69-71' Yamaha Acoustic Red Label Owners Club _ Please Sign In ;-)

[banjobill55]

I'm glad You figured it out, I'm about to go through it with mine. I haven't received it yet, it was just shipped and I'll have it Tuesday. It's coming with a snapped headstock that's hanging on by the veneer. It's going to need a lot of glue and tlc.

 

[CTGull]

I forgot to mention this here. The Yamaha Guitar Archive is gone!!! www.yamaha.com/apps/guitararchives/guitarchive2.asp I emailed Yamaha customer service and they said the whole website is going thru an overhaul and the Archive "should" come back.

This has been used by many for years to identify Yamaha guitars. It had all the specs for every model they ever made. Fortunately I was able to get an Excel file of it a couple years back and improved and added to it.

So last week I finally created the Yamaha Vintage FG forum that I laid out last year. http://yamahavintagefg.boards.net/

The data I got from Yamaha is available in the forum. It's greatly expanded and new data added. yamahavintagefg.boards.net/board/4/yamaha-fg-info

And a few papers I've written on the history of Yamaha FG's and neck resets. More to come.

 

[banjobill55]

HALP! My FG230 has a serial number that doesn't match any of the conventions on line. The number is: 786664. This is a red label Nippon Gakki.

 

[CTGull]

There will be a date code stamped in the inside in the format yy.mm.dd. The year will be the number of the Showa era, starting 1926 (I'm doing this from memory). Example: 44.12.28 is December 28th 1970. I have this explained in my forum YamahaVintageFG.net.

 

[CTGull]

Sunday I picked up a red label FG-150 on CraigsList. I've been looking for that model for a long time. There haven't been many on CraigsList less than 2 hours away, and only a couple on Shopgoodwill, all of them being in poor condition or I was too slow and lost it.

I saw the ad Friday when I got into work. The pictures looked minty. What really caught my eye was the old style "Reinforced Neck" truss rod cover. They were used on the Japan only 1966 & 1967 models, and it seems some of them made it onto the early US models. So I figured this had to be a 1968 model, the first year the FG models were imported into the US.

Even though the post was made 16 hours before (about 1pm the previous day) I replied, not having much hope for getting this semi-rare guitar. I was surprised when he got back to me 2 hours later. Due to scheduling conflicts we couldn't meet until Sunday morning. I hoped he wouldn't sell it out from under me.

My son and I drove 1.5 hours into NY state, just a few miles from the NJ border, meeting at the local Police Station. It rained most of the trip, the remnants of hurricane Harvey. After we crossed the Hudson river, on the newly opened Tappan Zee bridge, the rain suddenly stopped.

I had warned him I wanted to know the history of the guitar. It turns out there wasn't much. His wife bought it 45 years ago from the original owner, and she never played it. It's sat in the case for the last 45 years!! In the case was a Peter Paul & Mary songbook and a bunch of copied music sheets with the original owners guitar teachers contact information. The name Marty and a phone number was written on the back of one of the sheets.

I tuned it up and it produced its first musical tones in 45 years! It sounded OK, not quite the same as my revered FG-110. So I gave him the money and drove 1.5 hours back home to check the guitar out.

The first thing I did when I got back home was to use my cheap USB endoscope to check out the inside of the guitar. There is a 6 digit number stamped on the neck block. And then I found the date code farther inside. 42.3.17, confirming it was made in 1967!!! This has to be one of the first red label FG-150's imported into the US!!

This got me started checking for other FG's with 6 digit "serial numbers". I found a Youtube page with many sound samples of old FG's, listing the model, year, label color, and a partial serial number. A great wealth of information! He's obviously aware of the internal date codes and what the numbers mean, since he's Japanese. I will have to try to contact him and hope the language barrier doesn't block my request for further information.

The guitar is in excellent condition, with not much signs of playing. There are a handful of very small dings here and there, and minimal fret wear. The action is typical vintage Yamaha, barely playable. I'll probably replace the nut for one with a wider string spacing, and lower the saddle. Then put it away where it can't get damaged.

