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Wiring a 4 way switch (with an S1)?

Discussion in 'Tele-Technical' started by Marme, Dec 6, 2017.

  1. Marme

    Marme TDPRI Member

    8
    Oct 13, 2015
    Maryland
    There are plenty of straight forward 4 way wiring diagrams, easy enough to follow, but I have tele usa pro. It has a bit of a different setup - humbucker in the bridge with S1 coil spitting push volume knob and the typical single coil in the neck.

    It's the S1 switch the is giving me a bit of trepidation when attempting to wiring the new 4 way switch. I've yet find a diagram to follow.

    So, has anyone done this? Know of a diagram? or something similar that can help with the S1 and 4way switch?

    Appreciate the help.
     
  2. MahoganyStratDZ

    MahoganyStratDZ Tele-Meister

    470
    Mar 5, 2012
    USA
    Depends what your intention is for switching options. For example this diagram could be used.....


    GuitarTeleWiring01.jpg
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2017
  3. moosie

    moosie Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Age:
    61
    Jul 18, 2010
    Western Connecticut
    I couldn't find a service diagram, so I emailed Fender. Should hear back tomorrow.

    In the meantime, if all you want is a simple 4-way with the typical Fender ordering of positions, plus an S-1 coil split, this will do it. Use whatever tone cap you want, ignore the value on mine. You may or may not have a treble bleed circuit between the left and center volume terminals. If so, keep it. I reference the bridge pickup red / white pair of wires. I'm pretty sure that's SDuncan color codes for the two 'middle' wires in a 4-wire humbucker. In a normal full humbucker, with or without coil split, they're wired together. As you can see, the coil split doesn't require much use of the S-1, but it is a nice push-push switch.


    Screen Shot 2017-12-07 at 5.49.57 AM.png
     
    Teleterr likes this.
  4. Teleterr

    Teleterr Friend of Leo's

    Feb 7, 2011
    Lewes De.
    moosie, I can read schematics , but not pictorials unless I know the switch, that gives the screw coil ? (screw is Bl/Wh )
     
  5. Marme

    Marme TDPRI Member

    8
    Oct 13, 2015
    Maryland
  6. moosie

    moosie Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Age:
    61
    Jul 18, 2010
    Western Connecticut
    Right. You can use the 4-way diagram I posted, and just don't touch the rest. It all appears to match what I've drawn anyway.

    First, any time you want to add series or phase switching options with a covered Tele neck pickup, you'll need to separate the cover ground from the pickup common. If you look at the bottom of the neck pickup, you'll see a small bare wire jumper, like this:

    Tele_Neck_pup_ground.jpg Sep13_PG_FEAT_Power-Play-4-Mods_step1_WEB.jpg

    You clip that jumper, and solder a new lead, making it a three-wire pickup. The reason is that while the cover always needs to be grounded, the signal common is no longer always going to ground, as it would be in a traditional 3-way switch setup. We need the flexibility to connect the pickup common to something other than ground for series or phase switching.

    Once you've done that, just identify your leads: bridge hot and common, and neck hot, common, and cover ground.

    Connect them as shown in my diagram. The drawing is how the switch should appear with the pickguard flipped, and you're ready to solder. Those green terminals don't look different on the switch, but they're the commons. FYI, either three- or four-way, these consist of two banks of terminals (aka "poles"). When you move the switch, the green terminal connects to one of the other terminals on that same bank. In this case 1, 2, 3, or 4. I've labeled the switch positions (the little 1 and 4 on the switch). These are the way Fender refers to things. When you push the switch all the way back into bridge position, that's position #1. Not 4 as some call it. You can call it what you like, but this is how to read the diagram. It might appear that the switch is backwards, because the little '4' is closest to the bridge. But keep in mind you're looking at the bottom of the switch. When in position 4, the rightmost terminals are connected to their respective green ones, but if you flip the pickguard, you can see the switch tip is pointing toward the headstock, not the bridge.

    Hope that makes sense. It's like trying to explain how to tie shoes. More difficult to explain than to do.

    Once you've soldered all your pickup leads to the correct places, then solder the remaining wires from switch to the pot(s), as shown.
     
  7. moosie

    moosie Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Age:
    61
    Jul 18, 2010
    Western Connecticut
    Not sure if you're asking a question here...? See above for the description of how a 4-way switch works.
     
  8. moosie

    moosie Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Age:
    61
    Jul 18, 2010
    Western Connecticut
    I heard from Fender. For reference, here is your stock wiring layout. Red wire on bridge pickup is the hot, and green (and bare) continue to be connected to the back of the tone pot. Leave those two alone. Connect the red to the B+ position on my switch diagram.

    With the neck pickup, black is the common, and white is hot. You'll be adding a third wire. What I would do, to save yourself some trouble, is instead of soldering a new lead for the cover, and soldering that to ground (back of tone pot), I would leave that neck common black lead connected to the tone pot, and just move it over 1/2" at the pickup, to be the cover ground. Then attach a new third wire to the pickup ON THE OLD COMMON location. So instead of adding a cover ground, you make the existing common the cover ground, and add a new common.

    Then connect your neck hot to my diagram marked N+, and the (new) common to the place marked N–. Do the remaining wiring to the switch, connecting things to the vol pot lugs as shown, and you're good to go.


    Screen Shot 2017-12-07 at 4.42.04 PM.png
     
    Teleterr and MahoganyStratDZ like this.
  9. MahoganyStratDZ

    MahoganyStratDZ Tele-Meister

    470
    Mar 5, 2012
    USA
    "I can read schematics"


    Little different, "they" use diagrams-drawings to deplict the components -an easier picture to follow with guitars for a simple circuit. Schematics dont use component photos they use symbols and read like a page in a book- top to bottom- left to right and line by line. The signal being generated or used by the circuit will flow in this direction. You can follow the same path that the signal uses to understand what the signal does or how it is being modified etc.


    https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/how-to-read-a-schematic


    Just saying. Good luck. Your pretty much already there with a couple minor changes as moose is saying above. Thanks and good luck again.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2017
  10. Marme

    Marme TDPRI Member

    8
    Oct 13, 2015
    Maryland
  11. BillB

    BillB TDPRI Member

    16
    Apr 16, 2009
    Delaware OH
    I'm currently putting another tele
    together and have this. Standard tele bridge pickup, tappable (4 wire) neck humbucker, 3 way CRL and an S1 on volume pot. All I want to do is tap the humbucker with the S1. Is it doable, any diagrams? Thank you.
     
  12. moosie

    moosie Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Age:
    61
    Jul 18, 2010
    Western Connecticut
    Duncan wire colors. You can find translations to other schemes online. A typical 4-wire HB has the red+white connected together. Black is usually hot, green is ground. Making a HB into a single coil involves shorting one of the two internal coils.

    FYI, generally you'll get a better response by starting your own thread, instead of tagging onto someone else's. ;)

    Screen Shot 2018-09-28 at 3.16.38 PM.png
     
  13. BillB

    BillB TDPRI Member

    16
    Apr 16, 2009
    Delaware OH
    Thanks so much.
     
  14. moosie

    moosie Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Age:
    61
    Jul 18, 2010
    Western Connecticut
    You're welcome. I just noticed my humbucker says "Bridge" on it. Copy/paste error. Disregard the label, the circuit is the same.
     
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