1. Win a Broadcaster or one of 3 Teles! The annual Supporting Member Giveaway is on. To enter Click Here. To see all the prizes and full details Click Here. To view the thread about the giveaway Click Here.

'63 Fender Tremolux - which grill cloth is correct

Discussion in 'Amp Tech Center' started by Digga, Mar 7, 2021.

  1. Digga

    Digga TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    19
    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2021
    Location:
    UK
    I'm hoping that any of you who own or are familiar with Blonde Tremolux amps can advise me please?

    I have had a '63 Tremolux head for some time now but without its matching speaker cab. I was recently lucky to acquire a Tremolux 2x10 speaker cab and the two of them together are great. The cab has been re-covered but its blonde Tolex is a pretty good match for the original head covering. However, the grill cloth of the head and refurbished cab are slightly different. The cab has what I believe Fender refers to as Wheat cloth. The head's grill cloth is quite similar but has a gold thread running through the cloth and less pronounced horizontal lines. From a distance they look quite similar but up close the sparkle of the head's cloth is quite noticeable.

    Which of the two grill cloths is correct for a '63 Tremolux, the plain one or the sparkly one?

    I should mention that the amp chassis is a 6G9B date-stamped around April '63 but the valve chart in the head cab is for an AB763 with ink date code early '64. I don't know whether the head cab was replaced at some time or whether a 6G9B chassis was simply installed in one of the later transition blackface blonde cabs before they became black Tolex. Did those transition models perhaps introduce the gold sparkle cloth?

    The main thing obviously is that the amp and cab sound great together but I'd like to see the two matching and would replace the refurbished speaker cab's grill cloth if the head's sparkle cloth is the correct one for '63.

    I'd appreciate your help. Thanks.

    Digga
     
  2. schmee

    schmee Doctor of Teleocity

    Posts:
    14,603
    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2003
    Location:
    northwest
    Pics would help. New cloth now wont match vintage cloth. The rectangles in the cloth are larger. You may have to redo both to match. I would look on line at examples of amps from your same year. I don't remember much sparkle in the blonde or wheat cloth....?

    The variation even in stock units is wide: many people don't know that the brown faceplates come in two shades also. One is nearly black it's so dark brown, and the other is very brown.
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2021
  3. Lowerleftcoast

    Lowerleftcoast Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    3,223
    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2019
    Location:
    california
    The sparkly one is correct.

    I will be watching this thread. I would like to have good match for a 64 Showman.
     
  4. Chicago Matt

    Chicago Matt Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    71
    Posts:
    3,122
    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2014
    Location:
    Woodstock
    Man, you've got some really nice pieces there!
     
  5. schmee

    schmee Doctor of Teleocity

    Posts:
    14,603
    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2003
    Location:
    northwest
    Sorry, not mine! I just found a pic for comparison!
    I had a 63 Tremolux though, about 10 years ago. Wish I had kept it. (why do I always end up saying that?) I had a Cab made for it. I think JD Newell, but it might have been Mojotone. Lightweight. Great set up. Although I liked it with the back off the cab.
     
    Chicago Matt likes this.
  6. Chicago Matt

    Chicago Matt Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    71
    Posts:
    3,122
    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2014
    Location:
    Woodstock
    Gotcha, I'm sorry :(.

    I went to a jam several decades ago where there were 4 guitar players. One guy had a Twin, I had an Ampeg V4, One guy had a Marshall half stack. This other guy had an old brown Tremolux with 2x10" cabinet. His only effect was an echoplex set to a short slapback. He had it cranked up pretty good. The rest of us were still too loud so we stuck an SM57 in front of his. It was the best guitar tone I'd ever heard. There was a lesson there but it still took me many years to realize it. :)
     
    schmee likes this.
  7. Digga

    Digga TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    19
    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2021
    Location:
    UK
    Thanks for your replies schmee and Lowerleftcoast. Much appreciated.

    Here are some pics:

    [​IMG]

    1) Head cab gold sparkly cloth


    [​IMG]
    2) Speaker cab cloth, duller and different weave.

    The head cab's cloth has more gold sparkle than shows in pic 1.

    BTW That comment about two shades of brown faceplate was timely because a day or two ago I saw a combo amp that was said to be a '62 Princeton but had what looked like a black faceplate, even though the graphics were correct for brownface. I hadn't realised that there were two shades of brown.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2021
  8. schmee

    schmee Doctor of Teleocity

    Posts:
    14,603
    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2003
    Location:
    northwest
    Maybe one is installed inside out?
    later:
    Nope, I just checked some I have here and there's a brown stripe on both sides.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2021
  9. Digga

    Digga TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    19
    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2021
    Location:
    UK
    Now that's an interesting thought. Tomorrow I'll take the back off and remove one speaker to look at the rear of the cloth. Thanks.
     
