1/2 power 5f6a? Or something with a similar feel and taste.

Discussion in 'Amp Central Station' started by corn husk bag, May 19, 2016.

  1. corn husk bag

    corn husk bag TDPRI Member

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    Hi Folks,

    Looking for a schematic to build a lower powered 5f6a. Or maybe another amp that fits the feel of the 5f6a, or maybe I am crazed? Any thoughts on this, good, bad and/or indifferent will be appreciated. There seems to be a nice nucleus of informed people on this board, and I like that! Thank you kindly in advance!

    Kind Regards,
    Steve
     
  2. bigben55

    bigben55 Friend of Leo's

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    Richter Amplification makes 2 amps like you describe, the RS22 and RS33. They are 22 and 33 watt 1x12" tweed Bassmans. I'd love to own the 33. I have a Richter 5E3 and it's flat out awesome. Well priced too, dunno if you could build one for significantly cheaper from a kit.
     
  3. Axis29

    Axis29 Poster Extraordinaire Ad Free Member

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    After putting an Eminence 1228 (alnico), I will say my 5e3 sounds a lot more like my '59 Bassman RI. (It used to have a Celestion Alnico Gold, which was more bass heavy, screamed at volume, but was dark at lower volumes).

    But, it doesn't have the tone stack... Have you looked at Rob Robinette's website? He has some lower power stuff and a lot on the Bassman circuit.
     
  4. valiant

    valiant Tele-Holic

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    As mentioned above Richter do a low powered Bassman 1x12.....22 watts using 6V6's and a 33 watt variant....they also have their high powered 36 watt Supra-Lux which is a 6L6 powered 5E3.
    Sarah Richter's tweed deluxe the Richter 5E3-G has quite a following
    and is simply world class at working man prices.....from owners love and audio Richter amps (like the legendary Ron Kirn BarnBuster)
    are stand out products....only wish they were available in the UK as
    the Richter Charm School 5F10 Harvard just got a tremolo version and a Richter 5F11 Vibrolux would be thing of wonder.
     
  5. peteb

    peteb Friend of Leo's

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    how about the 5E4-A super amp?

    I think it would be closer to half a bassman than the other 2X6V6 tweed fenders

    the super was one of fenders bigger amps, always with 2X6L6 tubes, except for this version with 2X6V6.

    I read they kept the same voltages as the 2X6L6 super, and it is fixed bias.
     
  6. muchxs

    muchxs Doctor of Teleocity

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    If you're going DIY just drop the supply voltage (a lot!) and use 6V6s. If you're going to obsess over the preamp voltage riding down when you drop everything else, bear in mind that Eddie Van Halen's legendary Marshall was browned out using a Variac.

    Half power isn't half as loud but... 6V6s distort earlier than 6L6s. If getting into the grind at a lower volume is your motive this is your recipe.

    The Super to have is the 5F4. That's the same as Pro and Bandmaster circuits of the era except for speakers and minor circuit details. But... it's a whole lot different compared to a 5F6 Bassman. Big difference IMO is the Bassman uses a long tailed pair while the Super has a cathodyne PI. The LTP brings a little gain to the party and keeps the attack crisp.

    I've cut and pasted both circuits. I tried a 5F6 preamp with a Super power section. It sounds good cranked and a little thin everywhere else. The other way around... Bandmaster / Pro / Super pre into a Bassman power section leaves me scrounging for an extra 12AX7 section.
     
  7. corn husk bag

    corn husk bag TDPRI Member

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    Big Ben, Axis, Valiant, PeteB & Muchxs,
    Thank you for all of your thoughts so far. Much appreciated! I have been checking out Rob's site. What a plethora of information! Thanks for your information Muchxs, I understand half power won't save the good 1/2 of my eardrums! Using 6v6 and dropping the supply voltage is a grand idea. I think Van Halen uses "legendary" Fender Pro Juniors in stereo now.

    Maybe I should just get a Fender '59 Bassman pedal and put it in front of a 5e3! (Just kidding)

    Kind Regards,
    Steve
     
  8. t-luxe

    t-luxe Tele-Afflicted

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  9. corn husk bag

    corn husk bag TDPRI Member

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    ?
     
