Weird days in vintage Fender tube amp pricing

Discussion in 'Glowing Bottle Tube Amp Forum' started by theprofessor, May 13, 2019.

  1. chris m.

    chris m. Poster Extraordinaire

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    If an amp can't handle being rolled around on casters then it's an unreliable amp, IMHO.

    They used to test Traynors for durability by dropping them out of a second story window, so I'm told, anyway.

    Have you ever tried to vibrate apart a solder joint? Ain't happening.

    Now what definitely can happen is tubes can jostle loose in their sockets. But that happens just driving around and
    going over bumps. I always make sure all my tubes are nicely seated before firing up the amp after moving it around.

    All it takes is a few minutes of thinking about physics and forces to realize this is an absurd concern. If you can't pull
    apart a solder joint by yanking on a wire with a lot of force, then there ain't no way some minor vibrations are going to
    do anything.
     
  2. Whatizitman

    Whatizitman Tele-Afflicted

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    We're not really disagreeing on much. And I didn't mean to bash millennials. Quite the opposite, actually. I'm GenX. I happen to like Millennials. I was making a very sarcastic point that younger players are less likely to take up the baton for vintage amps, as much as older players would like them to. It's wishful thinking. Speaking generally, of course, as every player is unique. I'm just not counting on any huge 'backlash' or 'rock revolution' anytime soon. My generation has been waiting for that to happen since 1998.

    EDIT: oh yeah. And again welcome. Don't let us old(er) curmudgeons run you off. It's actually really a nice bunch of folks here. Nicer here than any other forum I've been, IMO.
     
  3. MilwMark

    MilwMark Poster Extraordinaire Ad Free Member

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    Kinda like the folks who are afraid to ship an amp. How do they think it got from the manufacturer to the retailer?
     
  4. grolan1

    grolan1 Friend of Leo's

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    I know I personally never did nor would I roll my amps around outside or on a rough surface using casters... it does quick hard vibrations/jarring much different than in a box being shipped across the country or in the truck of your car. I think about all of the cabinet's joints, speaker voice coil, etc getting this. Can't be good in the long run let alone any other of the amps components. And I would never use them on any rough surface when the amp was extremely cold or hot (after using it). But that's just me I guess... I was actually told by the dealer who sold me my 73 Pro Reverb to be careful when I used the casters (exactly what I talked about above) when I bought it new in 73.
     
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  5. scottser

    scottser Tele-Afflicted

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    I would dearly love a Marshall bluesbreaker combo. It's without doubt the most beautiful sounding amp I've ever played through but logically I can't really justify the expense of it right now. But if and when I ever do I would make it work for gigs and rehearsals and not worry about the size of it.
     
  6. rob2

    rob2 Tele-Holic

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    ...went the opposite way a few years ago,sold the smaller combo stuff and went head/various cabs.......can always use a light,modern 2x12 if needed....none come even close to the weight of my old Blues Deluxe with its mdf construction...
    ...none of the heads are more than 50w....
    An important reason for me is they are much easier to maintain when there are no reliable techs for a long way around.....I can find my way around them to do most jobs now,whereas many modern amps are staring to look like the inside of a mobile phone....compared to filter caps the size of a bucket and well spread out resistors etc with nice long stalks which are easy to identify and work on.
    Admittedly I'm in an isolated spot not an apartment(did my time there too,with headphones etc)and I like the "torque"...brilliant term btw....
     
  7. teleman1

    teleman1 Tele-Holic

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    Has anyone heard that "CRACK" in a Kemper or AXE FX III? I bet the axe fx with the right amp easily gets it. If it does?,GAME OVER. Anyone?
     
  8. Musekatcher

    Musekatcher Tele-Afflicted

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    deleted, repeat
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2019
  9. Musekatcher

    Musekatcher Tele-Afflicted

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    Many folks, well most folks don't know what that's like. If they've had some time with a worn out Twin, it was probably sick, and gave a poor reflection.

    Also, I'm a little puzzled by the "too much amp" theory. They used Twins for the same things we do today, similar levels - loud conversation in a bar is the same as it was 30, 40 years ago, so the same volume levels apply. We talked over the band then, and do now. I think they just didn't insist on driving 100W into pure power section saturation, and used pedals or other techniques for that. Like now.

    How come I see more Twins than Deluxes from the old days? I think they made and sold more Twins?

    Another possible exaggeration, nobody played stadiums with just a Twin and an SVT. They either had PA support, or stacks of Twins and Fridges, or they sounded pathetic.
     
  10. kookaburra

    kookaburra Tele-Afflicted

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    Haha, I recently did a mid century modern house tour here in Phoenix, and at least a couple places had the old consoles.
     
