2014 article: "Why I Hope To Die At 75"

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Colo Springs E

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Why I Hope to Die at 75

Article is from The Atlantic, hopefully it allows you to read, if you're curious.

Author is Ezekiel Emanuel, a (retired, I think?) oncologist, bioethicist, and a vice provost of the University of Pennsylvania.

His article spends a good bit of time on his primary concern with aging: the quality of your life nearly always worsens, and in many cases, significantly. He is particularly fearful of dementia--as am I. I largely agree with many things put forth in his article, particularly this:

"...over the past 50 years, health care hasn’t slowed the aging process so much as it has slowed the dying process."

Meaning, we may have found ways to delay death and thus extend the number of years we have here... but we haven't necessarily found ways to extend good, quality years of life.

He goes on to say, "but here is a simple truth that many of us seem to resist: living too long is also a loss. It renders many of us, if not disabled, then faltering and declining, a state that may not be worse than death but is nonetheless deprived. It robs us of our creativity and ability to contribute to work, society, the world. It transforms how people experience us, relate to us, and, most important, remember us. We are no longer remembered as vibrant and engaged but as feeble, ineffectual, even pathetic."

When asked if a couple months ago, has anything has for him since he wrote the infamous 2014 article, Emanuel said, "I wouldn't say nothing." Emanuel's partner does not agree with his plan, and "she would like me to consider preventative measures like a flu vaccine. A lot will depend on whether I really am a rare outlier** at 75, and I'm not deceiving myself. That will be the biggest challenge . . . We are in discussions," Emanuel said. (in his article, he indicates he's not going to kill himself or live unnecessarily dangerously when he hits the 75ish mark... but he also won't actively try to extend his life with vaccines, cancer treatment, etc. He would seek palliative care, but not curative care)

(**ie, someone exceptionally fit and healthy)

As I said, I agree with a lot of what he says in his article... but it's also interesting he seems to be leaving the door open for a bit more "flexibility" than his earlier adamant stance :)
 

Happy Enchilada

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My wife has instructions that if I ever get to the point where I need assistance using the latrine, she is to leave a loaded pistol out on the breakfast table with a post-it attached that reads "DO THE RIGHT THING."
Following that, she has instructions to wait for the big bang and then go get a mop and bucket ...
 

BigDaddyLH

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Seems odd that he would stop taking vaccines.

Anyhowdy, I see a large ranges of living conditions in 70-year-olds. Some can barely walk, others are out skiing.

I'm glad Canada has MAID (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euthanasia_in_Canada) (Canadians don't typically leave pistols on the breakfast table), but it's not on speed-dial on my phone.
 
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Stubee

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I do believe one’s personal view of how long they want to live and in what state or condition frequently changes, later in life.

I’m 72 and what resonates with me is looking back, say 15 years, and then looking ahead. I do quite a few things that require some serious physical exertion & weight lifting or pulling, and the next 15 years are gonna stop some of that. It’s kinda odd; 15 years ago seems like just yesterday but 15 years hence is closer to “OMG!, that’ll be me?!?”
 

Colo Springs E

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Emanuel's brothers are Rahm Emanuel, former Obama chief of staff and Chicago mayor and current U.S. Ambassador to Japan, and Ari Emanuel, inspiration for the Ari character on HBO's "Entourage," who as head of Endeavor (which merged with and became the parent company of what was the William Morris Agency) is one of the most powerful people in Hollywood.

Please don't miscontrue this as partisan political thing: These bros are a family of sharks. I don't believe Ezekiel is being honest. I think he's really advocating for the great unwashed to bow out for the greater good.

Here's a fun studio project Ari helped mastermind in Michigan that put the state's pension fund in peril. Suckers!
Thanks--didn't know any of that!

But I do agree with some of his article.
 

sloppychops

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Emanuel's brothers are Rahm Emanuel, former Obama chief of staff and Chicago mayor and current U.S. Ambassador to Japan, and Ari Emanuel, inspiration for the Ari character on HBO's "Entourage," who as head of Endeavor (which merged with and became the parent company of what was the William Morris Agency) is one of the most powerful people in Hollywood.

Please don't miscontrue this as partisan political thing: These bros are a family of sharks. I don't believe Ezekiel is being honest. I think he's really advocating for the great unwashed to bow out for the greater good.

Here's a fun studio project Ari helped mastermind in Michigan that put the state's pension fund in peril. Suckers!
I wouldn't believe or trust a single thing that any of them say. And, yeah, I think you hit the nail on the head with what this guy was really trying to accomplish with his article.
 

billy logan

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Don't be a wuss - roll BACK the clock!
Bryan Johnson's Blueprint website ---> Home <----yes, it's a bit odd, the extremes he goes to.
He does bring in the concept of not just "lifespan" but also "healthspan"

from the website:

Common reactions to Blueprint:
  • Bryan, you are surely miserable
  • It would be hilarious if Bryan got hit by a bus, lol
  • I’d rather die than eat veggies, berries and nuts
  • This is dystopic
  • I wish u knew my joy of pizza + donuts
 
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GeneB

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If you don't have long-term memory care insurance for a nursing home the relatives that try to care for you are in for a real treat. I know from experience caring for elder parents with dementia was not something I was mentally prepared for. You need to have a thick skin to let the insults roll off and not be taken seriously. (Why are you doing this to me? I hate you ... etc) I understand the premise - better dead than vegetable but euthanasia is still illegal in many states. Any many life insurance policies won't pay if you off yourself.
 

526THz

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Why I Hope to Die at 75

Article is from The Atlantic, hopefully it allows you to read, if you're curious.

Author is Ezekiel Emanuel, a (retired, I think?) oncologist, bioethicist, and a vice provost of the University of Pennsylvania.

