was intended. Put a piece of masking tape on the back so the drummer knows what is going on. That cab very likely came with 4x 16 ohms wired in series/parallel for a 16 ohms.....or it could have been wired for a 4 ohm load in parallel.

    Re: running that Vox on two of those 8 ohm speakers. There is incomplete info available in a quick search, but I am going to think that that amp wants to see no less than an 8 ohm load. If so, then you would want NOT to run two of those 8 ohms in parallel because that puts the output transistors at risk of failure. You could run 2 in series for a 16 ohm load, which would cut output power in half but be safe.
     
  7. J-bass&Tele

    J-bass&Tele Tele-Meister

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    Confirming that the Vox Cambridge 15 wants a speaker load that's 8Ω or higher, as Wally wrote.

    My Cambridge 15 is getting a workout in my livingroom right now through a Emi 1028k.
     
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  8. FortyEight

    FortyEight Tele-Meister

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    Well on the back of my cambridge it has a speaker cabinet out labeled 8ohm and a "line out" jack. If I use the line out it plays the speaker in the vox amp AND also the cabinet. I'm guessing if I have two speakers hooked up it would not be good to use that one... I'm not even sure if I should be doing that with just the 1x12 speaker. ???

    I could just get more wires with connectors and properly wire the 4 back up to 8 ohm capacity, eh? Then I wouldn't have to deal with losing half the power. Although this thing is really loud IMHO. I mean... when I get it up to half I'm feeling like it's way too loud for what I need it for. Although I've only been recording with it. It was a bit quiet for playing with my drummer when he came over one time. But that was just with the 8" speaker in use. But I also didn't have it cranked all the way. The 4 12" speakers definitely fills up the room more, lol.

    When you buy a 2x12 amp typically what ohm are they set at?


    I guess I kind of want to see what 2x12 sounds like but in the end I should probably just wire it up all 4 and keep it that way. The only other thing is that when we do play live I could build a cabinet with 2 of the speakers for vocals.... And then leave 2 in there for guitar.

    Options options.

    Does anyone have a proper wiring schematic for 2? So I can use a speaker cabinet 16ohms with my Cambridge but not 4, eh? There's no way to choose a different ohm setting on the Vox....
     
  9. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    A line out is not a speaker feed. It is a line level signal meant for insertion into another power amp or a board. what happens when you plug a speaker load into the extension speaker jack. I am thinking this will ‘kill’ the connection to the internal speaker and thus protect the amp from a lower impedance load, which could mean the demise of the amp.
    the best way to learn about speaker wiring is to use search engines and do some studying on the subject. You cannot wire two 8 ohm speakers in parallel for that Vox amp...as I noted in my post above. Yo7 would have to wire them in series. Do the search and the studying. I adhere to that principle espoused by Confusius......give a man a fish, you feed him for one day. Teach a man to fish! You feed him for a lifetime. The internet full of study material.
     
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  10. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Sorry I didn't see this post!
    WRT my suggestion the bias may be off due to new power tubes being installed without setting the bias, you generally need a tech to check the bias for you if you're not confident working inside lethal voltage tube amps that are still lethal after you unplug them.
    If it has a bias pot as opposed to a soldered in bias setting, you can adjust and listen, while also looking for the power tubes to turn red from adjusting too hot, but maybe that's not a great idea for you to get into. If you want to learn to work on tube amps it's a little more than a post can cover, and should not be mixed in with random discussion of years/ speakers/ date codes/ sounds/ brand names etc.

    Only if the bias is now set cold can you change to a warmer sound by adjusting the bias.
    New tubes will draw a different amount of current than the old tubes, thus bias may have been set right for the old ones and be wrong or cold for the new tubes.

    WRT the 12 ohm reading you got with your meter, that sounds like the resistance reading we often see with a cab or speaker that has 16 ohms impedance.
    But nobody else seems to think you have a 16 ohm cab?
    A 16 ohm 4x12 has four 16 ohm speakers and I may have missed a post stating that the speakers are NOT 16 ohms each?

