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12" Alnico Speaker Suggestions Needed for 5F1 Champ clone

Discussion in 'Glowing Bottle Tube Amp Forum' started by El Tele Lobo, Jan 25, 2021.

  1. El Tele Lobo

    El Tele Lobo Poster Extraordinaire

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    I debated posting here or in Amp Central Station. Anyway, I have a Jupiter 12LC (ceramic) in my 5F1 Champ clone and have always mostly liked it, but I'm curious about trying an Alnico speaker instead. It's rated at 50 watts. I mostly play clean, so I'm looking for something with lots of clean headroom and that won't get really fizzy when driven...which is why I went with a ceramic speaker to begin with. It could be a result of my tinnitus (and accompanying hyperacusis) in recent years, but I've been noticing lately when playing clean (and even with musicians earplugs in) that the cleans can be rather biting and harsh even at lower volumes. This is straight in without pedals. I'm wondering if a warmer sounding speaker might help this.

    I'm almost exclusively a home player, so I don't really need a gigging amp...and the Champ would probably be insufficient for playing with a drummer in many cases anyway, but I do sometimes play worship music in church and don't want something that is going to get crunchy or fizzy when I don't want it to. I have pedals for that. I also play jazz, blues, ambient and a little rock n roll...just not crazy loud as I live in an apartment and aforementioned tinnitus.

    The other option is, I guess, a warmer sounding ceramic, if there is such a thing.

    So what suggestions do you guys have?
     
  2. Dacious

    Dacious Poster Extraordinaire

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    12" Weber Sig. Cheap, good. Low wattage, which I prefer for low wattage amps. Low doping, small spider and voicecoil. I've never had a 12" but the 8" version in a straight cone with an Eric Clapton Vibrochamp (that's what the FSD speaker is) and ribbed with a 78 VC.
     
  3. Guitarteach

    Guitarteach Doctor of Teleocity

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    Mine has a 12” Celestion Alnico Blue in an oversized cab I made.

    It sounds.... absolutely glorious. It’s also quite an efficient speaker, so plenty loud.
     
  4. El Tele Lobo

    El Tele Lobo Poster Extraordinaire

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    The Celestion Blue is one of the speakers already on my radar!
     
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  5. theprofessor

    theprofessor Poster Extraordinaire

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    Either a Weber Sig like @Dacious said, or a Rec Pro Audio Speed Shop A12Q. Both would be great. The Speed Shop is the best imaginable new-production speaker in a 5e3, in my opinion, and I'd bet it would sound great in a 5f1, too.
     
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  6. telepraise

    telepraise Tele-Afflicted

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    I tried to work with Jensen P12Qs in both my Deluxe and Princeton. Low efficiency, quiet in idle, and nice cleans. Unfortunately, they don't handle overdrive breakup well at all. Bass gets flabby and farty real quick. Since I play praise and worship weekly, that wasn't going to cut it, I have to use overdrive a lot.

    Another poster here has the exact same PRRI I do and put a 12" Celestion Cream alnico in it and loved it. I followed suit and the speaker is perfect for that amp and my needs. Not cheap, but 90 watts (tons of clean headroom) and 100db of sensitivity. The sound is huge but not overbearing, it makes the PRRI sound way bigger than it is. Being alnico, the cleans are gorgeous, and most importantly, being a Celestion, the break up tone is gorgeous. I play this amp weekly in the big sanctuary and the sound is heavenly ethereal (pun intended). It is a lot of money for a home amp application though.
     
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  7. El Tele Lobo

    El Tele Lobo Poster Extraordinaire

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    I've seen a couple demos where the Cream Celestion Alnico caught my ear. I'm putting that one on my list too. Thank you!
     
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  8. lathoto

    lathoto Tele-Meister

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    The EVM12L will unlock the true attributes of a 5 watt class A amp. Set the volume at 3-4, step back, dig in, and you will be astounded.
     
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  9. Milspec

    Milspec Poster Extraordinaire

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    Clean...not fizzy...Altec 417.
     
