Becoming more "melodic"

Discussion in 'Tab, Tips, Theory and Technique' started by Axegrinder77, Dec 6, 2019.

  1. MrClint

    MrClint Tele-Meister

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    1-2-3, Keep it simple, bluesy and melodic. That's my practice plan for the weekend. Good stuff!
     
  2. jvin248

    jvin248 Poster Extraordinaire

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    .

    One trick I learned, try to hum it in your head and play along to that.

    Get a Kokko/Ammoon mini looper pedal, it's a clone of the Ditto mini, and sells around $35 new. You could also set up a pc with Audacious recorder to play and loop that.

    These are more complex loopers and looping, but this is the type of thing to be doing.





    .
     
  3. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    A singer with classical training you are. Playing melodies would seem to be a simple thing. You can sing melodies.....sing them and repeat them on the guitar. Or..since you read music, sightread the melodies.
    Jazz?? Jazz is the confluence of classical music and the blues music played by those New Orleans musicians. Those musicians were classically trained in order to be able play for the white upper crust of New Orleans....and jazz was the result of that mingling of two distinctly different musical genres...one schooled and one un-schooled. The addition of those two blue notes...slightly sharp minor third and the seventh...created a new world. Perhaps jazz was not fully explained and exhibited to you???
    I agree that pentatonic doesn’t not lead one to full melodies. There are some missing tones that makes music more interesting in many cases. And..one cannot build the necessary chords out of a pentatonic scale.
     
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  4. Sparky2

    Sparky2 Friend of Leo's

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    Axegrinder77,

    I think you are on the right track.

    Playing the lead vocals of your favorite songs will not only improve your lead playing chops, it will open up your intuition for finding the right notes on the fingerboard as you gain more and more experience with repetition.

    The more diverse sets of melodies you learn, the better your instincts will be for all such future endeavors.

    :)
     
  5. MilwMark

    MilwMark Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Yep. Learn all the triad shapes all over the neck. Play songs you know replacing the normal chords with different corresponding triad versions. To internalize and learn how to employ triads in real time. Soon melodic ideas will follow.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2019
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  6. Bartholomew3

    Bartholomew3 Friend of Leo's

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    Learn how to phrase like a horn or voice with your lead lines - play in phrases and learn where the rests are.

    Problem with most Lead players I see in clubs:

    1) They play through everything when doing leads

    2) Don't understand what a rest is

    3) Too loud and have no dynamics

    4) Show-off speed but forgot about having good taste - multitude of meaningless notes.
     
  7. duzie

    duzie Tele-Meister

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  8. ladave

    ladave Tele-Holic

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    Watched some of this last night. Really good! I love AT.
     
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  9. Rockinvet

    Rockinvet Tele-Meister

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    Chord tones rule!
     
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  10. BigDaddyLH

    BigDaddyLH Tele Axpert Ad Free Member

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    +1. The Joe Pass books have classic examples of that. You can see how he outlines the changes in a Bb blues:

    [​IMG]
    (He's playing all eighth notes on purpose, to avoid playing prepackaged licks.)

    He's not slavish about the chord tones (jazz is more chromatic than rock, too) but he hits them often enough, and emphasizes them with things like enclosures.
     
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  11. Rockinvet

    Rockinvet Tele-Meister

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    Joe Pass, good stuff! What many do not know is he also played a telecaster for a while.
     
  12. BigDaddyLH

    BigDaddyLH Tele Axpert Ad Free Member

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    Jaguar? I know there is a staged pic of him holding a Tele, but I don't think it was his guitar.

    (googles)

    [​IMG]
     
  13. Pixie-Bob

    Pixie-Bob Tele-Meister

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    That's the answer that a bass player (like me) would give.
     
  14. gwjensen

    gwjensen Friend of Leo's Platinum Supporter

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    I always liked playing surf because it tends to be very melodic but not too complicated to figure out. The aqua velvets are good example of what I’m talking about.



    Also these guys, pollo Del Mar.



    maybe a good place to start. I have fun with it anyway...
     
  15. Rockinvet

    Rockinvet Tele-Meister

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    Yes I know about the Jaguar too. I am familiar with this picture and was just going from my memory on the subject. I forgot where I read it but it was a long time ago. Next time ill research before i put my foot in my mouth but, I do remember hearing he did.
     
  16. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    I never used a "method" for learning and basically sat down with a guitar among strumming singers and tried to come up with single note lines that fit, supported the vocals, created counterpoint and tension, and made the music more interesting to listen to.

