8" 4ohm speakers.....

[flyingbanana]

So we have Jensen, Jupiter, WGS, Weber and an Eminence.

How many different speakers have you guys tried? I am now looking to replace the original speaker in a 70 Vibro Champ I picked up very recently. Amp sounds pretty awesome, but clearly can't reach its potential with the stock speaker....although anything under full volume sounds sooooo sweet.

Also, many replacement speakers are ceramic. I always thought these little amps worked better with alnico speakers.

Need some input.

Mucho Garcia.

Oh, and here's a pic of the speaker in it now.

 

[Silverface]

Before you do that - is that filter cap can original? It looks old. If so that should be the first thing on your "to do " list. Sound issues could be slow response and excess sag due to low filtering.

 

[flyingbanana]

Before you do that - is that filter cap can original? It looks old. If so that should be the first thing on your "to do " list. Sound issues could be slow response and excess sag due to low filtering.

Ok...ok, I'll have my guy check it. Makes sense, although there isn't much in the way of the usual old amp sag like my 55 year old Univox had before having it recapped. Now that thing had s OK much sag, I had to put casters on the damn thing just to keep it off the floor. Lol

 

[RLee77]

Before you do that - is that filter cap can original? It looks old. If so that should be the first thing on your "to do " list. Sound issues could be slow response and excess sag due to low filtering.

I'm hoping that cap (and the other e-caps) have been replaced at least once in the amp's life and it's not 47 years old.

Regarding the speaker, it's one of the hardest decisions to make because it's so hard to know what each of the many types will sound like in your amp in your environment… if you could find one of those "speaker shootout" vids with a champ on youtube that would help.

 

[Dacious]

Bear in mind, small amps can't push much power, you're going to get breakup with any speaker once vol goes past 6, especially on single-ended amps: I getting farting you need to reduce bass to 3-4.

I had a Weber Sig alnico straight cone in my 5F1 Clapton (original Fender Special Design speaker) and a ribbed one in my 78 VC. Both great, the ribbed suits the smoother SFVC best IMO. And they aren't expensive.

But you may find nothing replicates the stock speaker. They're pretty good if not that efficient.

I'd agree - new caps will make more difference than a speaker if your caps are dried out and old. You lose everywhere - treble, bass, mids.

 

[zippofan]

It's not an alnico, but I love the sound of the Eminence 820H I installed in my son's Bugera V5 (pre-Infinium). The amp sounded decent with the stock speaker, but the hemp cone of the Eminence warmed up that amp nicely, and now that it is broken in sounds way better than it's price would suggest.
I don't have any alnico 8", the Weber Signature alnico 6" I put in my Peavey Backstage is just a little too bright, but that amp isn't great to begin with. On the other hand, the alnico Sig 12 I have in a cheap Kustom cab with the Defender 5W head is terrific.

 

[BCblues55]

You might want to check out this article from this past March: https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/25370-for-swapping-8-speaker-review-roundup

I got the WGS speaker for my 1973 VC and couldn't be happier.

 

[uriah1]

Yea, I had that fender 8 with a tear. Got a big mag weber. Did not bond, I probably should have waited longer.
Plopped a Jensen c8r in there, and voila..all fender, all the time.

 

[charlie chitlin]

8" are not so plentiful, but I'm having amazing luck with old organ (or wherever) pulls from Ebay. Rola, Magnavox, etc. I found a killer 8" 4ohm for my old Magnatone awhile ago, and a few 12" that hang with my reconed p12r in every way.
It seems hard to go wrong with the old alnicos.
They usually run 12-20 bucks each, so you can afford to experiment.

 

[King Fan]

Charlie's idea is great. 8" Rola alnico magic. Or try an alnico Sig 8. I always ask CJ at Weber for advice on cones, etc.

If that doesn't float your boat, rethink. I'm an alnico guy. But noting these often had ceramics in that era, I put the Fat Jimmy ceramic 8 -- a modded WGS -- in mine. Low power sweetness reeaalllly likes ceramic presence.

 

[red57strat]

I've tried a few in my tweed Champ clone. A Weber Ceramic Signature 8, Alnico Signature 12S, CVA8 and a Midwest VOR Alnico 8.

The VOR Alnico was very dark and woody. Too dark for me.

The CVA8 is my favorite (it's currently in the amp). It's quite a bit brighter.

I think most people would prefer the Ceramic Signature (smooth cone) out of this bunch. It was dirty and not too dark.

 

[Commodore 64]

Best 8" speaker I've tried in a Champ or VibroChamp is: https://www.tedweber.com/8a125

It's also the only 8 I've tried other than the stock oxfords. Which I hate with a passion. It lives in a '65 Champ that a local harp player uses. He also thought it was a huge upgrade to the stock speaker.

 

[Silverface]

I'm hoping that cap (and the other e-caps) have been replaced at least once in the amp's life and it's not 47 years old.