  10. lammie200

    lammie200 Friend of Leo's

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  11. Wobbles

    Wobbles Tele-Meister

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    Another vote here for Celestion Blue. Great speaker.
     
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  12. El Tele Lobo

    El Tele Lobo Poster Extraordinaire

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    This definitely makes a case for the Blue over the fizzy Jensen:

     
  13. 2L man

    2L man Tele-Meister

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    I like P12Q RI with all Fender type amps more than Blue which I prefer with 18W TMB EL84 tube amp.

    P12Q low volume sound is clearer and brighter and thats why I prefer it and other Jensen RIs with Fenders.

    Blue low volume has something muffed but its loud sound is glorious and so is P12Q but its loud just is not as loud because they have about 3dB sensitivity difference. 60s voicing is present on Blue and 50s on P12Q but I like its 70s Page, SRV etc sound.

    I have Blackbird 40 but I have not used it much and don't have clear opinion yet but it does not sound vintage anymore which obviously was Jensen goal to fill space between Neodyms/Blackbird 100 and Vintage alnicos.

    WGS G12Q has been discussed on 5E3 loudspeaker thread recently and its vintage sound is very good with Fender amps and I can address it never sound bad! I like it with 18W EL84 amp as well but I can't use nowhere full power but G12Q colors sound good on very low volume.
     
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  14. ping-ping-clicka

    ping-ping-clicka Friend of Leo's Ad Free Member

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  15. Ed Storer

    Ed Storer Tele-Afflicted Silver Supporter

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    Another vote for the Sig. Great speaker for the price.
     
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  16. Dukex

    Dukex Tele-Afflicted

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    Weber Sig A
    Weber 12A100
     
  17. Bendyha

    Bendyha Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    Worth considering, is the Fane A60. It has a very flat frequency response for a guitar speaker.
    I have its predecessor the AXA12, which is no longer available. I have it in my Super Champ extension cab to compliment the EV10 in the cab. It is very much a warm, big and clean tone, more so than the Celestion, of which I don't personally know what the new ones sound like, but I do have a 1970's silverbell, which is the same thing.
     
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  18. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

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    I think of the champ as more mids and less treble & bass.
    The Blue is great but adds mids to a middy amp, while also helping a bit with the bit of a lack of highs in the champ.
    The Jensen P12Q RI is a non starter to me, BUT a real Jensen P12N is not fizzy, not mid forward like the champ, adds bass & treble where it seems needed, stays clear, has the articulation of the C Blue, seems to me to have fairly high efficiency, and can often be had for less than a Celestion Blue.

    Blue mids are at a higher frequency than GB mids, so that's still a fine choice, and the cut it adds is nice if you want that.

    I see high BIN prices on good reconed vintage P12N but when at auction they don't bring a lot, and I've seen no bids at under $100.
    Of course you may not find one, or you may find a beater that really needs a recone which isn't a bad way to go.
    If you use Tweed circuits you should at least try a real P12N at least once.

    That's what I got to offer!
     
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  19. sjwieczorkow

    sjwieczorkow Tele-Holic

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    Beware Celestion Blues. They are raspy and brittle and harsh. I can't believe they are so popular. I know they are supposed to sound better after broken in, but I can't stand playing through them long enough to break 'em in!

    Try a Celestion Gold or maybe a PVC paper cone scumback (scumnico)
     
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  20. El Tele Lobo

    El Tele Lobo Poster Extraordinaire

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    Just a reminder, guys, I’m looking specifically for recommendations for the 5F1 champ. A speaker may be a great choice in a black “face or silverface amp, but not equally good in a tweed.

    The jury is still out for me on the Celestion blue… Though I am rather liking the sound of the Celestion gold in some comparison demos. Has anybody used a Celestion gold in a champ?

    Thank you guys for all your suggestions… You’ve given me plenty of homework to do. Keep them coming. If I do decide to change speakers down the road, I want to pick some thing that will be a willthank you guys for all your suggestions… You’ve given me plenty of homework to do. Keep them coming. If I do decide to change speakers, I want to pick some thing that will be a really good fit.
     
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