What CAGED shapes for running licks?

Discussion in 'Tab, Tips, Theory and Technique' started by slinger, Oct 27, 2014.

  1. slinger

    slinger Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    3,283
    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2013
    Location:
    wild west
    What CAGED shapes do you find useful for running licks, and for what music style? I know this can get confusing because any shape can be used for any key any style..so lets keep this to first position shape (cowboy chords)..ie..I like the A shape spanning up to the 5th fret (starting the G position) or or A shape and working behind it, for country licks.
     
  2. jbmando

    jbmando Poster Extraordinaire Silver Supporter

    Posts:
    5,623
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2009
    Location:
    Plymouth Meeting, PA
    All of them, every style. I'm not being a wise guy. My practice routine has been to play licks in as many positions as I can to fully learn the fretboard, so I really do use all the CAGED shapes for much of my playing. The E and A shapes lend themselves to blues and rock, country licks flow out of A, G and C, country and folky stuff works in D, but I try to play all styles with all the shapes. I mostly think of the CAGED shapes as octave finders.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2014
  3. JayFreddy

    JayFreddy Poster Extraordinaire

    Age:
    54
    Posts:
    8,543
    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Location:
    Dallas TX USA
    Position is simply the fret closest to your first finger.

    Most open campfire chord forms are technically in first or second position, but are considered open position chords due to the prevalence of open strings.

    I think I'm not understanding your question...

    Are you asking a question?

    I think it's widely understood that the G major/E minor form pentatonic is the most widely abused... Mostly because it stays in one position and is easy to memorize.

    Once you learn your 5 forms, they all kind of blend together...

    I rarely think about what form to use. I think about what sound to make. The current position of my hand combined with the desired sound determines which form to "grab" to get the sound with a minimum of effort.

    I don't choose a form to find a specific sound. I choose the sound, which then finds the form... Hope that makes sense! :oops:
     
  4. Stratburst

    Stratburst Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    2,140
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2009
    Location:
    Toronto
    I know the neck fairly well so it's all good to me. I admit that, if I don't know a tune very well, I'll make sure the tonic chord is in the A shape so I can barre it with my first finger and run licks off there, Curtis Mayfield-style. I can pretty much make any chord (short of jazz) from that position so it's easy for me to play a song I'm not familiar with in that position.
     
  5. JayFreddy

    JayFreddy Poster Extraordinaire

    Age:
    54
    Posts:
    8,543
    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Location:
    Dallas TX USA
    I think you're confusing the term "position" with "form" or "shape" or "pattern".

    Position is a standard term that means the fret number closest to the index finger, and therefore always expressed as a number.

    The A shape or A form pentatonic is movable, and gives you a B tonality in 2nd position, C tonality in 3rd position, etc.

    I'm not really that dogmatic, but this is a simple concept that is misunderstood by many otherwise talented guitarists.
     
  6. P Thought

    P Thought Poster Extraordinaire Silver Supporter

    Posts:
    9,071
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2009
    Location:
    Plundertown (Gasville) OR
    I think (though I admit I don't know) that the system got called CAGED because those were the keys when each pattern was played closest to the nut, it follows the sequence in which the patterns follow each other, and that sequence spelled a word, where GEDCA or EDCAG, or FD#C#BG# wouldn't so much. . . .

    I often think of the scale patterns as 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5, because of the order in which I learned them--I started with the G pattern, back when somebody first showed me to play a scale, down by the nut where I then played everything else.

    Each of the patterns has any number of licks within it. I wish I could find more of them!
     
  7. JayFreddy

    JayFreddy Poster Extraordinaire

    Age:
    54
    Posts:
    8,543
    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Location:
    Dallas TX USA
    Get Excellent Doing Chords Always! ;) :oops:

    (Always Get Excellent Doing Chords... Chords Always Get Excellent Doing Chords... Etc. )
     
  8. P Thought

    P Thought Poster Extraordinaire Silver Supporter

    Posts:
    9,071
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2009
    Location:
    Plundertown (Gasville) OR
    Jay Freddy, I'm a bit of an insomniac, up earlier than usual. What are you doing up in the middle of the night?
     
  9. JayFreddy

    JayFreddy Poster Extraordinaire

    Age:
    54
    Posts:
    8,543
    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Location:
    Dallas TX USA
    I'm a night owl too, but some nights are worse than others. I work 2nd shift, so it's usually not too painful!
     
  10. Erik8

    Erik8 Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    190
    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2005
    I see a lot of players don't use the "D-shape" I think that is a mistake. Use all of them.
     
  11. slinger

    slinger Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    3,283
    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2013
    Location:
    wild west
    [jbmando]...All of them, every style. I'm not being a wise guy. My practice routine has been to play licks in as many positions as I can to fully learn the fretboard, so I really do use all the CAGED shapes for much of my playing. The E and A shapes lend themselves to blues and rock, country licks flow out of A, G and C, country and folky stuff works in D, but I try to play all styles with all the shapes. I mostly think of the CAGED shapes as octave finders.

    __________________I'm having trouble seeing the C shape for country style ,or just running licks..could you please post a few ideas using it? also could you please explain..CAGED shapes as octave finders..thanks..I find your video posts very helpful.
     
  12. BigDaddyLH

    BigDaddyLH Telefied Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    48,482
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2009
    Location:
    Kelowna, BC, Canuckistan
    Perhaps that's because, for the minor/major pentatonic scales, that's the one shape that spans 5 frets. The other four, for the minor/major pentatonic scales, span only 4 frets.
     