    I also didn't see that you confirmed that all cones move in the same direction when you touch a 9v battery to the input jack tabs?
    Sorry, not keeping track of all the evidence posted!
    Just wanted to answer since I missed you question.

    BTW I have a quad of custom order post Y2K Emi speakers that I can't get any info on, but I like their sound in certain amps.
    Bought them from a bass amp maker who tailored amps like the old time 100w Marshall and Hiwatt bass amps with a less than pristine clean sound.
    So they are Celestion style with extra power handling and generally warm fat tone.
    No clue what model though as they are not a standard Emi model.
     
  11. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Telemnemonics, in the first post forty eight gave us the info of off those Eminence labels
    So, that 12 ohm looks strange doesn’t it? I thin’ the cab is/miswired somehow....that up is if all of those four speakers are 8 ohm. the thin sound suggests a miswire somehow that is arriving in a strange impedance and is also out of phase????
     
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  12. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Oh I missed that info!
    Strange, no way to wire four @ 8ohms and get that reading AFAIK?
    Correct would be 2, 8 or 32.

    I wonder what three in series then the fourth in parallel would read at?
    Three in series would be 24 ohms and read maybe 15 ohms, then that with the 8 might read 12 ohms?
    Wrong but possible?
     
  13. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    lol....flashback for those who might remember “I Love Lucy”.....I became Desi Arnez there...’I thin the cab is miswired, Lucy!’.....
     
  14. FortyEight

    FortyEight Tele-Meister

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    the wires were going everywhere. It looked like someone just threw them on they way they thought best.... I should've taken a better picture. I'm not sure if I'm using the multimeter right but I get 8.5-9 when it's just one speaker... It's hard to get to stop rifling through a bunch of numbers up and down but when I can get it to settle, that's what it settles on.
     
  15. FortyEight

    FortyEight Tele-Meister

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    So I got a response back from eminence today. It totally cracks me up. Here it is:

    Hello J.J.,


    To begin, Eminence Speaker has never sold to Laney, so the original speakers must have been swapped for Eminence.


    These speakers were made for Aspen & Associates as an OEM speaker. We currently use the cone in that speaker in just this one OEM speaker, so finding a lineup equivalent, if interested, would take some description of desired tone and function.


    If we can help further let us know.


    Caleb M. Potts.

    I mean, I looked up this Aspen and Associates and more than one business comes up but one of them is a voice over company.... So I'm thinking that's who they made those for.... I'm like waaaaaa? Probably not anything to do with guitars....

    https://lastudios.info/?page_id=2&cn-entry-slug=aspen-associates-llc&cn-view=detail

    I used one of the speakers as my vox as a head to record two guitar lines in the current song I'm working on. They have a bit of a subdued sound and more low end than the 8" Celestion in my amp. So I aimed the mic at the middle and it came across as more high end and not real bassy. Which I don't really like but it's a second guitar. And actually it kind of cut through the mix so it might have been OK.

    Either way I don't think they're meant to be guitar speakers and they're definitely not original to the cabinet. LOL.

    I should try my voice through the amp and these speakers.
     
  16. 11 Gauge

    11 Gauge Doctor of Teleocity

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    I posted a link to a recone kit for this speaker much earlier in this thread.

    Here it is again: https://reconingspeakers.com/product/eminence-12267-12-aftermarket-diy-recone-kit/

    There's no indication at that link that this particular speaker was specifically made for guitar amps. That doesn't necessarily mean that it won't sound good in a guitar amp, but you'd probably get better sounds if going with something guitar-specific that's more similar to what Laney originally had in there.
     
  17. FortyEight

    FortyEight Tele-Meister

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    Thank you! I appreciate the link. I will have a think on it. I'm not sure what to do. I am going to keep playing with them to see if I get tones I like. I think I kind of like what I'm hearing with it cuz it leans more towards warm than bright. But then again so does my bass amp. LOL.
     
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