5G13 VS 6G8

Discussion in 'Amp Central Station' started by Haloskater24, Apr 4, 2020.

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  1. Haloskater24

    Haloskater24 TDPRI Member

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    What are the differences in these two circuits ? What’s the difference in sound ? I never really hear anyone talk about the Brown Vibrasonic. @Wally ive heard it’s a “Low powered” Brown twin. Any details about either Circuit is welcomed!
     
  2. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Halo, I am not the one to speak directly of those amps....very little experience there....I have never seen the brown Vibrasonic or a 6G8/A/B Twin. Until someone with more experience comes along....
    The Vibrasonic was the first Fender amp to be built with the complex vibrato circuit. The 5G13 schematic is the forerunner for the first of the smaller ...2x6L6....6G amps...Bandmaster, Super. The 6G13, with a slightly different trem circuit, is the basis for the first 6G8 Twin and 6G14 (Showman) amps. The A scheme for the Bandmaster and Super is the same as the A circuits for the big amps....these circuits utilize 6 x 12A-7s compared to the 5 x 12A-7s of the earlier vibrato amps.
    The only one of these amps that I have owned was a 6G7A Bandmaster....about 30 years ago. 6G Brown and Blonde amps are,ime, the rarest of Fenders. I have owned a 6G6B Bassman...the Brian Setzer choice, that Bandmaster, one 6G3 Deluxe, and three 6G2 Princetons. I had a shot a 6G14 and a 6G8 one Saturday but walked away.....only to have a buyer from Dallas visit my shop later that day after having bought the two amps. I thought the seller was asking a bit too much....I could have make a mistake there. That is the only 4x6L6 6G amp I have had a shot at buying in my area. This was almost 30 years ago...he wanted $3K for the pair.
     
  3. Haloskater24

    Haloskater24 TDPRI Member

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    Seems like theres very few people who have experience with the 5G13 let alone the 6GX Amps. Thanks wally
     
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  4. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    The Vibrasonic was the most expensive Fender amp in 1959 and 1960....$479. That would be $4257.96 in 2020 dollars. The Showman amps eclipsed it in 1961. $600 for a 1961 1-15 Showman....$5337 and some change. The Double Showman was $800 in 1962....
    $7111.42!! The last 6G14 Dual Showman was $915....$8133.69!!! That will explain why we don’t see many of them, right? the lowly Banmaster 6G amp’s were $389.....$3457.93. A 5F1 Champ in the early ‘60’s was $62...$551.00.
     
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  5. Haloskater24

    Haloskater24 TDPRI Member

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    So basically the early fender amps were pretty expensive compared to today’s prices ?
     
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  6. scooteraz

    scooteraz Friend of Leo's

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    They were all Custom Shop, in essence.
     
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  7. Haloskater24

    Haloskater24 TDPRI Member

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    Hmm I wonder how those blues guys like Otis Rush or Albert Collins we’re able to get their hands on Basically brand new(At the time) Fender guitars and Amps. I’m guessing second hand/ pawn shops ? I always thought fender was the working mans guitar back in the 50s and 60s but it’s seems like they went for a pretty penny new.
     
  8. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    A working man will find a way to acquire the necessary tools, ime. Imho, the current price of what most people buy..both in guitars and amps....exemplifies the fact that one can buy usable examples of both for less real, comparative money than at any time before. That doesn’t mean that what people can afford is better than what they could/would afford back then. And.....the standard of living in the U.S.has been in decline for almost 50 years, so there are more of us who cannot afford what could be afforded back then. I bought a new 1966 ES-345 when I was 16....hard work paid for it. How many lower, middle class 16 year olds can get a job that would afford them the ability to pay for a $4400 Gibson? That is what I paid for that guitar in today’s dollar. earl Ray Music here in Lubbock took the Gibson Les Paul(SG) Junior that my parents had paid $166 for in trade. I owed $400, and the store let me sign a note for $400.....no questions asked and no co-signer even though my father was standing beside e. I paid it off in 10 weeks at $40 a week.....that is $310 a week for 10 weeks. Where today can a 16 year old find a job washing and lubing cars for $13.50 an hour, which is what the $1.75 @ hour wage I was getting? the world changes..... hey, where can you find a music store that would let a 16 year old sign a note for $3097??? No interest!???.


    And....a lot of that Chocago blues music in the ‘50s was recorded using Gibson amps....which were not inexpensive, either.
     
  9. ocduff

    ocduff Tele-Meister

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    The Vibrosonic I recall playing and spending time with was a center volume model. It had the pinkish Toledo and lighter brown control panel. And oxblood with gold stripe cloth.

    I wasn’t super knowledgeable about tube amps - this was the late 90’s in a vintage guitar store where I worked. It was one of a hundred cool amps they had BUT even then it was considered special and unique from a collectibility standpoint.

    It had a JBL and - lacking a tube rectifier - I didn’t find much of interest there.

    I was loaned a blonde Showman at the time for recording and it had a single 15” JBL. I don’t recall being super impressed.

    Where am I going with this...well just a look at the layouts with show the similarities and differences of the two amps, but really the 6g8 and 6G13 would not be all that much different besides the obvious speaker lineup and amount of power tubes.

