Band Troubles... am I crazy?

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by dragonfly66, May 19, 2019.

  1. FenderGyrl

    FenderGyrl Friend of Leo's

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    I quit the last 3 bands I was in because of the same problem.
    I was trying the same things you are doing.

    It seemed childish to me to practice so friggin loud. The guys response in one band was "We all ride Harleys,...our ears are shot anyways". :eek::rolleyes::confused:

    So..I guess they didn't care if they went totally deaf.

    Idiots.

    The best band I was ever in was during the 80s.
    We sat around a table with headphones and our instruments and practiced. We would do a live rehearsal on a rented soundstage. Everything fell in line. Just like when we were sitting around that table. And... the live rehearsals were FUN, Because everybody has a financial stake in it... Everybody gave 100%. It was awesome. :p
     
  2. dragonfly66

    dragonfly66 Friend of Leo's

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    You are right they don't like what they don't understand.

    That is hilarious... there is a chart that says when things are too loud and above a certain decibel how many minutes you can stand it without hearing loss. You don't have to take my word for it, it is a scientific fact. The crack of a snare is what 130+ decibels. You do that math, at gigs I stand in front of the drummer.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2019
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  3. dragonfly66

    dragonfly66 Friend of Leo's

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    I purposely bought in-ears that had a limiter so I would not accidentally hurt my ears.

    I would prefer to use the same monitoring system too, but ear plugs are too muffled and will affect my performance.
     
  4. MilwMark

    MilwMark Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    Ok.

    That’s why many of us figure out how to use conventional earplugs and hear ourselves on stage, in a band setting.

    If I were your band mate I’d probably conclude you are trying to create an isolated, solo experience, wearing in-ears in a band that is not all in-ears.

    I probably misread your post as requesting feedback, rather than just agreement.
     
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  5. dragonfly66

    dragonfly66 Friend of Leo's

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    The question is whether I was crazy to want to protect my hearing. There is no need to agree with me. I just pointed out that "too loud" isn't subjective as it relates to hearing loss.

    Please give me the low down on the earplugs you use and how you figured out how to use them. I have attempted at least the different ear plugs I mentioned in the original post. Even looking into the Musician's Ear Plugs that you get at the Audiologist. Do you sing?

    I'm trying to protect my hearing, not create an isolated solo experience. Actually I have the Westone ambient ear buds which let some of the outside in. I got them so I wouldn't be completey isolated.

    I think my main issue is that they see my remedy for their volume is some how complicated when it isn't and instead of supporting my solution they find ways tell me it's complicated.
     
  6. MilwMark

    MilwMark Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    I stand in front of the drums, sing and play rhythm and lead in three bands.

    I use decent earplugs, but nothing special. Usually Earaser or Eargasm (I don’t name these things). Often we have one monitor for the band. Maybe two.

    Being in an electric band is an exercise in learning how to sound good when you can just barely hear yourself, IME.
     
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  7. dragonfly66

    dragonfly66 Friend of Leo's

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    I think your last statement sums it up. I don't think that it is necessary to just barely hear yourself when we have the means to do better. I have found a way to do better for myself, which doesn't affect my band mates, they still get to use nothing in their ears and floor monitors. I know how to hook everything up on a mixer so no one would even need to help me to setup my in-ears.

    @MilwMark You have opened my eyes here though. The points you've made make me realize I'm not compatible with this band and that it is ok.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2019
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  8. alnico357

    alnico357 Tele-Holic

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    You might cherish the memories when you are deaf, but I doubt it.
     
  9. stxrus

    stxrus Friend of Leo's

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    My god, what idiots these clowns are. You don’t need to be that damn loud for any reason.
    I played on a parade float that was so loud I couldn’t hear anything but a wall of roar. My ears were ringing for days after that.

    When the group that had the float asked me to put together another “band” for the parade I said no, I was unavailable that day. While it was the truth, I’d still not do it again
     
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  10. Charlie Bernstein

    Charlie Bernstein Poster Extraordinaire

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    You're in the wrong band.
     
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  11. 1955

    1955 Poster Extraordinaire

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    Not much you can do aside from what has already been recommended regarding ear plugs, etc.

    It might take some club owners pulling the plug because of volume and/or complaints from the audience/people leaving at the gigs to get the point across.

    If you are in a situation where you must deal with it, you can focus on singing at reasonable volume no matter how loud the music is, they might come down a tad on the volume, maybe not, but you won’t strain your voice as much.

    A small reflective room, you don’t have many options.

    You can move yourself and your monitor as far away from the band as you can. Might help a little. Also it’s good to have your own powered wedge that has some serious power.

    You can use a SM57 or a similar unidirectional mic to give you more gain before feedback as long as you keep from sweeping it too close to your monitor.

    Pro musicians are willing and able to adjust dynamics and volume to the room/venue/context, because they learned real quick that running people out because of volume doesn’t pay their bills.

    Musicians without the experience of adjusting are not likely to change, and if they do, it could be extremely difficult for everyone involved.

    I don’t have experience with in-ears, I came up in the old school where everyone played really loud.

    You either adapt or do something else entirely.

    Trying to change people usually doesn’t work.

    You can find a better practice place, you can own and run the PA, you can book the venues, you can do a lot of the grunt work to give you more control, but why bother with all of that if you aren’t having fun?
     
