1. Win a Broadcaster or one of 3 Teles! The annual Supporting Member Giveaway is on. To enter Click Here. To see all the prizes and full details Click Here. To view the thread about the giveaway Click Here.

Beginner with 7 guitars :(

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by Seattlesurfer, Aug 11, 2020.

  1. KATT

    KATT Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    164
    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Location:
    Essex, England
    I've never heard of "pitch up" and certainly never experienced it. Perhaps I've just not noticed, but if a guitar was a semitone sharp after storage, I would have thought I would have noticed by now! The Fender article does not refer to this phenomenon either as the reason for tuning down for storage, but doesn't mean to say it's not the reason.
    Are there any other sources that back this up as I will downtune my guitars if there is actually a risk to them!
    I've never had neck issues with any guitar I've ever owned but would like to avoid them too.
     
  2. MilwMark

    MilwMark Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    11,912
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2013
    Location:
    near Arnold's
    My local shop recommends it. I don’t know how likely neck issues are. They see enough guitars, especially “under the bed” guitars that were stored at pitch, that they recommend tuning down if you won’t play for a month or more. Whether it’s avoiding a 1:100 problem, a 1:10 problem or a 6:10 problem, I’m not sure.
     
  3. rocks2oldies

    rocks2oldies TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    46
    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2017
    Location:
    SoCal
    Geez, don't feel bad. I've got a Strat, a Tele (both electric) a Taylor, a Guild, and 2 other acoustics that I can't remember the names of that I bought my first year and I still can't find anyone decent enough to spend time with me to teach me. I have had young and old teachers and after a couple of lessons with them, I could tell that they didn't know what the hell they were doing. I got very discouraged even with online learning, and now I sit and stare at them wondering who I will leave them to when I die! I live in SoCal, but in an area where I have to travel and battle traffic to go anywhere decent to learn guitar, so I am in a quandry.
     
  4. crb4726

    crb4726 TDPRI Member

    Age:
    67
    Posts:
    5
    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2020
    Location:
    Texas, LC
    You definitely are not crazy.... You fit in right along side of a lot of us pickers.
    You obviously have G.A.S. (guitar acquisition syndrome)....it happens to many of us.
    I hardly play much any more these days and I just sold off a few of my guitars.
    I have my last amp up for sale, a nice Carvin Vintage 33 Nomad (90s amp I have had since 2006ish?).
    and I still want another guitar. It Okay.
     
  5. oopsimeltednitro

    oopsimeltednitro TDPRI Member

    Age:
    39
    Posts:
    51
    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2019
    Location:
    Dallas, TX

    Wait...you mean we are supposed to not suck at some point? ;)
     
  6. DesignTec

    DesignTec TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    85
    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2010
    Location:
    Fort Walton Beach, FL
    I'm 52. I started when I was 13ish. I have 12 guitars and 3 amps. I'm a basement noodler. Non-guitarists tell me I'm "really good". I think I suck. I've only played in punk garage bands, now I write my own stuff and record it on my PC. It's just a fun hobby for me, and of my many hobbies, it's not in the top 3 that get the majority of my focus and effort.

    Here's what I've learned and my opinions and advice:
    • Learn on an electric, not an acoustic.
    • The number of guitars you own only matter if you're buying a lot of cheap guitars in lieu of a good guitar.
    • You need to play a lot of different guitars to know what you like and don't like.
    • Pay someone to properly set up your guitar and do any fret/neck work that is needed. Change strings often. Do everything you can, and spend the money it takes, to make your guitar play as good and as easily as possible. If the guitar plays great, you'll pick it up more often.
    • Take one-on-one in-person lessons. Being accountable to someone else for showing progress (and having $kin in the game) will keep you on track and practicing vs noodling.
    • If you don't love your guitar instructor, fire him and hire a new one. Do this until you find someone you learn from.
    • Find some guys who suck as bad as you and start a garage band. Playing with other musicians will make you better, faster.
    Hope this helps.
     