Oddly, the guitar weighs 3.93 lbs, 0.30 to 0.56 lbs more than my 3 FG-110's, which are the same body size. The back and sides are made from a different wood and the tuners are different than the FG-110, possibly explaining the weigh difference.

These are the pictures from the ad.

 

[CTGull]

WANTED – Data from your vintage Yamaha FG guitars. See the end of the post.

I’ve been collecting data on vintage Yamaha FG acoustic guitars for a few years. This past May Yamaha deleted their Yamaha Guitar Archive web page, pushing me to start a forum to share the info that I’ve collected, including all the data from the Yamaha Guitar Archive. I’ve written other articles on: the history of the Yamaha FG 1966-1981 & FG-3XX series; vintage Yamaha truss rod adjustment procedure; vintage Yamaha neck reset procedure; replacement nuts & saddles; Yamaha FG weights; Japanese emperor date codes; Republic of China date codes; and I’m working on many others.

My latest interest is decoding the mystery of the 6 & 7 digit serial numbers. It’s widely known that the 8 digit serial numbers start with the year as the first number. But the 6 & 7 digit numbers (located on the neck block) are just sequential numbers used by all the guitars they built, not just the FG’s. I’ve also found there are internal date codes that will reveal when the guitar was made.

Serial Number located on the neck block.

Date Code located on one of the interior sides of the guitar.

I’ve started a list of guitars I’ve found (including 3 of mine) with the model number, the serial number, and the date code, which will allow the 6 & 7 digit serial numbers to be grouped into a range for each year, allowing any 6 or 7 digit serial number to be cross referenced to the year it was made.

On YouTube I found a guy in Japan who’s posted short videos of many vintage FG guitars, with the year, model number, partial serial numbers, and in a most cases the internal date code. He’s obviously used the internal date codes to determine the years. I sent him a message asking if he saved all the information for these guitars, but I don’t know what will be lost in the language translation, of if he’ll even get back to me.

With this, and other data I’ve been finding, I’ve discovered even though Yamaha says the first Red Label models imported in the US where in 1968, I’ve found many Red Label FG guitars made in 1967. I’m also tracking the Green Label FG’s, the earliest models (1966-67) only made in Japan, that share the same pool of serial numbers. I’m looking for the transition between the Green and Red labels. I’ve also found the Green Label FG’s have a different truss rod cover, with “Reinforced Neck” on it, very different than the one you normally see. That cover made it onto the earliest FG’s imported into the US, before changing to the familiar one.

Truss Rod Cover on Green Label and very early Red Label FG's.

Regular Truss rod Cover used on Red Label FG's.

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WANTED – Could you please add to this thread with the following data from your vintage Green and Red label Nippon Gakki FG guitars that have serial numbers less than 8 digits, located on the neck block? I have 77 serial numbers so far, but only 31 of them have confirmed years based on the internal date code, and 22 of those had the internal date code listed.

Model number.

Label color.

Serial number on neck block (you can put an “X” in place of the last digit if you’d like).

Internal date code (I use flashlight and a cheap USB endoscope with my cell phone, or my cell phone camera if the strings are off.) This is very important to establish the date range of the serial numbers.

If it has the old style “Reinforced Neck” truss rod cover.

Any other information you’d like to share about the guitar.


Thank you for your assistance.

 

[CTGull]

This isn't an FG, but it's red!! A 1960's/70's Yamaha Guitars red velvet dealer banner. I won it on Shopgoodwill.com. I've only found 2 others on the internet, on eBay. 1 said he got it with some Yamaha guitars in the 70's, and another who got it from a store that had it hanging since they opened in 1969. Making me believe it could be from the 60's. I'm waiting for it to ship and the long trip from Oregon to CT. This has to be one of the coolest things a Yamaha FG guitar collector can find, especially with my limited budget.

I see the pictures link is dead. Here's a new one.

 

[sunbrst62]

FG 180
Red label
1444611
45 11 25
Not a reinforced logo
Bought new 5/71

 

[CTGull]

Thanks! Made November 25, 1970.

It's amazing that everyone assumed the 7 digit numbers starting with 1 are 1971 models when it's looking that they span from 1969 to possibly 1972. I have no useful data for 1971 & 72 models yet.