His article spends a good bit of time on his primary concern with aging: the quality of your life nearly always worsens, and in many cases, significantly. He is particularly fearful of dementia--as am I. I largely agree with many things put forth in his article, particularly this:

"...over the past 50 years, health care hasn’t slowed the aging process so much as it has slowed the dying process."

Meaning, we may have found ways to delay death and thus extend the number of years we have here... but we haven't necessarily found ways to extend good, quality years of life.

He goes on to say, "but here is a simple truth that many of us seem to resist: living too long is also a loss. It renders many of us, if not disabled, then faltering and declining, a state that may not be worse than death but is nonetheless deprived. It robs us of our creativity and ability to contribute to work, society, the world. It transforms how people experience us, relate to us, and, most important, remember us. We are no longer remembered as vibrant and engaged but as feeble, ineffectual, even pathetic."

When asked if a couple months ago, has anything has for him since he wrote the infamous 2014 article, Emanuel said, "I wouldn't say nothing." Emanuel's partner does not agree with his plan, and "she would like me to consider preventative measures like a flu vaccine. A lot will depend on whether I really am a rare outlier** at 75, and I'm not deceiving myself. That will be the biggest challenge . . . We are in discussions," Emanuel said. (in his article, he indicates he's not going to kill himself or live unnecessarily dangerously when he hits the 75ish mark... but he also won't actively try to extend his life with vaccines, cancer treatment, etc. He would seek palliative care, but not curative care)

(**ie, someone exceptionally fit and healthy)

As I said, I agree with a lot of what he says in his article... but it's also interesting he seems to be leaving the door open for a bit more "flexibility" than his earlier adamant stance :)
I've been thinking the same for years.
Happy to see that I'm not alone!
Thanks for sharing!!
 

imwjl

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Why I Hope to Die at 75

Article is from The Atlantic, hopefully it allows you to read, if you're curious.

Author is Ezekiel Emanuel, a (retired, I think?) oncologist, bioethicist, and a vice provost of the University of Pennsylvania.

His article spends a good bit of time on his primary concern with aging: the quality of your life nearly always worsens, and in many cases, significantly. He is particularly fearful of dementia--as am I. I largely agree with many things put forth in his article, particularly this:

"...over the past 50 years, health care hasn’t slowed the aging process so much as it has slowed the dying process."

Meaning, we may have found ways to delay death and thus extend the number of years we have here... but we haven't necessarily found ways to extend good, quality years of life.

He goes on to say, "but here is a simple truth that many of us seem to resist: living too long is also a loss. It renders many of us, if not disabled, then faltering and declining, a state that may not be worse than death but is nonetheless deprived. It robs us of our creativity and ability to contribute to work, society, the world. It transforms how people experience us, relate to us, and, most important, remember us. We are no longer remembered as vibrant and engaged but as feeble, ineffectual, even pathetic."

When asked if a couple months ago, has anything has for him since he wrote the infamous 2014 article, Emanuel said, "I wouldn't say nothing." Emanuel's partner does not agree with his plan, and "she would like me to consider preventative measures like a flu vaccine. A lot will depend on whether I really am a rare outlier** at 75, and I'm not deceiving myself. That will be the biggest challenge . . . We are in discussions," Emanuel said. (in his article, he indicates he's not going to kill himself or live unnecessarily dangerously when he hits the 75ish mark... but he also won't actively try to extend his life with vaccines, cancer treatment, etc. He would seek palliative care, but not curative care)

(**ie, someone exceptionally fit and healthy)

As I said, I agree with a lot of what he says in his article... but it's also interesting he seems to be leaving the door open for a bit more "flexibility" than his earlier adamant stance :)
Thank you. Stuff like this is very much on my mind these days.

If someone finds the paywall or doesn't want to sign up, this is available for Apple News+ subscribers.

This is really interesting to me considering my age, closeness with a parent past 90 and some tangential and private matters going on. While at some levels I can relate to one graph in the article, I just had a work incident where it was me the old guy and same age CFO who among hundreds were only ones who "got it" for a recent matter so it is not all downhill.

In my mother's senior's apartment I do see some depression with many who are sort of in a last one standing mode, but most doing well that are typically 70s - 90s have high quality of life. It seems the magic when not genes comes from discipline they've always had or developed - top of class or on the podium types. They are very disciplined into late age.

You and others here might like Yuval Noah Harari writing and speaking if you don't already know him. This podcast is not only an exposure but he covers some stuff not in current books. Having read Sapiens, I liked his end bits on how we all might be gone or different in the not so distant future.


On this quality of life matter, I'm finally considering my retirement and what I think should be 1/2 quitting and not "quiet quitting" that seems popular. Last week I took off alone for an adventure opportunity knowing my capabilities for sports are diminishing and was super pleased to meet an 85 year old doing same. I generally care about my work but am making an upcoming adventure with my daughter job #1.
 

buster poser

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"...over the past 50 years, health care hasn’t slowed the aging process so much as it has slowed the dying process."

Meaning, we may have found ways to delay death and thus extend the number of years we have here... but we haven't necessarily found ways to extend good, quality years of life.
Respectfully, I don't think this is accurate. Pain, cancer, cognitive decline, et al are seeing massive improvements in treatment.

 

Colo Springs E

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buster poser

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I'm watching cognitive decline of a relative play out in real life. It's not pretty.

All the stats and articles in the world won't change my mind.
I've lost three relatives to Alzheimer's and a third to Lewy Body. I'm not minimizing the seriousness of cognitive decline, but real progress is being made and simplifying the discussion to "they're only extending life" is wronger in 2022 than it was in 2014.
 
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