  10. schmee

    schmee Doctor of Teleocity

    Posts:
    14,603
    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2003
    Location:
    northwest
    On second thought I dont think so. I just checked some I have with a brown stripe and the brown strip is readily evident on both sides.... Is your head cloth original? Looks awful clean...
     
  11. Digga

    Digga TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    19
    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2021
    Location:
    UK
    It is as far as I know. It's a bit battered and torn but that doesn't mean it's nearly 60 years old. It looks better in the photo than it does in the flesh.

    The amp was in an attic for 30 years so I know the cloth is at least 40 years old.
     
  12. archetype

    archetype Fiend of Leo's

    Posts:
    5,705
    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2005
    Location:
    Williamsville NY
    I've got a blonde, 2 x 10 Newell cab that I'm going to make a 2/3 back for. Newell insists on adding two 3 or 4 inch round ports in the baffle board, for some reason. I blocked mine with pine. The low end was just too flabby.
     
  13. archetype

    archetype Fiend of Leo's

    Posts:
    5,705
    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2005
    Location:
    Williamsville NY
    Can you show us a pic of the front of the head, showing the panel? I'd like to know which circuit it actually is.
     
  14. Digga

    Digga TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    19
    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2021
    Location:
    UK
    Here's the requested pic.

    [​IMG]

    From that you will see that the cab belongs to an AB763 blackface Tremolux with badge and handle appropriate to that model (and valve chart inside). If the covering and grille cloth are original (see earlier post) it would suggest the cab was one of the transition models where blackface amps still wore blonde livery. However, I am 100% sure that the amp itself is an early 1963 6G9B. As mentioned above, it had been in storage in an attic for 30+ years so it not only needed thorough cleaning and re-capping but there were also a number of other issues to deal with, some due to age but a few due it it being 'repaired' by someone who shouldn't have been allowed near it. I feel I know that circuit like the back of my hand ;)

    Anyway, coming back to my original question, the one firm answer I have had is from Lowerleftcoast which makes the grill cloth of the head cab correct so unless anyone disagrees I'll change the grill cloth of the refurbished speaker cab to match the amp head as best I can. I may order a sample of this one: https://www.tubeampdoctor.com/en/grill-cloth-tan-brown-gold-60s-blond-fender-amps?number=FGCT.G-100 to see how good a match it might be.
     
    Wally likes this.
  15. schmee

    schmee Doctor of Teleocity

    Posts:
    14,603
    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2003
    Location:
    northwest
    I just dont see the horizontal brown lines on your amp head that link shows.... they seem much more light ?
    I didn't realize they went to the BF logo and handle near the end of the Blonde era, but that may help with my confusion on the lack of a hole in the bottom of the head cab (so the Dogbone handle doesn't interfere) being missing on some Blond heads!
     
  16. Digga

    Digga TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    19
    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2021
    Location:
    UK
    Yes, that's right about the brown line and the link sample also looks more yellow although that may just be the reproduction. For a few Euros it's worth a punt on a sample piece. I'm hoping that, even if it is not exactly the same, it might be closer to the head grill cloth than the present speaker cab cloth is.

    Although that supplier is in Germany the cloth is said to be made in the USA so I'd consider it likely to be a reasonable match.
     
    schmee likes this.
  17. schmee

    schmee Doctor of Teleocity

    Posts:
    14,603
    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2003
    Location:
    northwest
    Does your amp head have the oval hole in the bottom?
     
  18. Digga

    Digga TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    19
    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2021
    Location:
    UK
    Yes it does.

    When I first got the Tremolux and removed the chassis I looked inside the cab to see if there were holes for a dogbone handle. There weren't so I took it that the flat handle was the original type - and probably the original handle judging by the condition of it.

    Someone had at sometime in the distant past mounted a two-pin mains connector in the middle of the back panel. The panel itself was covered with rough blonde Tolex so probably came from an earlier head. The connector looked awful and was soon removed and the opening infilled. Then a captive three core cable was installed, the ground switch disconnected and the death cap removed.
     
    schmee likes this.
  19. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    38,721
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2003
    Location:
    Lubbock, TX
    digga, according to Teagle and Sprung in their book, the gold thread wheat straw was used only in 1963 and 1964....for the later months there it would have been the transition period. So, what you are considering will be as close as you will find, I am thinking.
     
    Digga likes this.
  20. Digga

    Digga TDPRI Member

    Posts:
    19
    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2021
    Location:
    UK
    Thank you for that Wally, that's really very helpful. Unfortunately I don't have access to a copy of the 'Fifty Years' book. Used copies are rare in the UK and are priced upwards of $100!

    Once I get a sample of the cloth I linked to above I will report back here.

    Thanks again.
    Digga
     
    Wally likes this.
IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.