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you talked me into it: my first neck

Discussion in 'Tele Home Depot' started by papaschtroumpf, Aug 6, 2017.

  1. 10orgtr

    10orgtr Tele-Meister

    174
    May 3, 2011
    western PA
    If you have a bench grinder just buy regular end nippers and grind them flush, that's what I did.
    Cheers,
    Woody
     

  2. papaschtroumpf

    papaschtroumpf Tele-Meister

    449
    Nov 24, 2015
    Colorado
    Looking at Bitterroot trussrods, and they have one labeled dual action and one labelled two way. Same price but different name and picture. What's the difference?

    When I measured the existing Epi neck, the distance from the nut to the heel is 17 7/8, I guess I should get a 17" trussrod, not an 18" one.

    Looks like they sell fret wire too. Trying to measure a guitar I like, I measured .106x.041 on the dressed frets and Epiphone calls it medium jumbo. Bitterroot doesn't list the dimensions for their different frets, anyone knows them? Otherwise I'll order jumbo.

    I also noticed they have a fret nipper for cheaper than Stewmac.
     

  3. richa

    richa Tele-Afflicted Ad Free Member

    Apr 23, 2016
    Washington
    I noticed this too. Hoping someone else can enlighten us. I didn't know about Bitterroot before this thread.
     

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  5. R. Stratenstein

    R. Stratenstein Doctor of Teleocity

    Aug 3, 2010
    Loganville, Ga.
    Once you're on the Bitterroot fret page, click on the fret picture of one you might be interested in. It'll open up a page that will have Blocks that include "Technical Specifications. " or something like that. Fret dimensions will be there. Here's an example:

    http://www.bitterrootguitars.com/Fret-Wire-pre-cut-jumbo-p/123027.htm

    The dual action and two way rods both adjust up and down, but the dual action has threads at both ends of the operating rod, exerting force in a slightly different (maybe smoother??) manner than the two-way, which only has threads on one end. I've always used the two-way ones, and can warp any neck I've ever made in either direction to beyond usefulness, so I've been confident they would be able to dial in any relief, or dial out any problems, I need to.


    EDIT: Or you could read their description of the difference, and open up some drawings:
    http://www.bitterrootguitars.com/Home-Luthier-Products-Truss-Rods-s/1914.htm
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2017
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  6. papaschtroumpf

    papaschtroumpf Tele-Meister

    449
    Nov 24, 2015
    Colorado
    Thanks, I figured it out, I do almost all my web browsing and posting from my cell phone and it turns out the Bitterroot web site is much more limited in mobile format. Once I had it in full site mode I was able to see the details.

    Interestingly the Medium wire is taller than the Jumbo wire. Since I mostly play blues and bend a lot, I read that taller might be better. I also gets me a little more material for levelling, so I may buy medium.

    It says the wire is pre-bent for 9.5, I want a 12" radius board, is that going to be a problem? (So I need to unbend them some?) I guess I have a lot to learn :)
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2017

  7. R. Stratenstein

    R. Stratenstein Doctor of Teleocity

    Aug 3, 2010
    Loganville, Ga.
    Typically, some overbend is good. It helps keep the ends from sprouting up. I'm not sure if that much overbend is good. I guess it depends on whether your slots hold the frets down securely, and you could glue them down too, but I'd rather defer to somebody with more experience in that particular aspect of building, like Marty. You might be able to unbend short pieces of fretwire, but at a gut level, I don't like the idea.

    If you'd rather just buy enough sticks from somebody (LMI, SM, etc.) to do one guitar, it would probably be cheaper, and I'd be happy to bend the fretwire to any radius you want. (So long as my gizmo will handle that radius.) That will save you the expense of buying a fret radius bender, the hassle of building one yourself, or methods that may or may not work to satisfaction (like cutting a slot in the front of your bench and pulling the wire through.) I got a new bender I'm dying to use, just send 'em to me and I'll send them right back, bent.


    IMG_3203.JPG
     
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  8. papaschtroumpf

    papaschtroumpf Tele-Meister

    449
    Nov 24, 2015
    Colorado
    Thanks for the offer I may take you up on it or look at building my own fret bender, seems fairly simple.

    I looks like my options for pre-radiused and preslotted fretboards are Stewmac or LMII I will probably throw in some fret wire in that order some it shouldn't affect shipping much (yeah, I have a hangup about paying for shipping, Amazon and Musicians Friends did that to me).
     

  9. guitarbuilder

    guitarbuilder Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Mar 30, 2003
    Ontario County
    I use stewmac fretwire and over bend it to about a 10" radius on a 12" fretboard. That way the ends are under a little pressure at first. The press will straighten it out to the fretboard radius. Personally I prefer to cut my own fretwire to length and avoid pre cut ones.
     

  10. papaschtroumpf

    papaschtroumpf Tele-Meister

    449
    Nov 24, 2015
    Colorado
    Well, I took the plunge and ordered a pre-radiused and pre-slotted fretboard for 25.5" and some fret wire from Stewmac (their Wide/Medium seems to be very close to the frets I like)
    I also "splurged" and got the $5 brass insert for seating the frets. I'm planning on making my own caul for it. Originally, I was planning on simply making a hard wood block at the proper radius with a fret sized slot, but I have no idea if a simple wood block would be enough or would deform after a few slots. So it's "insurance", although I'm having buyer's remorse already :) Maybe all I needed was a hammer, but I'm worried about putting dents in the soft fret material.