    Seattlesurfer and Jake909 like this.
  7. pblanton

    pblanton TDPRI Member

    Age:
    56
    Posts:
    42
    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2019
    Location:
    Black Forest, Colorado
    I got my first guitar when I was 14. That was 41 years ago. That one was lost in a flood at my mom's house during my parent's divorce.

    I didn't get my next guitar until after college, the military, and having two kids. Now I have sixteen (guitars, not kids - though that would satisfactorily explain why I had no time to practice). I love to mod them and try different things. I'm way better at building and setting up guitars than I am at playing them.

    I heartily endorse what others have said. Directionless noodling is a great way to discover new things and help find your sound, but it's not a way to learn. I have tried a number of different guitar courses but know just enough to make them boring. I am currently subscribed to https://JamPlay.com and I recently bought a guitar course from Udemy : https://www.udemy.com/course/complete-guitar-system-beginner-to-advanced/. I bought it on sale for ~$10.

    In an effort to improve my skills in 2020/2021, I have decided to dedicate at least two hours a day to this course. I am going though it from A to Z as if I know nothing about guitars. I spend an hour or so watching the videos and doing the exercises, and committing to practice afterwards, least an hour. I have just started in earnest, and expect to get through the boring stuff I already know pretty soon, but also expect to learn a few things I didn't already pick up just noodling directionlessly.

    I'm hoping that after completing the course, I'll have a solid foundation upon which to build more advancement which will lead me to be able to jam more effectively instead of just noodling and campfire stuff. At that point, the JamPlay subscription should help me to focus on getting better at certain skills.

    I dunno. Maybe it won't work and I am destined to be a noodler for the rest of my life, but as another poster said earlier, this second childhood is fun.
     
  8. Dik Ellis

    Dik Ellis Tele-Meister

    Age:
    67
    Posts:
    144
    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2020
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    At the moment, you are a "guitar player". The guitars have little to do with how you sound, until you break them in. I have a variety, and I wouldn't part with any of them. They are all unique in their own way. Over time, you will develop confidence in your playing abilities, which will require practice and dedication. You will then become a "Musician", and you will be able to play all your guitars, with flair. Make it happen, my friend.
     
  9. 61fury

    61fury Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    2,850
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2009
    Location:
    knoxville, TN
    My guitars often will go sharp if unused/untuned for a while. It confuses me because I would think that things under tension would slacken and go flat
     
    Jake909 and pblanton like this.
  10. Gary135r

    Gary135r Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    106
    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2020
    Location:
    Maine
    True. You all are great, but for a beginner without self discipline or direction, some of these threads can make you think crazy thoughts. Thank goodness I'm retired military with a little bit of discipline. :D I've learned a lot from you all already. Thanks.
     
  11. Gary135r

    Gary135r Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    106
    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2020
    Location:
    Maine
    Guitars are like bicycles for me. I love to ride/play them, but I also love to look at them. With disposable income, that can get dangerous, and fun.
     
    Jake909 and Steerforth like this.
  12. waynereed

    waynereed TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    43
    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2013
    Location:
    Central Ohio
    That's a myth. There is no need to de-tune a guitar just because it's not going to be played for a while. In fact, that could do more damage than good.

    Same for traveling or shipping. All myth. Why do ALL manufacturers ship all guitars in tune? Because guitars were designed to be in tune. Same for flying. You always hear . . . "De-tune your guitar before flying or your guitar could 'break'". ALL planes have been pressurizing ALL luggage compartments for many years. No need! All luggage is kept in pressurized compartments.

    How the myth started . . . Les Pauls. Yeah, head stocks were breaking off during flights. But not because of string tension. Problem was/is the head stock angle. When in the case, the end of the head stock is against the bottom of the case. So is the body. Pressing on the fret board while in the case puts pressure on the end of the head stock. The head stocks brake off when the SIDE of the guitar box/case is hit or pressed too hard. Pushing on the neck & fret board! THAT breaks the head stocks off.

    Just sayin'.
     
  13. KT89

    KT89 Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    296
    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2019
    Location:
    Missouri
    There are lots of hobbies that entirely consist of buying. Watches, for instance(or all fashion for that matter).

