American Vintage II period C neck profiles

[Tarkiner]

I reckon it must be about time for another tele and 3 of the newly released American Vintage II telecasters are calling my name. Particularly the '72 Thinline in LPB, the '77 Custom in Wine Red and the '75 Deluxe in Mocha. Has anyone managed to get their hands on any of these or give me a clue as to what a 1975 "C", 1977 "C" or a 1972 "C" might feel like and how they would compare?

 

[Tarkiner]

Surely there's not going to be a lot of difference in the C profiles from '72, '75 and '77, even with the strat neck on the deluxe. Would the profile be much different than a modern C or perhaps closer to the deep C of the American Professional range? The deep C is my favourite neck profile of what I already have.

 

[Mekhem]

Reference: I enjoy the fender early 60's C (+/-.8 to +/- .95).

I was able to spend about 30 minutes with a AVII 72 Thinline and it felt a bit larger that from frets 1-7 and about the same through the rest of the neck maybe a little thinner. (If my life depended on a guess - .82-.92 or somewhere around there. A bit larger lower and a bit smaller higher up) Nice round C shape. I have no idea how that compares to the newer Modern C/Deep C carves. I liked it.

Guitar itself was awesome. Great fretwork, very snappy, responsive to pick attack and volume/tone controls. Set up was spot on. Not as heavy as some of these seem to be.

I think it may be a while before you can go somewhere and do a direct a/b/c comparison of the models. It seems that some of these are kind of dribbling out, but that may be either slow supply lines or people buying before they hit the shelves.

 

[Tarkiner]

Reference: I enjoy the fender early 60's C (+/-.8 to +/- .95).

I was able to spend about 30 minutes with a AVII 72 Thinline and it felt a bit larger that from frets 1-7 and about the same through the rest of the neck maybe a little thinner. (If my life depended on a guess - .82-.92 or somewhere around there. A bit larger lower and a bit smaller higher up) Nice round C shape. I have no idea how that compares to the newer Modern C/Deep C carves. I liked it.

Guitar itself was awesome. Great fretwork, very snappy, responsive to pick attack and volume/tone controls. Set up was spot on. Not as heavy as some of these seem to be.

I think it may be a while before you can go somewhere and do a direct a/b/c comparison of the models. It seems that some of these are kind of dribbling out, but that may be either slow supply lines or people buying before they hit the shelves.

Thanks very much for that, helpful information. I'm reasonably confident in buying sight unseen which is good because that's my only option. I reckon these are going to sell quite well, particularly the thinline. The main problem I'm having at the moment is deciding which one to get. I'm settled on which colours I like but not the model. I don't really need another telecaster but these could well see me with another 2 or 3 before I'm done

 

[Tarkiner]

Just found some neck measurements and weights for the '75 Deluxe and '72 Thinline on the MusicZoo website,

'75 Deluxe:

• 7 lbs 14 oz.
• .840" Neck Thickness at 1st Fret
• .940" Neck Thickness at 12th Fret

'72 Thinline

• 7 lbs 13 oz.
• .780" Neck Thickness at 1st Fret
• .920" Neck Thickness at 12th Fret

The weights are closer than I thought they'd be, necks are more different than I expected.

 

[Matthias]

My ‘73 Deluxe is .84 at the first and .88 at the 12th. Also I see they list the nut at 1.65” when my ‘73 is much narrower, about 1-9/16”. I wonder is the neck profile changed mid 70s? Also I’m yet to see reference to whether this model has the narrow bridge spacing of the originals.

 

[Mekhem]

Just found some neck measurements and weights for the '75 Deluxe and '72 Thinline on the MusicZoo website,

'75 Deluxe:

• 7 lbs 14 oz.
• .840" Neck Thickness at 1st Fret
• .940" Neck Thickness at 12th Fret

'72 Thinline

• 7 lbs 13 oz.
• .780" Neck Thickness at 1st Fret
• .920" Neck Thickness at 12th Fret

The weights are closer than I thought they'd be, necks are more different than I expected.

Interesting - I wonder if the 77 is the same carve as the 72?

I have always liked the Look of the 70's deluxe's. Probably from seeing punk bands, well mostly faux punk bands, in the 80's. That said - and a complete aside - I have never really gotten along with the 4 knob control layout in guitars with the same B+N pickups. I just never seem to find that area where it makes sense. On stuff like the 70's custom with 2 different pickups I can work with that...

 

[John C]

My ‘73 Deluxe is .84 at the first and .88 at the 12th. Also I see they list the nut at 1.65” when my ‘73 is much narrower, about 1-9/16”. I wonder is the neck profile changed mid 70s? Also I’m yet to see reference to whether this model has the narrow bridge spacing of the originals.

My 1979 Lead II was definitely a 1 9/16" nut width; I think that was on purpose for the Lead series, but I also think that due to manufacturing variances some 1970s-era Fender necks did come out at 1 9/16" instead of 1 5/8".

But to give a bit more "room" on the necks Fender has been using 1.65" as their "vintage nut width" for decades now instead of an actual 1 5/8" (which is 1.625" in decimal format). I'm not sure when that change happened. I am going by memory, but I believe that the 1999 AVRI '62 Strat I had did measure 1.625". I sold that one in a fit of GAS in 2000, replaced it with another AVRI '62 Strat in 2002 that I believe measured 1.65" because it was a hair wider than the 2002 G&L ASAT Special Deluxe I owned at the same time. EBMM and G&L do use the actual 1.625" nut width; I've owned quite a few EBMMs that also had the 1.625" nut width.