  13. Leon Grizzard

    Leon Grizzard Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    3,660
    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2006
    Location:
    Austin, Texas
    I use them all, but, although I don't know them by the CAGED names, playing like key of G around the third fret (and second fret) is my favorite home base. So playing the IV chord, C, in same position, and playing D chord in that same area, or two frets up around the 5th fret.

    That position is okay for hammer on and off major pentatonic licks, but G and C at the fifth fret is better, and like D at the second fret is good, too. Hammering and pulling from the notes D to E, along with the held G note at the third fret over a C chord has a very Floyd Cramer sound to me. So those are some specific type of licks that I associate with specific forms.
     
  14. boneyguy

    boneyguy Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    61
    Posts:
    11,571
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Location:
    victoria b.c. CANADA
    Just offering a slight but important correction....the CAGED shapes don't represent keys, each letter represents a chord shape played in open position (cowboy chords). The term 'key' describes a collection of notes and chords that have a common relationship....this is not what CAGED is.

    Using the term 'shape' rather than 'pattern' is more typical within the CAGED system.

    I agree that the 'word' CAGED was chosen because it actually forms a recognizable word so it's easy to remember....also the individual shapes of CAGED do always occur in the same order as you move them up the neck. For example if you start with the chord 'C 'using the C shape (1st fret) and move up the neck to every next available 'C' chord you will find that the pattern of CAGED is spelled out...so there is a pattern in that sense.
     
  15. boneyguy

    boneyguy Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    61
    Posts:
    11,571
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Location:
    victoria b.c. CANADA
    I know this doesn't specifically address the OP's question but I thought I'd repost a description of CAGED that I posted a couple years ago.....(for what it's worth)

    ---------------------------------------------

    CAGED describes the naturally occurring pattern that exists on the fretboard in standard tuning. Whether you are aware of the CAGED pattern or not you are using it while playing because it's how the guitar is designed. You cannot not use it. You can be unaware that you are using it though.

    The letters "C,A,G,E,D" refer to the open position chords that we all know down around the first few frets of the guitar near the nut. The CAGED system shows how those same chord shapes can be moved up and down the guitar neck.

    Personally I think it's much more useful to think of CAGED as octave shapes but usually it's taught as chord shapes which I think does it a great disservice. If you begin by learning CAGED as octave shapes then you can see quickly that it applies not only to chords but also scales and arpeggios and licks and phrases etc. Because CAGED describes the 'architecture' of the fretboard it is applicable to any aspect of music.

    Once you begin to see this pattern in numerous keys, all over the neck it really quickly opens up your playing and understanding of the guitar. It's like having a roadmap that allows you to see exactly where you are and where you are going so it drastically reduces the probability of getting lost on the fretboard and dramatically increases the probability that you can play what you are hearing in your head.

    Some people will argue that CAGED is simply one way of organizing the fretboard and they will talk about using arpeggios and intervals etc. as a method of navigating the fretboard but what they aren’t' understanding is that those are simply smaller sub-patterns of CAGED. CAGED is the master pattern that determines the shape and location of intervals, arpeggios, scales and chords.


    CAGED is more than just one way to see the guitar out of many other ways. It is the map of how the architecture of the fretboard is laid out in standard tuning.

    CAGED is not a musical concept or music theory. It is a very clear and concise map of the guitar fretboard. It's mechanical not musical.

    So comparing it to learning scales for instance as a way of learning the fretboard is not an appropriate comparison. Scales are a musical concept. CAGED is not.

    CAGED is simply a physical mapping of the fretboard. It's not interpretive, it's literal. In fact I think of CAGED as a meta-map. It's the master map that all other maps, such as major scales, are simply sub-categories or sub-divisions of.

    I think the most useful way to begin seeing CAGED is with octave shapes. That's the most basic map of CAGED and in my opinion by far the most useful.

    Many people seem to have the limited notion that CAGED is strictly about moving open chord shapes up and down the neck. I think this is the most limiting and the least useful notion of what CAGED is.

    Learn the 5 CAGED octave shapes first and it will set you free!!

    After that you can begin moving chords and scales around the fretboard using CAGED and it will all look very logical, connected and systematic.
     

    Attached Files:

  16. Thorpey

    Thorpey Tele-Holic

    Posts:
    925
    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2008
    Location:
    Blackpool, UK
    My favourite ever TDPRI post :p
     
  17. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    31,729
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2003
    Location:
    Lubbock, TX
    Excuse me...that didn't work out....
     
  18. JayFreddy

    JayFreddy Poster Extraordinaire

    Age:
    54
    Posts:
    8,543
    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Location:
    Dallas TX USA
    I like Boney's approach too. I actually took that CAGED Gif and incorporated it into a PDF I give to students for learning the 5 forms of Major and Minor chords and their related Pentatonic and Blues forms.

    Never used this host before, hopefully this will work:

    http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=50307803879348315894

    Fingerings/grips are just suggestions.
     
  19. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    31,729
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2003
    Location:
    Lubbock, TX
    Trivia question...how many scale patterns for say a C major scale---in one octave...no repitition? This is what confused me about CAGED....it is incomplete, imho.
     
  20. BigDaddyLH

    BigDaddyLH Telefied Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    48,482
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2009
    Location:
    Kelowna, BC, Canuckistan
    What is your definition of a scale pattern?
     
IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.


  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.