    Not gonna lie, it irks me when I see new players with all sorts of guitars when I didn't get my first "real" guitar for over a decade after I started playing.

    But that's a fallacy; I didn't get a new guitar all the time because I was a kid and kids don't have money. If I had been an adult would I have bought guitars? Hell yeah. Guitars aren't earned, they're bought.

    And you know what? New and different guitars inspire me in different ways, and push me to adapt and be a better player.

    At the end of the day, it's whatever keeps you picking up the guitar. My father never plays his guitars anymore, and that makes me very sad. So if new guitars keep you inspired, keep buying new guitars.

    /tipsy Friday night rant
     
    Gary135r likes this.
  14. waynereed

    waynereed TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    43
    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2013
    Location:
    Central Ohio
    You wanna get really good, and fast!?! And enjoy ALL of your guitars? Quit making excuses, and practice for an hour a day . . . on all 6! One hour each.

    ALL your guitar heroes will tell you the same thing. They practiced ALL the time! Many hours a day. Every day.

    There are literally 10s of 1000s of people who own, and noodle on their guitars, who SAY they want to be very good, or even awesome guitarists. Out of the 10s of 1000s, a few actually become highly skilled. Only the ones who didn't just say they wanted to be great, but see aside EVERYTHING ELSE, and focused on practice!

    It's a matter of priority. The guitar greats had only ONE desire . . . To be a great guitar player! No TV. No bowling! No video games. No hanging at the mall. JUST PRACTICE!

    "But my girlfriend says I don't pay enough attention to her because all I do is play guitar all the time. I'm afraid she'll dump me!"

    GET A NEW GIRLFRIEND!

    "But my friends I hang with won't like me any more. Won't invite me to parties and concerts n stuff if all I do is practice all the time!"

    1). GET NEW FRIENDS! 2). You shouldn't be going to parties and concerts to begin with, IF . . . if you want to play on the same level as your guitar heroes!

    ONCE YOU "GET THERE" . . . trust me, once you become a highly skilled player, getting girl friends and buddies, and new friends will NOT be a problem!

    The choice isn't easy. You can either keep your girl friend, keep your buddies, keep up your bowling average, and WATCH guitar greats at THEIR concerts . . . OR . . .

    You can do what it takes now, get new girl friend(s), buddies and friends,and BE the guitar great everyone else is watching at YOUR concert!

    If being a highly skilled guitarist is not your goal (and that's absolutely 100% OK!) then why put any guitars away? Have fun. Play them all. (Notice I said "play", not practice.)

    But if you seriously want to become great . . . work for it! Focus. Practice a minimum of 2 1/2 to 3 hours a day. Every day! More hours when you can.

    Using more than one guitar for practice sessions is NOT a problem! In fact, contrary to non-pro player's opinions . . . it's a smart thing to do, if you can!

    NOTE: Be absolutely steadfast at keeping ALL of those guitars properly set up! Minimum, 2 times a year, set them up, or take them to a shop and get them set up. Learn how to set them up! Practicing on a guitar that isn't set up properly will severely minimize your results of hourly practice.
     
  15. MilwMark

    MilwMark Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    11,912
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2013
    Location:
    near Arnold's
    Y’all do what you want. Fender and Martin both recommend detuning for storage.

    upload_2020-8-14_23-43-29.png upload_2020-8-14_23-43-29.jpeg

    But what do they know?

    Just sayin’.
     
  16. waynereed

    waynereed TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    43
    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2013
    Location:
    Central Ohio
    Pitch up? Huh? IF . . . IF your guitar went UP in pitch, that means the strings got tighter. If they got tighter it's because the neck either straightened out, or some other impossible to imagine physical structural change happened. Like the neck angle magically changed, pulling AGAINST the string force. Or saddles defied physical force and slipped back. Or the bridge . . . you get my point.

    Pitch up? Unless your storage area, closet, what ever is in some remote part of the house, and the temperature is brutally changing, constantly, and humidity is through the roof . . . your guitar should be nearly in tune when you take it back out of storage. ALWAYS!

