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Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by Stanford Guitar, Jul 19, 2021.
Who was at fault? It looked to me like Verstappen turned in on Hamilton.
I agree. Hamilton backed out of it. If those that wish to argue choose to do so, then answer this - why did Verstappen suddenly gain a cars length advantage?
Nobody, race incident.
Fault or not, I found Mr Horner's comments pretty disgusting.
Mind you, I suspect I would be fairly bad tempered if I was married to Ginger Spice!
Of all of the Hamilton‘s „racing incidents“ when someone else „just turned in on him“ and the other guy ended out of the track, this one was by far clearest demonstration how good he has mastered this sneaky maneuver. This is seen the clearest on Lewis‘ onboard. He had picked the line like he is taking the corner completely alone and there is no car next to him. He had both the motive and the means to take Max out. Took a gamble and it paid off, even with the penalty.
A big big shame, I would like to see more good racing like the few corners before the incident.
I thought it was just a racing incident. I was surprised Hamilton got a penalty. I'm glad he overcame it for the win. I thought the lobbying of the race officials that went on over the teams' radios was pretty pathetic. They should ban that.
I'm no expert, but it seems like they are getting too touchy on penalties. There have been several recently that looked like racing incidents to me. Racing is going to be boring if these guys are too afraid to make risky moves. The first lap of yesterday's race was one of the most exciting in a long time. The two best cars and best drivers going after each other all out for the lead in what is going to be a very close contest for the championship.
I think by the FIA's rules, penalising Hamilton was fair. Verstappen was ahead into the corner and Lewis was not tight to the apex.
The stewards' document actually mentions that both drivers could have done more to avoid a crash, which I'd also say is true. I think Max was caught out by Lewis actually not backing out like he has done all season.
This is a pretty poor take. Contact there could easily end Lewis' race and leave Max free to scamper off into the distance. Implying he took him out on purpose is ridiculous.
Hamilton wanted the lead; he was not going to give in.
Verstappen was in the lead; he was not going to give in.
Hamilton wanted to send a message that he is not giving in.
Verstappen wanted to send a message that he is not giving in.
Regardless of who I think is at fault, this has been coming all season. Two top level drivers who are looking to get or keep the upper hand.
I just hope this is not a preview of the rest of the season.
It is sad this happened on such a fast corner; the fact that Verstappen is (relatively) unharmed was the good news of the whole incident.
For anyone's interest, Red Bull's Christian Horner said this about an aggressive overtake by Max Verstappen at this year's Spanish Grand Prix:
"Turn 1 was mega. I mean, that was full Max Verstappen - he was just going for it - and he positioned the car fantastically well... He tucked in, got a little bit of a tow, and a bit of momentum. And yeah, he just braked later and ran the car wide. Thankfully Lewis had got out of it because otherwise he would have ended up in the fence"
This won't be the last time one of these two gets aggressive with the other, I suspect.
Hamilton's fault. Verstappen had the faster car. Hamilton couldn't make a clean break so he took him out.
Fastest corner on one of the fastest tracks. It's like Russell taking out Bottas. Contrary to his claim Hamilton wasn't 'almost alongside' - he hit Max's rear tyre with his front.
The fact he understeered almost off the track after the collision shows he was going so quick on such a shallow entry he was going to hit anyone else on the normal fast line. He would have exceeded track limits.
I'm no fan of either driver - but the rules are quite clear. You must not drive into another car just because you're quick into the corner on a different line and Hamilton has done this repeatedly going back to Rosberg era.
I think they're a bunch of sulky entitled boy-men.so don't care but that's my opinion.
Classic PIT maneuver.
Racing incident. I like Red Bull > Merc and have never been a big Hamilton supporter, but Horner's sanctimony is hilarious given Verstappen's history even this season.
Rubbin’ is racin’…
Rubbin' open-wheel cars, though, is askin' for trouble.
But I agree that this was just a racing incident.
Hamilton took out the faster competitor because he wasn’t getting his way this season. He has form with this manoeuvre, and in this case it paid off, despite the penalty. Stewards penalty was appropriate - don’t forget they see much more than just the footage released to the press, including team telemetry etc. Senna V Prost all over again. Hamilton’s developed a god-complex and a clear sense of entitlement, and so I expect more of the same this season….
Why would it be ridiculous? If Louis saw Max was faster and that he would probably win the race and gain more advantage in the championship, a choice where he gets all the points or neither of them gets the points seems rather logical and play in his favor.
The whole conversation with FIA from both sides was hilarious, but Toto is the winner with his "Michael, I have just sent you an email with diagrams, have you received that?" in the middle of the race...
My view is that it was a racing incident.
Max has been real aggressive all year and LH has on occasion had to back out to avoid trouble. My guess is he just decided that Sunday was the day wasn’t going to back off.
I think that LH went in too hot, hit the brakes late causing him to drift out; Max would have been aware he was there and maybe cut in sharper than maybe necessary to stop him. Elements from both but initiated by Hamilton going for a marginal gap.
Really I’d prefer to see racing where they are going for the marginal gaps and on occasion falling off rather than tiptoeing around afraid to pass.
Because no driver writes off their own chances of victory on lap 1 like that. Mercedes started 2-3 on the grid. Max had the faster car but Mercedes had a strategy advantage.
It was also not a given that Lewis would come off no worse than Max. Inside cars can come off worse in side by side incidents too.
And if Lewis was intent on taking Max out he wouldn't have slowed at all. On the corner approach they're side by side, but Lewis slows earlier due to his tighter inside line. He messes up his line and misses the apex which is why he hits Max's rear wheel. But if his intent was a collision he could easily have easily just stayed on the throttle.