    Later I started playing the notes of the melody of a song I was singing, but this was easier with songs that had more pentatonic based melody which we find often in Rock, and got harder as I tried to play more creative melodies I was singing.
    I don't think singing the melody you play is particularly important, it's just something I worked at in my very exciting first year.
    Picked up a cheap fiddle too and did the same, sang a tune and played that melody on the fiddle.
    Hot Tuna, Hendrix, Jorma playing Rev Gary Davis, old Stones tunes like No Expectations off Beggars Banquet were perfect inroads and were the stuff my "house band" played.

    When I forced myself to learn lines on guitar that are just not guitar lines (to me), I found it was more of an exercise than a music making venture. For example playing the beautiful melody of Redemption Song was hard, taught me a lot, and ultimately never sounded very musical on guitar, even with enough gain to make a singing voice out of a plucked note instrument, which the human voice is not.
    Fiddle is nicer and more musical to play that sort of melody on, but I never felt I could reach the emotional content that song contains and needs to carry.

    Over the years I've found I'm good at supporting a vocalist with lead guitar like lines that are really follow-guitar, and there are all sorts of things we can do with that.
    Call and response in the melody.
    Counterpoint and making a chord with the vocal note at key moments (I presume that's a fair term for playing maybe two notes of a chord that contains the note the singer is hitting and sustaining).
    Repeating the vocal melody in a more rushed emphatic way can drive the song forward and increase emotional impact in certain contexts, sort of like call and response but not the same, almost like being the vocal as opposed to conversing with the vocal.

    Really any exercise that forces finding intervallic rather than scalar note selection will bring more skills.

    But I think the most important after the basics of being able to find and play the note you think of, is being able to write little alternate melodies on the fly, and place them in such a way that everybody is happier for their addition.

    My failings tend toward getting too loud due to hearing problems, using too bright a tone or struggling with the gear trying to find the perfect tone for the vocal (and I do think the right tone is of paramount importance if adding fills in between vocal lines or rests/ breaths), and another way I fall apart is trying to work with a vocalist whose limited range has them singing very narrow simple melodies where I don't want to play lines that are more complicated than the singers lines.

    I guess I tend toward self indulgence and will over play if given the space.
    A singer can make the space feel very cramped, to my struggle between serving my ego and serving the music.
    Something like a hot dog buffet vocal doesn't inspire me to bring my lobster and steak service!

    Coltrane was asked how he came up with his complex later music, and he answered after a pause: "I'm just trying to find that one simple line". I love that and love his later music, but of course I'm not a musical giant responsible for the modern sax lexicon.
    Really I'm sort of an idiot with an over abundance of math playing out in my head.
    Thank God the music gives me direction if I let it!

    I think "Love the Music" is the best suggestion I've got.
    She is your partner for life, buoy her up and she will not let you drown!
     
  17. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Years before I picked up guitar I chopped off the end of my LH pinkie in a kitchen work accident.
    So I came to guitar as a three fingered player in an environment where at any given moment there were 1, 2 or 3 others playing open chords and singing as was the old time funky music method most children of the '60s were given.

    So virtually all my chord learning was triads, for better or for worse.
    Really chord and melody needn't be separate once it becomes clear that a melody can have three notes sequenced into a chord simply by holding rather than stopping the former notes of the "melody" line.
    Makes it easy and sensible to slither from chordal to melodic and etc that I can play but not explain in words.
    Turning the guitar into a polyphonic instrument for the purpose of melodic playing if kind of a shame IMO.

    My limitation means there is a good amount of guitar stuff I just can't do, and I'm not a good choice for strictly rhythm guitar.
    There's a bunch of especially acoustic rhythm guitar I'd love to be able to do, but that requires four fretting fingers to do well.
    Ahhh well, first world problems having musical limitations...
     
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  18. Matt Sarad

    Matt Sarad Tele-Meister

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    Learn TV Show and movie theme songs. Your fingers will have to find new pathways.
    The Munsters is a good place to start. The Simpsons will make you think.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2019
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  19. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    please school me on how this is in Bb, please.
     
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  20. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Yeah actually forcing ourselves to play stuff out of our comfort zone can be illuminating!

    I had a couple of roommates who practiced the Woody Woodpecker theme every durn morning for weeks.
    I wanted to kill them after the second 7am da da da daaaaa da, da da da daaaaa da, da da da da da da da daaaa.
    Mostly because they played it too damn slow, but the hour was a factor as well.
    I don't even know what they planned to do once they nailed it down tight, mighta been just to annoy me???
    They were in a couple of very different bands and one was in Cheater Slicks that went on to some degree of fame and fortune after my friend left them. I suppose Woody coulda fit the Slicks for a minute.
     
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