For what it's worth 1 9/16" is 1.5626" in decimal format - which is pretty close to what Ibanez uses on the Andy Timmons models. Also Gibson was using 1 9/16" nut widths in the late 1960s - at least on SGs (Angus Young has a few with this width) and ES-335s (Larry Carlton's famous model has that width and they recreated the neck shape for the signature "Mr. 335" model they had out in the 2000s), and I think Alex Lifeson's '68 ES-335 did as well based on interviews.

 

[Matthias]

My 1979 Lead II was definitely a 1 9/16" nut width; I think that was on purpose for the Lead series, but I also think that due to manufacturing variances some 1970s-era Fender necks did come out at 1 9/16" instead of 1 5/8".

But to give a bit more "room" on the necks Fender has been using 1.65" as their "vintage nut width" for decades now instead of an actual 1 5/8" (which is 1.625" in decimal format). I'm not sure when that change happened. I am going by memory, but I believe that the 1999 AVRI '62 Strat I had did measure 1.625". I sold that one in a fit of GAS in 2000, replaced it with another AVRI '62 Strat in 2002 that I believe measured 1.65" because it was a hair wider than the 2002 G&L ASAT Special Deluxe I owned at the same time. EBMM and G&L do use the actual 1.625" nut width; I've owned quite a few EBMMs that also had the 1.625" nut width.

For what it's worth 1 9/16" is 1.5626" in decimal format - which is pretty close to what Ibanez uses on the Andy Timmons models. Also Gibson was using 1 9/16" nut widths in the late 1960s - at least on SGs (Angus Young has a few with this width) and ES-335s (Larry Carlton's famous model has that width and they recreated the neck shape for the signature "Mr. 335" model they had out in the 2000s), and I think Alex Lifeson's '68 ES-335 did as well based on interviews.

That doesn’t surprise me with the Lead… It used the same narrow bridge unit with the Deluxe (as well as the sealed tuners). EDIT - no, “the Strat” got the tuners not the Lead

 

[John C]

That doesn’t surprise me with the Lead… It used the same narrow bridge unit with the Deluxe (as well as the sealed tuners).

Sealed tuners must have been a late-run change; my Lead had the typical F tuners.

 

[Matthias]

Sealed tuners must have been a late-run change; my Lead had the typical F tuners.

Apologies! It was The Strat that got those, randomly! And the Starcaster had them too.

 

[Tarkiner]

I’m yet to see reference to whether this model has the narrow bridge spacing of the originals.

I've sent a query off to Fender regarding the string spacing. I wasn't aware about the narrow spacing on the original Deluxe models, handy to know.
The Deluxe being the only one of the 3 with a 9.5" radius might make a difference with the profile and the bridge spacing perhaps.

 

[Tarkiner]

Wildwood have a '75 Deluxe listed now,
7.97 lbs
.790 1st - .930 12th
much closer specs to the '72 Thinline that Music Zoo have listed. I reckon it's going to be much of a muchness across the board what you are going to get as far as depth in the various C period profiles goes.

 

[Tarkiner]

More Wildwood neck specs,

'72 Thinline
7.93 lbs, .800 1st - .930 12th

Couple more '75 Deluxes
8.40 lbs, .800 1st - .960 12th
7.69 lbs, .800 1st - .950 12th

Starting to see some trends, tolerances considered. Slightly thinner than your average deep C American Professional neck profile. I was hoping same or thicker but it is what it is. I can bear it.

 

[takauya]

That blue thinline looks hot.

 

[Tarkiner]

That blue thinline looks hot.

I think so too. The Custom isn't far behind it, none about yet AFAIK. I'd love one of each but I have other priorities at the moment unfortunately.

 

[Tarkiner]

So I got a reply from Fender regarding the bridge string spacing for the above 3 models that I'm interested in, WTAF?

"Thank you for reaching out to Fender about the string spacing on a few of the Telecaster models of the American Vintage II Line.
Unfortunately, we don’t carry a spec for this measurement. I can assure you all the string spacing on these guitars is made to be symmetrical, although we don’t supply factory string spacing measurement specs for these given how this can vary through inspection from manufacture to shipping to dealers etc.
I would recommend If you haven’t yet to visit your local Fender dealer to have a look/play/feel in person If these would be right for you, and can have setup to your ideal string spacing."

 

[Tarkiner]

Also I’m yet to see reference to whether this model has the narrow bridge spacing of the originals.

So the bridge string spacing of the originals was narrower than modern deluxes and/or the custom and thinline models of that era? I've replied to Fender for more general information on the bridge string spacing of the AV II '73 Deluxe specifically.

 

[Mekhem]

Wait... What? They publish that for some of thier models dont they?

 

[Tarkiner]

Wait... What? They publish that for some of thier models dont they?

Indeed I thought it strange. The response seems to imply that they aren't releasing the bridge spacing specifically for this series. That's the way I read it but it will be interesting what more information I can find out with further correspondence.