    I have never seen or played a Twin of that era. They were rare. Really, the Brownface era did see significant revisions from the 5G to 6G, almost to make them different amps, but comparing any 5G or 6G amp, to other 5G or 6G, respectively, is a parallel line minus a few values here or there to compensate for speaker and OT and tubes.
     
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  10. BobbyZ

    BobbyZ Doctor of Teleocity

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    Pretty amazing looking at old price sheets, nothing was cheap back then. Today people spend 1,000 bucks on a guitar or amp and they really think they went all out on the "fancy gear". Reality is they bought cheap crap. :)
    1982 I bought a new Les Paul Custom for $750, I was 17. The cheapest "BLEM" I saw at a store was $850 but my brother knew a guy, that knew a guy, that knew a guy from Gibson and I got a deal, it's not a blem.
    I spent that whole summer on the road with the old man sandblasting and painting, I didn't get paid other than a 20 dollar bill if I was home on a weekend. But to this day the old man "bought" me that guitar. Somehow after all the divorces I still have it. It's made in Nashville and if I would've known then I would've bought an older one. :)
     
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  11. Haloskater24

    Haloskater24 TDPRI Member

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    I honestly think the JBL speaker put you off. I’ve never been a fan of those unless used for Surf music. Dick Dale is the only person I’ve heard make JBL’s sound great and fat(well that plus his insanely heavy string gauge). You say the difference between 5G amps and 6G amps are very noticeable? Could you explain a bit more on that ? I know very little about the Brown/Blonde amps.
     
  12. Haloskater24

    Haloskater24 TDPRI Member

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    You could of got a Burst man!:)
     
  13. Haloskater24

    Haloskater24 TDPRI Member

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    I hear you on that Wally. I guess it’s better to just save up and get quality gear and just let your fingers do the rest. I think that’s where most people get screwed up with gear. They try and take steps to better gear, I feel like that’s a waste of time unless you’re an absolute beginner and not sure if you want to continue playing guitar. I’ve too fallen guilty to that but I’m planning to just save up and get something good that I won’t need to “step up” in a few years.
     
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  14. BobbyZ

    BobbyZ Doctor of Teleocity

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    It's a tobacco burst. Lol
    Really been a great guitar but yeah back then I might've a scored a late 50s burst.
    I seriously knew nothing about the whole "vintage thing" till the '90s when I was looking for a used made in USA Strat. Guy in some little town music store thought I was out looking for local yocals to score a vintage guitar. After getting ticked at me I finally convicted him I really had no idea and he gave me a copy of Vintage Guitar. Then I thought about all the "old crap" I could've got cheap. :)
     
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  15. ocduff

    ocduff Tele-Meister

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    JBL’s are cool - I think you need to be pushing them to make those cones move. They are too heavy duty for low volume use. I prefer light cones and speakers that break up when the tubes do.

    As for the 5G series - it’s hard to advise you. So many of those were prototypes or transitional with constant changes - I’ve heard Brownfaces that sounds great but most sound a bit flat to me. Still, if dialed in right they sound great.

    I heard a brown Super I’ll never forget around the same time. Was very original and had the Jensens in it. Dark chocolate chewiness.

    Truly, they are all Fender amps. They will sound great. Go try and play some unless you are buying for collectibility.

    A 6G8 Twin is a Showman in combo form.

    If I can be frank, I’ve been duped by the persuasiveness of “cult” worship of rare and amazing amps, like the author of the article or post has stumbled upon some unknown Holy Grail - and I am not doubting them - but truly that kind of enthusiasm wears off if the amp is truly just a good amp and not amazing.

    Which amps did Fender first reissue and which of those are still in production. That should probably tell us something. I don’t think a 6G8 Twin is going to beat even a tired old 1958 Bassman or a 1966 Deluxe Reverb in terms of usability, playability, and tone.
     
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  16. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    I think and advise that a person needs no more than one inexpensive guitar and amp. If one proves that they have the interest, ability and drive, then the next equipment they buy should be something that has lasting quality. When I was six, I got a Silvertone Harmony acoustic for Christmas...no lessons, no one around to play with....a learned a few chords. When I started lessons at age of 12, I had a Gibson L.P.(SG) Junior and a Gibson Ga-5.
     
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  17. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    in 1982, an original ‘burst was already worth more than that new LPC that Bobby bought.
     
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  18. BobbyZ

    BobbyZ Doctor of Teleocity

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    Very true! But there had to a few around owned by people that didn't know what they had, probably a real long shot though even then.
    In '82 I probably could've scored an old Tele or some sweet tweed amps for peanuts though.
    But seriously I was 17 and even though I knew EVERYTHING at 17, I didn't know squat. ;)
     
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  19. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Oh yeah....I bought a new Ampeg Dan Armstrong in a store in San Angelo, TX in 1972. They had a sunburst Paul of some sort WAAAY up high on top of the cases in which the Normal guitars hung. I kick myself for never asking about that Les Paul!! It had to have been the real deal.....and I could have afforded it being a single guy in the USAF.
     
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