  12. El Marin

    El Marin Tele-Afflicted

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    I agree... the band's volume is set up by the drummer, not by the singer

    I have been rehearsing with bands that were so... so... week that I could hear the strings (electric strings) over the amp... not in my band. Then those friends came to play with my band and they used earplugs in what we think is a normal to low volume. We don't use earplugs... It depends on you... we have two Bassman 59 and an AC15 for harp... not more than 40W I think is not that loud

    Now... you are saying that you want to use your inears in a gig... gigs are not only music but entertainment... Do you have stage monitors? so you don't need in ears

    We have some stage rules: No clip tuners, no bermuda's or shorts, no flipflops, no lirycs stands, no sandals or sleeveless shirts... dress like a rocker, do like a rocker, mate!!! You are in a gig and you represent our band, this is not the beach or a swiming pool. Maybe your band thinks inears are not elegant

    BUT, ending here... if the stage has monitors you don't need in ears... at the rehearsal studio, is up to you, of course
     
  13. Guran

    Guran Friend of Leo's

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    I sing lead in one band, backup in another and just play the guitar in a third. I use ER20's and have done so for the last 10-12 years. I don't look for alternatives any more.

    All kinds of earplugs take a while getting used to. Maybe even a good while. Once you are used to them it's like always having your own monitor. I don't really need any monitor to sing now, though I very much appreciate one. The monitor tells you that stuff works, the mic is on and some of the finer details. It also provides the other singer's voices to me.

    As I said, it takes time getting used to it. I think it's beacuse you have to learn to listen to your own voice inside the head, while all other sounds comes from outside the head.
     
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  14. Masmus

    Masmus TDPRI Member

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    The in ear monitor with a limiter is a great idea, but to diffuse the situation are they telling you that you can't use it or are they just spouting off? If other people say stupid things does it really affect you or are you just feeling hurt because you're not being taken seriously? If you enjoy the music and can let the stupidity roll off you then maybe it could work, at least for a while, if not then it's just not a good fit and frankly your opinion is the only one that matters.

    I have used ear plugs since 1980 when there weren't many choices, so I used the cheap foam ones rolled them up and put them in deep. I must have got 50db of reduction so it was quiet in front of Marshall stacks on 10 and a drummer that was louder than me. It muffled the sound but I wasn't there for it to sound good to me and I got used to the muffled sound, also I was able to hear myself sing. No one else in the band wanted to use them because it "ruined the sound" they all have noticeable hearing loss.

    Later when we started to play in clubs we turned the amps way down and trusted the sound man to do his job. Hearing loss from amplified music is no joke. However teenagers and twenty somethings just know that they are indestructible. I am surprised that people as old as us are this stuck in their ways.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2019
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  15. beagle

    beagle Friend of Leo's

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    I would have already walked.
     
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  16. Guitarteach

    Guitarteach Poster Extraordinaire

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    Sounds like amateurs. Professionalism 101 is respecting and supporting band mates choices. We have moved monitoring a few times and use a mix of in-ear, stand & floor monitors these days. We only help each other and it helps a couple of us are gear freaks. We have a good desk with 6 auxes so is all easy.

    It can be a drag though with PA found at smaller venues when you find they have just one Aux out for the whole band. There is a case for being able to adapt.

    I’d find it hard to last in a band that can’t get the basics established though.
     
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  17. Mad Kiwi

    Mad Kiwi Friend of Leo's

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    is it a least possible that the statement previous of you coming from an accoustic background COULD be that you are more sensitive to the volume?

    I know when I first started playing in a band, the volume was a shock. Especially the snare shots.

    Can you bring in someone who is experienced to see i fthey are beyond reason?

    Also, why was there a singing / rhythm vacancy? is it related ?
     
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  18. bettyseldest

    bettyseldest Friend of Leo's

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    You don't fit, you are the wrong person for this band. As far as they are concerned it works perfectly well as it is. To them you are the wierd guy. It's possible that this is just a matter of your coming from an acoustic background, but we will assume it is not.

    Playing in a band has to be safe. Just as I have been carrying around a couple of earth leakage trip devices (RCDs) for the past 30 years to protect us from electrocution, you have to protect your hearing otherwise you go deaf.

    I retired early a couple of years ago, after 38 years proudly working for the same organisation, I no longer enjoyed it, little things were annoying me. It was no longer fun and I was fortunate enough to be able to afford to leave. If playing with this band is not fun and you don't need the cash, then get out.

    My band recently moved to IEMs. The old desk had just two aux mixes, but the new digital one has six. So I bought myself a wireless set up and a six channel headphone mixer for the rest of the band. They are all wired at the moment, but enjoying a much better monitor mix, lower volumes, no more monitor induced feedback, and looking to buy themselves wireless units. In your situation I would play the next gig with your IEM set up, learn as much as you can from it then, unless they miraculously change their attitude, leave and find another band. Best of luck.
     
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  19. Mase

    Mase Tele-Meister

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    "Being in an electric band is an exercise in learning how to sound good when you can just barely hear yourself, IME.[/QUOTE]

    True in my experience, annoying as all get out, but still true.
     
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  20. TokyoPortrait

    TokyoPortrait Tele-Afflicted

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    "I hear you, on several levels of high decibels..."

    Courtney Barnett and Kurt Vile singing about this right now, as I'm reading this.

    But yeah, do what's right for you.
     
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