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Zinsser shellac amber for neck

Discussion in 'Finely Finished' started by IggyT, Jan 30, 2009.

  1. IggyT

    IggyT Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    58
    Apr 21, 2008
    toronto
    I have considered using this as an undercoat/sealer on my neck to get a slight vintage colour. I will then clear coat with nitro. but am a bit worried about what they say is "traces of natural shellac wax"...I dont want any compatability issues later down the road.
    In Canada the product comes in a quart can EB420030 or spray bomb. Are the dewaxed shellac sealers completely free of wax? If so I wont use this particular Zinsser product
    First : (assuming the amber is compatible) will this approach work out from a colour point of view and more important will the nitro adhere without issue...
    :confused:
    iggy
     

  2. boris bubbanov

    boris bubbanov Telefied Ad Free Member

    I use the lighter toned stuff which says "dewaxed". I agree, you do not want any wax.

    Bear in mind, the shellac has no UV stabilizers, so you can put on several coats of clear and leave it in a sunny window. What I do not know is, if you immediately lay the UV stabilized nitro spray right onto the shellac, will the UV stabilizers leach into the shellac and stabilize it?

    Anyone know?
     

  3. robt57

    robt57 Telefied Ad Free Member

    Feb 29, 2004
    Portland, OR
    I seem to recall the amber is not the wax free product. Not positive though...
     

  4. IggyT

    IggyT Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    58
    Apr 21, 2008
    toronto
    yep..contains wax...bad...

    after reading the product monograph...after I found my glasses...Now if I could only find their sealcoat which is wax free.
    I could make shellac from flakes like back in wood shop...
    I also discovered a few other things : In Lowes here in Ontario I can get Cabot Lacquer alkyd nitro (~20% solids by wt) however it says : Cant be tinted...and not to use over shellac or lacquer :confused:
    If I cant find a suitable wax free sealer I guess I will be using Deft..
    thanks for the responses
    iggy
     

  5. robt57

    robt57 Telefied Ad Free Member

    Feb 29, 2004
    Portland, OR

    I am going to quote myself, notice how I said that there.

    I am positive the Seal Coat is the non wax product. Sorry if my first post was ambiguous.

    Zinsser/Bullseye makes a sealer that is 'no wax' shellac and I use it under Nitro with superb results. It is not amber, which is why I said it that way up there...

    Sealcoat, Universal Sanding Sealer

    [​IMG]



    So seal with the no wax shellac, then spray on some tinted Nitro?
     

  6. Axis29

    Axis29 Poster Extraordinaire Ad Free Member

    Jan 2, 2007
    Virginia, USA
    Use amber shellac, then sealer on top, then topcoat?

    I've used Amber Shellac for years and sprayed right over top of it with Deft, Minwax Poly's (waterbase and regular), General Finishes High Performance Poly and a few other products too. Though, I have not used the Cabot LKacquer over it. I have used Cabot clear woodfinish once and it took too long to dry (I was in a hurry).

    My best advice, if you already have the product, try a test on scrap!
     

  7. HOBBSTER01

    HOBBSTER01 Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    55
    Nov 23, 2007
    Ringgold, Ga.
    +1 on Zinnser Amber.
    Love it.
     

  8. IggyT

    IggyT Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    58
    Apr 21, 2008
    toronto
    The SealCoat would be perfect! just not as commonly available as the shellacs with traces of wax.
    iggy
     

  9. IggyT

    IggyT Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    58
    Apr 21, 2008
    toronto
    old school...bought some wax free SHELLAC flAKES

    And I have dissolved them in ethanol at a 1 lb cut. Lucky for me : my wife works in a lab and I dropped by to use some pure EtOH to dissolve the flakes.
    It has a nice amber colour so this should help me with colouring the neck.
    I have a variety of tests on a strip and will spray some nitro over all of them to see how they compare.
    I also got some "white shellac" to use as a general sealer...
    Now if only the neck and body would be delivered! :(
     

  10. boris bubbanov

    boris bubbanov Telefied Ad Free Member

    Iggy, thanks for jogging my brain and getting me to think about oils, waxes and grain fillers from a different direction.

    I started thinking, what product would have a large enough molecular size not to soak indefinitely deep down into wood, but will instead just fit into the pores to keep them filled and keep finish from going where it is not needed, but will also not be so big or of such a nature as to act as a "release agent" and cause the finish to fail to adhere.

    And result is Bartley's Grain filler. Not just on mahogany and ash, but on all the wood surfaces.

    Thanks for the new compass heading, I much appreciate it.
     

  11. IggyT

    IggyT Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    58
    Apr 21, 2008
    toronto
    I think the collective wisdom of the tribe also supports the "science" of finish mixology. Trial and error is a good teacher!
    I also have some some Bartley's GF Dark on hand for the body...when it gets here!
     

  12. daveswenson

    daveswenson TDPRI Member

    85
    Dec 18, 2007
    Issaquah, WA
    I used Zinsser Bullseye amber shellac for color on the neck I just finished. Sprayed Nitro over the top. The finishes are compatible. The only caveat I would give is that you will have more control spraying the shellac. I brushed the first few coats and had trouble getting even coverage. I switched to spraying thin coats. Much better results.


    Swen
     

  13. IggyT

    IggyT Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    58
    Apr 21, 2008
    toronto
    test results

    I did some quick tests on scrap:
    laying down
    1-some "white" shellac...no wax
    2- some Zinsser clear (traces of wax!)
    3- some homemade amber shellac from flakes (wax free)
    4- a stain-grainfiller mix
    and oversprayed with DEFT clear.
    All seemed to live in harmony! but no guarantees.
    just FYI here is what the Zinsser brochure says "
    Bulls Eye® Shellac is an alcohol-based solution of pure lac, a
    natural resin secreted by tiny insects on certain trees, found
    mainly in Southeast Asia and India. After it is harvested the
    dark, reddish-brown resin is crushed into granules, rinsed
    to remove the natural dye and then dried. Indian lac is
    processed into flakes that are mixed with denatured
    alcohol to create Bulls Eye Amber Shellac, a deep amber
    color finish that gives woodwork and furniture a rich,
    antique appearance.
    Clear Bulls Eye Shellac is made by bleaching seedlac
    granules to remove the color. Clear Shellac is not waterclear
    - it has a faint, golden cast that is much lighter than
    oil-base finishes but lends a warm color to wood that
    water-base finishes cannot.
    Both Clear and Amber Bulls Eye Shellac contain natural
    shellac wax,
    which gives a somewhat milky appearance in
    the container but does not affect the clarity of the finish film.
    For more information on Bulls Eye Shellac, write to us or
    ask your ZINSSER dealer for a copy of The Story of Shellac.

    iggy
     

  14. Vizcaster

    Vizcaster Friend of Leo's

    Sep 15, 2007
    Glen Head, NY
    Shellac is a great barrier coat but if the main purpose is to get some color, I would tint the first few coats of lacquer then topcoat with clear.
     

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