    Id ANYTHING, the guitar should be a little bit LOW in pitch because the strings stretched a little. But even that isn't likely to happen if you tuned your guitar correctly when you changed the strings to begin with.

    A properly set up guitar should nearly never go out of tune, except for maybe the slightest "tweak". I'm an aggressive guitarist. I bend the snot out of strings! And none of them go out of tune, even for a whole gig! Maybe, when playing outside gigs, I might need to tweak! (Open the case as soon as you get to an outside gig. Immediately. Let it normalize to outside temperature for a while. Ideally, 45 to 60 minutes or so. THEN tune your guitar! Same thing if you get to an inside gig and the friggin' AC is pumped up to freezing! Open the case and let it sit!)

    If temp and humidity aren't an issue, and your guitar isn't nearly in tune when you take it out, then there is something wrong with your guitar, not with your storage techniques.

    It's like this . . .

    Any guitar that is in constant need of being tuned is ALWAYS on the verge of being out of tune. So it's almost never really in tune. (Side note: Yeah, I know. A guitar can never be 100% in tune. That's for a different post!)

    Any guitar (like dozens of mine) that are properly set up, and stay in tune all the time, even after vigorous playing and string bending . . . will be in tune (close) after storing for some time.

    If there are no temperature quick changes, and no humidity issues, there is absolutely NOTHING that should make the guitar go out of tune while sitting, un-played.

    BUT . . . if it's not perfectly set up, STUFF HAPPENS!
     
  17. waynereed

    waynereed TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    43
    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2013
    Location:
    Central Ohio
     
    rocks2oldies likes this.
  18. Steerforth

    Steerforth Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    3,712
    Joined:
    May 17, 2009
    Location:
    Arkansas
    Buy a non-vinyl-containing guitar stand and put it next to your favorite chair.

    Put a guitar on it and play it for 13 days. Then change guitars.

    In three months, you’ll have played each guitar for a couple of weeks and be well on the way to knowing your herd.
     
    rocks2oldies likes this.
  19. MilwMark

    MilwMark Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    11,912
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2013
    Location:
    near Arnold's
    Well, it’s all in italics, so it must be authoritative.

    OP can decide whether to go with you, or with Fender and Martin.

    It’s amazing that a properly set up guitar can overcome all laws of physics though. Kudos.
     
  20. waynereed

    waynereed TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    43
    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2013
    Location:
    Central Ohio
    I didn't intend to get into an argument over this. If you wanna de-tune, go ahead. If you don't, don't.

    What they know is . . . extended period of time . . . for acoustics. What exactly is the definition of "extended time"? That article went into minute detail about temperature and humidity while storing. PAGES of info. Then added just one small, undefined or explained note, at the end of a paragraph simply stating . . . "CF Martin recommends de-tuning your instrument for storage." Not how much to de-tune, or why to de-tune, or what period of time defines "storage". Simple after thought, and a guy's opinion.

    The OP didn't insinuate that he'd be "storing the guitar for an extended period of time". As in "packing it away for posterity?!?"

    My point, my view or opinion is shared by every guitar manufacturer in the world. No need to de-tune when shipping or short time storage. The OP specifically said . . . put them aside for a while and focus on one guitar. As in, for a short time. Another post said to be sure to de-tune. I'm simply stating . . . that isn't necessary.

    I have a TON of guitars and amps. I'm 71, still gigging, but decided it was time to thin out. I just sold 20 guitars and 10 amps, plus 3 PA systems, and more. I still have dozens of guitars and well over a dozen amps. Guitars date from a 1967 Gibson Melody Maker and '69 Flying V and '69 acoustic, to more recently purchased guitars. Same with amps. I have a 1957 Valco amp, still working and gigging with it at times, to newer amps as well. It's a '57 and still working perfectly. I do know how to take care of all gear, including guitars.

    I have guitars that have been in storage for YEARS! Never de-tuned. I recently pulled out one of them, a quality built classical. After 20+ years in storage, it was nearly in tune!

    . . . every guitar manufacturer in the world . . . But what do THEY know?
     
IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.