1/4" Tape age? lasts? buy "New" tape

[PapaLion]

Hi, I don't know a lot about 1/4" recording tape at all. Can a person buy new tape, or is all NOS and been laying somewhere for 30 years? I've got several rols sealed new but they are from around 1975 I believe. I would think tape would have a shelf life? is the roll dated somewhere?

Someone probably knows a source for fresh new tape...? I would like a point in that direction. Specifically I think? I want a tape with some lubricating properties as I intend to make myself some loops for my Space Echo. Yes, I know they can be purchased, I want to make them myself.

Just beginning to learn about this. Thanks for the help.

 

[kp8]

I worked as an audio archivist in NYC and as late as 2005 was still able to get 1/4 tape, splicing stuff, leader tape, and reels at Sam Ash in New York. Not the guitbox Sam Ash but the pro audio one.

 

[woodman]

A pro engineer pal told me old tape can be "cooked," i.e. heated to a specific temperature for a specific time, to keep the oxide from flaking off. I don't know much more than that, but you might be able to salvage your old tape if you research it.

 

[Bob W.]

Recording tape made from the late '70s through the '90s has an inherent problem of absorbing moisture from the air. This has become known as "Sticky Shed Syndrome". Without going into the arcane physics, it is a molecular problem related to the binding formulations used during that period.

Almost every tape I have recently encountered from that time has needed to be "baked" in order to playable. When the oxide coating has absorbed moisture, it becomes soft, scraping off on the heads and guides of the tape machine. This makes it difficult for the machine to pull the tape through, and does serious damage to the recorded audio.

"Baking" is actually a process of dehydration. Hot air is passed by the tape for a few hours to gently remove the water. The ideal temperature is in the range of 120 to 135 degrees Fahrenheit. A small convection device, like a food dehydrator can be used. There are numerous articles on the web concerning ways to successfully bake tapes. It is far more risky to try to play sticky tapes than it is to bake them first.

Even NOS tapes should be baked before recording. All baked tapes will eventually re-absorb moisture, and may need to be baked again in the future. Most experts agree that it can be done more than once.

Sticky Shed Syndrome is a problem that involves polyester backed tapes of a specific period. Earlier acetate tapes have different issues and should not be baked.

 

[PapaLion]

Sheesh, I guess Martha Stewart would say it's a good thing. The reason for the ?s is I found a virtually new Ampex tape splicer, which led me to thinking I could make new tapes for my Roland Space Echo and an older Dynachord echo. I'd try different tapes with various bias etc... optimize the Tah> Tah good sound U see.

Hmm and then I'm hearing "Lubricated" to make loops... sounds very sexual to me??

Appreciate what you fellas have added, gives me some direction.

Marthas recipe: Take 4 feet of Ampex 456 x 1/4" and lay it on edge loosly coiled in a shallow Pyrex bowl. Bake for 1 hour at 125 degrees or until the tape begins to look "done" Serve cold with plenty of signal breaded upon it using your Tele and the record head. Thank you Martha you're always so crafty.

cook the tape...COOK the tape, yea right.
.

 

[woodman]

Sheesh, I guess Martha Stewart would say it's a good thing. The reason for the ?s is I found a virtually new Ampex tape splicer, which led me to thinking I could make new tapes for my Roland Space Echo and an older Dynachord echo. I'd try different tapes with various bias etc... optimize the Tah> Tah good sound U see.

Hmm and then I'm hearing "Lubricated" to make loops... sounds very sexual to me??

Appreciate what you fellas have added, gives me some direction.

Marthas recipe: Take 4 feet of Ampex 456 x 1/4" and lay it on edge loosly coiled in a shallow Pyrex bowl. Bake for 1 hour at 125 degrees or until the tape begins to look "done" Serve cold with plenty of signal breaded upon it using your Tele and the record head. Thank you Martha you're always so crafty.

cook the tape...COOK the tape, yea right.
.

Haha! Defy Martha and douse it in Texas Pete!

 

[Bob W.]

If you are making "loose loops", as in a tape bin, you really don't need lubricated tape.