 

[sunbrst62]

Thank you for the info. Never knew about the stamped code inside. Perhaps I missed it above but didn't see the link to your webpage.
When the Yamaha site was active I exchanged emails with someone at Yamaha corporate involved with the archives. I inquired about the 7 digit codes. He stated that they no longer had records pertaining to those codes. He didn't mention any other codes used in this era. After owning this guitar for 46 years thanks to you I have a date. I was 17 when I bought this guitar!
I no longer have the email from Yamaha but one thing that I do remember him stating- according to him Yamaha Japan stopped production of guitars in the fall of 1971. Anything after that time was Taiwan produced. Thanks again.

 

[CTGull]

http://yamahavintagefg.boards.net/

I think they stopped production of guitars sent to the US but they continued producing models for Japan. They are the Orange label models. They have their own set of serial numbers. I've seen a few with 5 digits, but I'm ignoring that for now.

 

[sunbrst62]

Thanks for the link see post #399 above!

 

[CTGull]

HA!! I went thru every post in this thread last night, mining for data. I saved that post!!

 

[CTGull]

I just noticed your FG-180 is 19,200 numbers and 23 days newer than my favorite FG-110.

 

[Mastic]

I've got a couple at the moment:

FG-180, red-label "Nippon Gakki" #1299378
FG-150, red-label "Nippon Gakki" #1424773

Anyone know how/could explain to me how to date these two? Also of note: these two, and also a 140 I've had in the past, have flat intonation (like 10 cents) and not enough room to adjust the contact point of the saddle forward enough to correct. I'm looking at a bridge relocation for both in order to play in tune. Can't fill and re-slot either as there's no room on the treble side.

 

[CTGull]

I've got a couple at the moment:

FG-180, red-label "Nippon Gakki" #1299378
FG-150, red-label "Nippon Gakki" #1424773

Anyone know how/could explain to me how to date these two? Also of note: these two, and also a 140 I've had in the past, have flat intonation (like 10 cents) and not enough room to adjust the contact point of the saddle forward enough to correct. I'm looking at a bridge relocation for both in order to play in tune. Can't fill and re-slot either as there's no room on the treble side.

The actual date is in a date code on the inside of the guitar. You would have to remove the strings and use a flashlight and your cell phone camera to find it. That's actually the most important part of what I'm looking for. Relating the sequential serial numbers to the date codes. It will probably be 45.??.??, with 45 being the year 1970, and the ? being the month and day.

By what data I have your FG-180 was made mid 1970. The FG-140 would be late 1970.

If you could find those date codes I'd really appreciate it.

 

[Mastic]

The actual date is in a date code on the inside of the guitar. You would have to remove the strings and use a flashlight and your cell phone camera to find it. That's actually the most important part of what I'm looking for. Relating the sequential serial numbers to the date codes. It will probably be 45.??.??, with 45 being the year 1970, and the ? being the month and day.

By what data I have your FG-180 was made mid 1970. The FG-140 would be late 1970.

If you could find those date codes I'd really appreciate it.

@CTGull ,

Here is what's inside the 180. Looks to be "45.7 –", the next digit possibly buried under kerf lining, and then a disconnected "6" in larger font (part # for matching/assembly as on the 150 below in white?):

and the 150 appears to be "45.11.–7" on both sides, though the marking is not the greatest:

 

[CTGull]

EXCELLENT!! This numbers fall perfectly inline with the data I already have.

I really need to find guitars from 1971 & 72. I probably have 12 numbers but they're either a serial number or a date code, no pairs.

 

[Mastic]

EXCELLENT!! This numbers fall perfectly inline with the data I already have.

I really need to find guitars from 1971 & 72. I probably have 12 numbers but they're either a serial number or a date code, no pairs.

I'm just now reading back on your posts in this thread. Sorry I missed that! Just saw a notification that the thread was active and posted away asking my question without having caught up. Good work.

 

[CTGull]

I made a website about vintage Yamaha FG's last weekend. It should be easier to find info without having to wade thru posts on my forum. Check it out and let me know what you think. http://yamahavintagefg.com/