  11. MilwMark

    MilwMark Poster Extraordinaire Ad Free Member

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    30-40 years ago people came to clubs to hear live music and dance. Club owners wanted people on the street to know they had a band and the band was a draw. A friend of mine had to get an extension cab with an efficient speaker because his cranked Twin “wasn’t loud enough”.

    Now, bars that “want” bands expect their patrons to be able to order drinks in a conversational voice and to converse without difficulty. I often start to get the stink eye once my Deluxe Reverb hits 3-4. Which is not quiet but not crazy by means.

    Totally different ballgame.
     
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  12. MilwMark

    MilwMark Poster Extraordinaire Ad Free Member

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    30-40 years ago people came to clubs to hear live music and dance. Club owners wanted people on the street to know they had a band and the band was a draw. A friend of mine had to get an extension cab with an efficient speaker because his cranked Twin “wasn’t loud enough”.

    Now, bars that “want” bands expect their patrons to be able to order drinks in a conversational voice and to converse without difficulty. I often start to get the stink eye when my Deluxe Reverb hits 3-4 on the volume. Not quiet, but not outrageously loud by any means.

    Totally different ballgame.
     
  13. theprofessor

    theprofessor Friend of Leo's

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    I have never, ever heard of this before. As odd as his concerns sound at first blush, I'd listen up to someone who was/is a 40-year vet with Fender.

    Interesting. I wonder if the tech cited above is thinking that vibrations affect the solder joints in the same way they affect the finger joints on a cabinet. The stress is going to be greatest where the two surfaces meet. Maybe this would apply equally to where the solder joints meet the chassis most directly (like the way Fender soldered grounds directly to the chassis)?

    It would be second-nature for me to be cautious when rolling a heavy amp around on rough surfaces with hard wheels. It just feels wrong to me. I'd guess the best thing would be a dolly with inflatable wheels, but that creates new problems and awkwardnesses.
     
  14. Milspec

    Milspec Friend of Leo's

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    I am no wizard of wiring, just listen to those who have the pedigres when they tell me things. All I know is that my amp tech knows his business and seeing him so freaked out over me rolling my Twin on those casters was enough for me to pay attention. He really felt that casters were a terrible idea on amps and whether it was the solder joints, the reverb wire, or what-ever that may be at risk, he was dead serious about it.

    We do have some great amp techs on this site and it would be interesting to hear their opinions....might take a new thread.
     
  15. theprofessor

    theprofessor Friend of Leo's

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    Yes, Milspec: why don't you make a new thread on amps and casters and solicit people's opinions and expertise? This will be easier to find in the future, since the discussion is buried in this thread.
     
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  16. Milspec

    Milspec Friend of Leo's

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    Done...curious to see what responses we get
     
  17. Mike Eskimo

    Mike Eskimo Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    A clip on YouTube shows him in 79-80 using one onstage
     
  18. jsnwhite619

    jsnwhite619 Friend of Leo's

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    The biggest thing I learned in vintage amps over the past couple years is that there are guys who set a lot of these prices just by the fact that they buy, sell, and trade amps like stocks and commodities. I know a couple guys who do it for a living and have financial backers for it. So when you see somebody that posts a $5,000 amp or $20,000 guitar sometimes it might not be that person that buys it or owns it but a collective group. Took me awhile to figure it out but there's more of that going on then you would think.

    I honestly think that is a short-lived window because I'm mid-30s and I just don't see guys younger than me that really care about the whole vintage market. if a twenty-year-old musician can afford a $2,000 Princeton reverb he's just playing for fun anyway because he doesn't have to work for a living. I think eBay set a level of low prices for a while because everybody could look it up. But Reverb created the boutique market and stores and sellers who can just list anything for $1,000 more than it's actually worth and people will buy it because that's a status symbol for who they bought it from.

    The fact that people continuously sell newly built Tweed Deluxe amps for over $2,000 is proof enough that it's a seller's market right now. Ironically, most of the people I know who will pay $1500 for a vintage Princeton reverb because "it will last forever" will sell it within 6 months after they buy it for something else has the next great thing

    Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
     
    Last edited: May 16, 2019
  19. MuddyWolf

    MuddyWolf Tele-Meister

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    These things go in cycles. Whats an original model T Ford go for? I bet there was a time you couldnt give the thing away. In 1975 a plexi went for a couple hundred dollars on the right day. Now theyre over 2 or 3 thousand. In 10 years it will probably drop. In 25 years it might be 10 grand. By em and play em. If you want to invest in something buy stocks on wall street.
     
  20. theprofessor

    theprofessor Friend of Leo's

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    Ouch. And probably true.
     
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