1959 ES-335TD proto build

Discussion in 'Tele Home Depot' started by preeb, May 3, 2011.

  1. drgonzo2

    drgonzo2 Tele-Meister

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    Too Cool...:cool::cool::cool:

    WRT kerfed braces, I believe this was originally used from 1929-1933 on many of G's archtops, including the L-5. This was on a 16" body, with quite high arching. In '34, they reverted back to fully fitted braces on the L-5 when the 17" body went into production, as the new design gained less of its strength from the arching and proportionally moreof its strength from the bracing

    As to kerfed bracing on ES-175's, on the original 1pu design, they work well. Throw a bridge pup rout into the mix, weakening the top right at the peak of the arch, and, well, it's not really a good idea. It CAN work, but its definitely a weakpoint...

    ... G
     
  2. telemcCaster

    telemcCaster Tele-Holic

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    Thanks G. I was not aware of the kerfing on the earlier archtops.
    Hey where's my boroscope?
     
  3. Emperor-TK

    Emperor-TK TDPRI Member

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    I measured about 2 degrees on my '59 EB-2 also. I used photos and Corel Draw, but I was getting numbers between 1.9 and 3.0 degrees. The problem was it was hard to judge the exact location of the body/shim seam since mine is a sunburst and I was having trouble with lighting for the picture. Using a straight measure and a little trig, I got 2.4 degrees, which I think is right.

    -Chris

    [​IMG]
     
  4. preeb

    preeb Poster Extraordinaire Vendor Member

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    Thanks Chris. Can you please measure strings height at the center of the bridge?
     
  5. Emperor-TK

    Emperor-TK TDPRI Member

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    Hi Gil,

    Since the bridge is in a different location from a 335, I did some measurements at multiple spots for you. FWIW, the action is high on this bass as received, with some buzzing in the middle frets. The relief looks OK, so I probably need to do a fret level/dress (hopefully not more.) Because of the flatwounds, it still plays OK as is, but I'd like it to play a little cleaner.

    I hope this helps:

    Neck joint is at the 18th fret.
    Neck is 20 frets, 30.5" scale.
    The bridge/tail studs are 11" from the neck joint on bass side, 10 13/16" on treble.
    I took measurements to the body at 8 1/8" from the neck joint, where the bridge on a 335 is.

    All measurements are on the A string. At frets, the distance is from string bottom to the fret tops. Otherwise it's from string bottom to body.

    3rd fret 0.060"
    12th fret 0.110"
    20th fret 0.130"
    335 bridge location 0.500"
    EB-2 bridge 0.656"
     
  6. preeb

    preeb Poster Extraordinaire Vendor Member

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    Thank you so much!
    1/2" is the magic number then... it's normaly around 0.55" under the middle strings but 1/2" for a 335 type instrument makes a lot of sense.
     
  7. preeb

    preeb Poster Extraordinaire Vendor Member

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    Got some interesting info (thanks again B.) about the 58 ABR-1 bridges.
    Looks like Gibson had two different types of ABR's, one is the standard kind and the other is a low profile model.

    here's the 1958 low profile bridge @ 9.4mm compared to a regular ABR-1 @ 10.8mm

    [​IMG]

    I'll have to make the short one sometime soon...

    to get a 1/2" clearance at the bridge the neck shims are tapered to 1.8° and hide glued under the board. They were left slightly over-sized and will be trimmed when the glue cures.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  8. Emperor-TK

    Emperor-TK TDPRI Member

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    If your interested, I can also measure clearances for my later model years with the steeper neck angle (starting at 1959).
     
  9. preeb

    preeb Poster Extraordinaire Vendor Member

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    Oh yes... please.
    If you don't mind, could you measure the clearance with the string laying flat over the frets (frets plane)?
     
  10. preeb

    preeb Poster Extraordinaire Vendor Member

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    Headstock shaped

    [​IMG]

    tuner holes drilled

    [​IMG]

    Note the nice diagonal transition line between the HS shape and the the neck base.This line is square to the board of course.

    [​IMG]

    Neck is shaped to a typical 58 fat soft V (0.93" X 0.99")

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

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    The combination of softer shoulders with a deep profile is very comfy. My favorite (-;

    [​IMG]

    I now check that the neck hasn't moved or warped after removal of so much wood...
    Still true and straight as an arrow

    [​IMG]

    Dry test to make sure there are no gaps between the neck and the body.
    I chisel the surfaces further to get a very tight and void free fit and check again and again.... until it's perfect. This is an important phase in the build and I really take my time to do it right. I do not trust the hide glue to fill any possible gaps because I want the best possible sound transfer between the neck and the body.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    when done, I simulate the clamping and verify all is still well.
    Note that the heel is left 1/4" longer. It will be cut flush with the body at the final sanding stage soon.

    [​IMG]

    Nut slot is cleaned and filed flat

    [​IMG]

    Proper 6/4 Nylon nut is glued with acetone glue and clamped for 20 minutes

    [​IMG]

    Clamps removed and bond is checked. The nut should fit tightly against the neck and the board.

    [​IMG]

    Neck is hide glued and clamped gently. Too much pressure can deform the wood because it gets a little moist from the hide glue. I just make sure all is tight by pushing the neck in very strongly and tighten the clamp. The glue will pull the parts together as it cures.
    I guess we can now call this a guitar (-;

    [​IMG]
     
  11. sltGroove

    sltGroove TDPRI Member

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    Time for me to start playing lotterie :D

    I just love it.

    Grabbed an 347 two days ago ( the new one ) - brrrrr ... 3400€ of a nice BBQ-wood.
     
  12. Emperor-TK

    Emperor-TK TDPRI Member

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    Hi Gil,

    Here's the measurements. They were done by taking a straight edge and resting it on the frets, extended to the bridge. The height is from the bottom of the straight edge to the body at the bridge. This is very close to, or exactly the height of the top of the ABR-1 block as well.

    '59 345 0.50"
    '61 345 0.52"
    '66 335 0.57"
    '67 335 0.59"
    '69 340 0.58"
    '72 335 0.63"
    '79 347 0.59"

    Here's also a link to a bunch of other measurements I took on my collection:

    ES measurements
     
  13. MRJ5

    MRJ5 TDPRI Member

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    Great information there!

    Thank you! :D
     
  14. missinglinkwray

    missinglinkwray Tele-Meister

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    :DBBQ-wood... is that good or bad?
     
  15. telemcCaster

    telemcCaster Tele-Holic

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    Gil, I really like the shape of that neck, being a bass player it looks comfortable.

    For those who check this thread twenty times a day...here are some random shots from the shop.

    Center blocks from the lightest soft maple I could find. All dimensioned and weighed.
     

    Attached Files:

  16. telemcCaster

    telemcCaster Tele-Holic

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    My new clamping station for the ribs at the joint... a surprisingly difficult operation because of the stiffness of the sides and the four pieces coming together.
     

    Attached Files:

  17. telemcCaster

    telemcCaster Tele-Holic

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    A random scene... many operations going on at once.[​IMG]
     

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  18. telemcCaster

    telemcCaster Tele-Holic

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    Processing veneer takes big machines. Unless I want to do it one at a time, and that works too, albeit slower.
     

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  19. telemcCaster

    telemcCaster Tele-Holic

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    Getting some sun and airing out.

    One guitars worth of shavings from leveling the contour bracing by hand...I like this work it keeps my arm in shape.
    [​IMG]
     

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  20. preeb

    preeb Poster Extraordinaire Vendor Member

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    Interesting how it gets higher over time.
    Thank you for your PDF. Great job!!!
     
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