    I also got a trussrod from bitterroot, and cheap fret markers. I know from my lapsteel project that I'm not good at: perfectly cutting pieces of pickguard material or regular white plastic, (even round ones) and that using a dremel to draw shaped cavities for inlays is a lot harder than it looks. In the end I used decals from Jockomo.com to get the fancy fret markers I wanted (I don't have a finished picture, but you can see below with only one string on during construction). In fact it worked so well that I considered using Jockomo inlays for this neck, but decided I need to learn and that pre-purchased perloid dots did not require too much skills (just check placement 3 times!)


    Clipboard01.jpg

    Off to home depot at lunch to see what I can get wood-wise. From looking online, it looks like I can only get .75" boards (poplar or maple). With a 1/4" fretboard (the stewmac one actually advertises 15/64) it will barely reach 1". What's funny is that in my head a neck was much thicket than 1". I took a caliper to the neck I'm replacing and sure enough it's just below 1" in the shaped area.
    My original plan was to match the original Epiphone heel exactly, but it is a bit thicker than 1" (by a few mm? can't remember), but enough that I may have to glue in another piece for the heel, even though I will eventually take off most of it as waste. The alternative is to shim the neck pocket. We'll see...
     
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  11. papaschtroumpf

    papaschtroumpf Tele-Meister

    449
    Nov 24, 2015
    Colorado
    I looked at every maple and poplar 1x4 at my home depot and all of them are flatsawn.
    There are 2 others home depots in the area and at least one Lowes, but not sure how important it is to have quartersawn pieces (I remember a Crismon Guitar video blog where they claimed it made almost no difference on Maple)

    Also, can I simply start working with a piece of home depot maple (s4s) or do I need to let it rest/dry at home for a while?

    Would I be better off grabbing a couple of pieces of the flatsawn poplar and laminating them to make a "one piece" blank? This neck will be painted.
     

  12. 10orgtr

    10orgtr Tele-Meister

    174
    May 3, 2011
    western PA
    If I recall correctly, Fender has made more than a few flat sawn necks.
    Cheers,
    Woody
     

  13. mkster

    mkster Tele-Afflicted

    Sep 25, 2010
    Montreal Quebec
    I am sure you will like making necks , i know i will enjoy watching you . I am sure you will have all the help you need .

    best regards

    Marc
     
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  14. R. Stratenstein

    R. Stratenstein Doctor of Teleocity

    Aug 3, 2010
    Loganville, Ga.
    Flatsawn will be fine in either of those species. At their prices, those boards had better be dried adequately, so apart from maybe a day or two in your work area to acclimate, you'll be fine to start working on them. Find the straightest, most even-grained board(s) you can. Starting with .75 " boards, you're not going to be taking off so much that some movement would be expected.
     

  15. papaschtroumpf

    papaschtroumpf Tele-Meister

    449
    Nov 24, 2015
    Colorado
    Thanks all! Won't get a chance to do anything with it till Saturday, but I got two about 26" of Maple out of the scrap bin at HD, ended up being cheaper than poplar, and wayyyyy cheaper than ordering sapele online.

    Now if only HD sold pre-slotted fretboards :)
    Actually they have 1/4" red oak that I think could look good as a fretboard for a future project. Any reason why you couldn't use that? It's pretty hard, but open pores so you'd have to finish it somehow?

    Anyway, fret wire and fretboard on their way from StewMac, should be here by Saturday.
     

  16. richa

    richa Tele-Afflicted Ad Free Member

    Apr 23, 2016
    Washington
    It works fine but hard to smooth without grain filling. I don't know that it's necessary though. Oak does lend itself to a sort of rustic appearance. But I've also seen it darkened (somewhere on tdpri) and it almost looked like wenge.
     

  17. Zepfan

    Zepfan Friend of Leo's

    Nov 30, 2013
    Horn Lake, MS
    Stewmac sells them for a decent price and check CBGitty.
     

  18. Zepfan

    Zepfan Friend of Leo's

    Nov 30, 2013
    Horn Lake, MS
    Aww, flat sawn boards. Stack and glue a few together, flip it over and you've got a quarter sawn board. Cut away the excess and you have a neck with built in degree headstock without the scarf joint.:cool:
     
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  19. papaschtroumpf

    papaschtroumpf Tele-Meister

    449
    Nov 24, 2015
    Colorado
    That's what I was asking about but it seems the consensus is that it isn't a big deal, so I'm not going to go that route on this neck.

    Assuming this first neck project turns out a success, I'm already thinking I would follow up with a baritone build. I always wanted a baritone but the conversion necks are out of my price range. For a baritone I would probably go laminated due to the extra length.
     

  20. richa

    richa Tele-Afflicted Ad Free Member

    Apr 23, 2016
    Washington
    Just to clarify - maybe someone else can confirm...but with maple this seems not to be an issue and some folks suggest that flat sawn is better for maple.
     

  21. guitarbuilder

    guitarbuilder Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Mar 30, 2003
    Ontario County
    Quartersawn is more stable than flatsawn. They both work well for guitar necks. You can see how different timbers stack up here. The smaller the number, the more stable it is according to the us forest products division.

    http://www.rempros.com/hardwood_dimentional_stability.html


    It boils down to how the wood was dried and stored too.
     
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