  10. muchxs

    muchxs Doctor of Teleocity

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    It exists only as a figment of my fevered imagination but I've been dreaming of an amp I call The Much Moped. The joke is motorcycles don't need no stinkin' pedals while mopeds won't go anywhere without them. Never mind that nerd chicks flock to my moped when I ride it to the library while the ancient librarian gives me th' ol' hairy eyeball when I show up on my motorcycle... :D

    (the ol' hairy eyeball aka a dirty look, a clearly disapproving glance)

    Picture this: How 'bout a truncated AA864 circuit built on a '60s Champ chassis with a single 10" speaker? Then use a Boss FBM-1 "Bassman" pedal, an FDR-1 "Deluxe Reverb" pedal or any of Tech 21's excellent "character" pedals. While the scheme is somewhat contrary to my usual way of thinking, the goal is to walk into a gig with my amp in one hand and my guitar in the other.

    "Never Mind."
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2016
  11. printer2

    printer2 Poster Extraordinaire

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    I did some photoshopping a 6G3 Deluxe output section to a Bassman preamp.

    [​IMG]
     
  12. bparnell57

    bparnell57 Poster Extraordinaire

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    Prosonic with an attenuator. Done! It'll also do Showman and, Concert, and Pro Reverb tones.
     
  13. Axis29

    Axis29 Poster Extraordinaire Ad Free Member

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    Better yet, a Zvex Distortron into a Quilter! LOL

    I haven't compared them straight up, but I have heard the new Roland Blues Cube and was very impressed! 26 lbs, supposedly modeled after a 'Bassman circuit'....
     
  14. Phrygian77

    Phrygian77 Tele-Afflicted

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    I've thought about this subject A LOT. I've considered building it in a 5F6A chassis and getting a custom shorter 2x10 bassman cabinet, or using a low power twin cabinet (maybe with a 2x10 baffle). Classictone makes a PT with lower B+ that will fit. Not sure about the preamp voltages, but the dropping resistors can easily be tweaked. I've also thought about building one in a Princeton reverb chassis with the input bridged and a separate volume for each channel.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2016
  15. jmp81sc

    jmp81sc Tele-Meister

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    Dave Hunter describes the 5G9 Tremolux as Bassman like. Long tailed pair, 2 x 6V6 with 5U4GB rectifier, single 12" speaker in a larger cab. That circuit only has one tone control and no presence knob, but I kind of like the simplicity of that.

    I think this was the only lower powered tweed amp to get the long tailed pair. This was right before the transition to the Brown and Blonde amps.

    I think Victoria makes a version of this.

    I have also read about using a 5Y3 rectifier with 6V6 tubes to lower volume in a 5F6A. You would need to rebias.
     
  16. Phrygian77

    Phrygian77 Tele-Afflicted

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  17. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

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    This looks good for a smaller amp that's actually smaller.
    I'd like to compare different PT and 6v6 to simply changing to cathode bias to lower the headroom, at least for my interest.
    I have a Tweed something or other (Twin/ Bassman) that could be made into any of the above, I just can't see making the big chassis into a 6v6 amp.
     
  18. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Telefied Ad Free Member

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    How about a four 6v6 5f6a? Pull a pair for lower volume dirt?
     
  19. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

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    Corn husk bag, if you wanted/needed something in that vein to tide you over....the Blues Jr. is very close to what you are asking for. There are two gain stage prior to a full tone stack with 5F6A values, a LTP PI and fixed bias. Find a used one for not much money and put together the wherewithal to buy a and wired boutique...like the Richter above?? Or....just go for the Richter.
    The Pro Sonic is a great option, IMHO....the 30 watt mode gets you close to where you want to go....and it has the 50 and 60 watt modes for versatility. Great bargains in the market,IMHO. They are the best constructed amp Fender has built in the last 30 years but for the completely handwired CS amps.....and none of those amps have the versatility of the Pro Sonic.
    Or....for less money...the Super Sonic 22 has a channel based in the 5F6A world. I prefer the Pro Sonic...
     
  20. corn husk bag

    corn husk bag TDPRI Member

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    Thanks again for the thoughts of all of you on this! Any other thoughts would be appreciated!

    Kind Regards,
    Steve
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2016
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