Analog SS amp should take pedals better than Digital right?

Discussion in 'Amp Central Station' started by Nashville-tele-19, Feb 18, 2020.

  1. Nashville-tele-19

    Nashville-tele-19 TDPRI Member

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    hi,
    I’ve got a little vox vt20x at the moment and looking for something bigger but still for home use.

    2 amps on my list are the boss nextone and vox av60, both of which have various ‘voices’ but they’re all analog as opposed to digital. This should mean they take pedals better than an all digital alternative I think, is this right?

    I ask because I just watched a shootout between a nextone and a tonemaster and the nextone seemed to take an OD pedal so much better, more presence and clarity and the general consensus seemed to be that it’s because it’s not digital. Any advice would be much appreciated.
     
  2. wabashslim

    wabashslim Tele-Afflicted

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    All digital amps have lots of analog circuitry - input, output, in-between buffers, etc.
     
  3. maxvintage

    maxvintage Friend of Leo's

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    I will admit to not understanding the whole “takes pedals well” thing
     
  4. JayFreddy

    JayFreddy Poster Extraordinaire

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    I think that's the root of the dilemma right there.

    There so many variables involved that it's fairly useless to make black and white generalities.

    Of course, that's never stopped anyone from doing exactly that in the past.

    Ideally you want to try a bunch of different amps in your price range that seem interesting to you, and whittle it down from there.

    Enjoy the journey. The best part of the hunt is usually not the kill.
     
  5. The Angle

    The Angle Tele-Holic

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    I've come to believe that the whole "takes pedals well" thing is a canard. Some specific pedals don't pair well with some specific amps. Other than that, I haven't encountered an amp - or any person who has encountered an amp - that flubbed out when any pedal was plugged into it. As far as analog vs. digital, I doubt there's any universal difference where pedals are concerned.

    I use your Vox's bigger brother, a VT40X, as my #1 amp. I've never plugged any pedal into it other than a looper because it has so many built-in pedal effects.
     
  6. dreamingtele

    dreamingtele Friend of Leo's

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    Ive had a digital/ss/analog amp, the Vox AD50VT.. modelling digital amp, and I never had a problem with pedals through the front end of the amp..
     
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  7. pratteman

    pratteman TDPRI Member

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    I had an old Peavey that was great on some pedals, but a few dirt pedals made it sound horribly muddy.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
     
  8. 11 Gauge

    11 Gauge Doctor of Teleocity

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    I've successfully used pedals with most of my tube, SS, and digital amps.
     
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  9. fendrguitplayr

    fendrguitplayr Doctor of Teleocity

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    A lot of variables to consider. Speakers, settings, watts, etc.
     
  10. tfarny

    tfarny Friend of Leo's

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    Plus the Nextone IS digital...you can plug the thing into your computer and adjust the "sag"! Read their ad copy. They suggest it is an analog amp by using that word quite a bit, but they never come right out and say it. It's clearly a digital amp with a few different programs in it, and a Class D power amp stage.
     
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  11. PCollen

    PCollen Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    If you are judicious with the pedal drive and volume controls, most amps "take pedals" regardless of being analog or solid-state. What you don't want to do is run a very strong signal level into a solid state amp and overdrive the components at the input of the amp. A solid state preamp can be designed to produce distortion, but if you force it to distort at the input it can sound like fingernails scratching on a blackboard.
     
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  12. Digital Larry

    Digital Larry Tele-Afflicted Gold Supporter

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    https://www.roland.com/us/promos/tube_logic/

    is a really well crafted example of blurring the lines between what is real and what they think you want to hear. Finally they just come out and say "This amp-speaker interaction is fine-tuned with DSP for very precise adjustment."
     
  13. 3-Chord-Genius

    3-Chord-Genius Poster Extraordinaire

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    No. Digital amplifiers are modeled to simulate the reactivity of tube amps.
     
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  14. tfarny

    tfarny Friend of Leo's

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    And lots and lots of color photos of old tube amps to influence the reader who is not paying close attention...
     
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  15. Nashville-tele-19

    Nashville-tele-19 TDPRI Member

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    Thanks all, good info there.
     
  16. muchxs

    muchxs Doctor of Teleocity

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    Way I figure it modeling amps were designed to simulate the sound of tube amps. "Everyone" wants that tone.

    But think about it for a moment. How many people do you know who know everything there is to be known about tube amps?

    How many tube amp guys are such hardcore nerds they can translate every nuance of tubes to digital? Or analog to digital?
     
  17. dswo

    dswo Tele-Holic

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    The Nextone is digital in one sense: a computer, rather than a trim pot, controls the flow electrons in a solid state (i.e., analogue) circuit. Analogue synths have been doing this for decades.

    The Nextone is not digital in another sense: the sound is not created in a computer, except for the effects.

    Except for effects, the Nextone is a solid state amp, not a modeling amp.
     
  18. tfarny

    tfarny Friend of Leo's

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    All the Roland / Boss lines are digital: Katana, Blues Cube, Nextone. Boss has done a great job of confusing the issue in their ads. It's not important at all - the amp sounds like what it sounds like. It's interesting that so many people are so invested in the idea that these amps are not modern and high tech...

    Here's a paragraph from the Nextone ad describing the firmware:

    Nextone Version 2: More Tone-Shaping Tools to Craft Your Personal Sound
    Version 2 firmware delivers a host of new tone personalization options via the Nextone Editor. A key feature is Character Shape, which unlocks designer-level sound control right at the heart of the power amplifier. In addition, separate pre/post preamp EQs are now available (including a new 10-band graphic), seven boost types have been added, and effects can be set independently for custom mode channels. There’s also a selectable Extra Headroom setting for added punch. And with new import/export and librarian functions, it’s easier than ever to work with your different Nextone setups.

    Nextone is a Katana with more limited functionality....it might still be a great amp, but that's what it is.
     
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  19. Digital Larry

    Digital Larry Tele-Afflicted Gold Supporter

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    How many people do you know who can design the CPU in your laptop? Heck I live in Silicon Valley and know all sorts of engineers but I'd still probably say "maybe two". And yet laptops are everywhere!

    Regarding "how they do it", #1 I'm not totally sure, never having done this myself, but at least one approach to modelling appears to be to enter some representation of the circuit schematic into a computer which calculates its response 48,000 times a second (or whatever). This doesn't require a "feel" for tubes. It requires accurate circuit component models.

    I've drawn schematics in SPICE, a very old and widely used circuit simulation tool. Then you simulate how they work and it draws a graph. Or you can shove a WAV file through it if it's processing sound. This I have done. It took a really long time, but one thing that keeps improving is how fast you can do the same things you did 10 years ago.
     
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  20. dswo

    dswo Tele-Holic

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    Nextone is a Blues Cube with expanded functionality.

    What's the difference? Katana is a modeling amp, Blues Cube isn't.
     
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