I see more Champs with original cap cans than with new one. They rarely get updated unless something goes wrong with the amp or it's sold to an owner that knows what service to do.
And that one looks like it has absolutely untouched solder joints and the original style can.

be careful just having a "guy look at it". A good tech will recognize it as old and let you know it should be changed, but many only only do work specifically requested. Quite a few don't do cap jobs unless 1) you ask for it or 2) caps are visibly leaking. But an amp can work fine yet have filter caps ready to blow without warning.

 

[Old Tele man]

CTS/UTAH made 4", 8" and larger speakers too.

 

[WineCaster]

I just finished building a 5F2A (Tweed Princeton) and put it into the cab that I originally built for a 5F11 (Tweed Vibrolux) but wasn't a fan of that circuit. Anyway, I don't know off the top of my head if the Tweed princeton and Tweed Vibrolux cabinets are usually similar dimensions.

Running a new Weber Sig8 (smooth cone) into that cabinet is extremely pleasing. I tried a 10" Jensen first because I was afraid to like a 8" speaker but it was absolutely the right move.

 

[JDRNoPro]

Silverface's advice about checking caps is spot on. As far as speakers, I have tried a Weber Sig Alnico (now in my 5F1 clone) and a WGS ceramic. I really like the WGS in my SFVC. Some feel the Jupiter version of this speaker may be even better but I don't know......but really like the WGS in mine vs. stock. I also like it better in that amp vs. the Sig alnico - sounds "bigger" to my ears. Good thing is these speakers are relatively inexpensive.

 

[SnidelyWhiplash]

I love the WGS G8C in my '67 BFVC.

 

[flyingbanana]

Thanks for the comments and advice everyone. Still on the fence about speakers. Although the main choices seem to be either the Jupiter, WGS or possibly the Weber. Just can't make ip my mind.

 

[PhredE]

I'm happy you have a classic combo Fender tube amp. It's a shame you're limited to 4ohm options though. Now, if it were 8ohms.. oooh, you'd have many, many more options.

Can't recall if it does or not, but if the speaker mounts on studs (with bolts on back side) AND if you're into exercising a little creative license (but shouldn't alter the amp permanently--if you don't want to).. you could use a 6 1/2" speaker mounted on a cut-out which could then be bolted up on the stud mounts. So, in effect, adding a second 'extender' behind the existing baffle to mount a smaller driver. You'd have to use a fairly thin sheet of ply or similar to pull that off. I seem to run across many good 4 ohm 6 1/2" drivers these days -- especially outside of the normal realm of 'guitar speakers'.

Venturing into borderline 'off-topic' area..

One of the odd advantages of using a solid state amp is you can make that transition (4ohm->8ohm) very safely, if a person doesn't mind accepting less power output -- BUT -- on the plus side, you can replace an anemic inefficient speaker with an efficient one to counterbalance and 'make up' some of that otherwise 'lost' power. Just +3db increase in speaker efficiency is the approx. same as doubling amp power.

Also..

I posted this elsewhere, but if you're ever looking for a really nice vintage sounding 8" 8 ohm driver check out the Selenium (a division of JBL) and their PA drivers. I bought the 8PW3 a few years ago and put it in a separate cabinet and LOVE IT. It's got a very atypical response curve (compared to guitar speakers). I'll include a screenshot of it's response curve with my post.

 

[Old Tele man]

I'm happy you have a classic combo Fender tube amp. It's a shame you're limited to 4ohm options though. Now, if it were 8ohms.. oooh, you'd have many, many more options.

Can't recall if it does or not, but if the speaker mounts on studs (with bolts on back side) AND if you're into exercising a little creative license (but shouldn't alter the amp permanently--if you don't want to).. you could use a 6 1/2" speaker mounted on a cut-out which could then be bolted up on the stud mounts. So, in effect, adding a second 'extender' behind the existing baffle to mount a smaller driver. You'd have to use a fairly thin sheet of ply or similar to pull that off. I seem to run across many good 4 ohm 6 1/2" drivers these days -- especially outside of the normal realm of 'guitar speakers'.

Venturing into borderline 'off-topic' area..

One of the odd advantages of using a solid state amp is you can make that transition (4ohm->8ohm) very safely, if a person doesn't mind accepting less power output -- BUT -- on the plus side, you can replace an anemic inefficient speaker with an efficient one to counterbalance and 'make up' some of that otherwise 'lost' power. Just +3db increase in speaker efficiency is the approx. same as doubling amp power.

Also..

I posted this elsewhere, but if you're ever looking for a really nice vintage sounding 8" 8 ohm driver check out the Selenium (a division of JBL) and their PA drivers. I bought the 8PW3 a few years ago and put it in a separate cabinet and LOVE IT. It's got a very atypical response curve (compared to guitar speakers). I'll include a screenshot of it's response curve with my post.
View attachment 456714

Sounds like a good candidate for a Zobel RC Filter to flatten those higher peaks and raise the valleys.