Lubed tape was made for endless loop cartridges, like the old-school broadcast carts and consumer 8-tracks. With these devices, the tape is on a spool, pulls out of the center, and wraps back on the outside. The tape has to be able to slip within the spool for this to work.

With a loose loop in a box, there is not much need for slippage. Ampex 456 will probably work fine, bake it first so it's not sticky.

 

[fezz parka]

Who knows the secret ingredient in pre 1973 binding formulas?

I do, and yes this is a serious question.

Here's a hint: 1972 MMPA.

 

[klasaine]

Some kind cellular material from sea lions or dolphins?
MMPA 'marine mammal protection act' ... in 1972(?)

 

[Bob W.]

I believe it was a government mandate that the manufacturing had to be changed in order to mitigate chemical pollution. The binder formula was changed, the unintended consequence was a molecule that attracts H2O. I'm not sure what the exact chemical change was, but the results have been a major pain for the audio industry.

 

[fezz parka]

In 1972, the United States Congress passed the Marine Mammal Protection Act (MMPA). The Act makes it illegal for any person residing in the United States to kill, hunt, injure or harass all species of marine mammals, regardless of their population status. In addition, the MMPA also makes it illegal for anyone to import marine mammals or products made from them into the United States.

Whale oil was used in the binding process. Ever notice how old tape has an organic smell to it?

 

[klasaine]

Now that's a friggin' trivia question!

 

[fezz parka]

I learned about it from Joe Gastwirt when we were mastering the score for The Magnificent 7.

 

[fezz parka]

The main problem with the binders is for tape that had a backing to help prevent print-through. 406, 456, 226, 468, 469.

 

[PapaLion]

Wow, that is an amazing little artifact of knowledge. We have folks here working on Jojoba oil from beans grown on big bushes that grow in the Southwest. Jojoba became interesting after that act was passed; characteristics are very similar to whale oil.

Meanwhile I have a huge roll of brand new sealed 456 and I'm headed out to my library (Google) to decipher techiniques to bake plastic tape, Martha may be all wet on her recipe... this might get interesting.

 

[fezz parka]

This first pic is a track sheet from '62. Scotch 131. Still playable, no baking needed:

This one is from '69. Scotch 250. No baking needed:

This one is from '73. Scotch 226 1/2". Brown emulsion, black backing. Baking was required to transfer:

I thought I'd put these up to show I know what the feck I'm talking about.

 

[PapaLion]

No one doubts you around here? never heard that ever.
Appreciate the input. Lots of things have been lost in the world by someone NOT sharing the info he has.

 

[Bob W.]

Interesting. I didn't know about the whale oil in tape binder formulas, but it makes sense that it would be banned in manufacturing. I'm not sure if the lack of whale oil is the reason behind the sticky shed problems, but it seems that this was part of the formula change. I have baked hundreds of tapes over the last decade for transfer/archiving. They have all been from the era we are discussing. Mostly Ampex, Scotch, Agfa, etc, all polyester back coated.

 

[Mike SS]

I learned the hard way about 1/4 audio tape. A local recording studio owner, and " used musical equipment" dealer had a big box of used tape reels for $5 each. I thought I would give them a try since new audio tape is f---in' expensive. They were government surplus tapes of Armed Forces Radio productions. To make a long story short they flaked apart as they passed through my Teac. I did however stumble across a box of tape in a local Mom and Pop record store. A bunch of prerecorded Scotch reels from the early sixties, and a couple of mint, in the box blanks. Got them for $2 each.
The last time I priced new 1/4 inch on line, they were asking $50 a reel. Yikes.....

 

[fezz parka]

No one doubts you around here? never heard that ever.
Appreciate the input. Lots of things have been lost in the world by someone NOT sharing the info he has.

You'd be surprised.

Bottom line is if it has a black backing, it needs to be baked. Even old NOS reels.

While I was at MGM, I supervised the transfer of the entire library, some 10k + tapes. If it was tape from before '73, no problem. If it was post '73 black backed tape, all bets were off.