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Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com

The ES-335/336/345/345/347/355/Dot/Dot Studio/Lucille

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by Heather Anne Peel, Aug 12, 2006.

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  1. Heather Anne Peel

    Heather Anne Peel Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    54
    Aug 29, 2005
    Nowhere
    The ES-325/335/336/345/347/355/Dot/Dot Studio/Lucille

    I really love these type of guitars. I have 3 such guitars in my collection: a cherry red Epiphone Dot, a black Dot Studio and a really cool early '80s Vantage VSH-455. The semi-hollow body style produces an amazing sound, and these type of guitars play really effortlessly. I have always loved them. In the '80s, I had a '69 Gibson ES-335, which was equally great. So many of my fave guitarists use or have used these over the years. The tone is a really nice blend of acoustic and electric qualities. These guitars are excellent for lots of styles, which probably accounts for their being one of the mainstay session guitars during the '70s. Eric Clapton, Keith Richards, Alvin Lee, Larry Carlton, Rich Robinson, Pat Simmons, Freddie King, Chuck Berry, BB King, Elvin Bishop are just a few examples of players who have made amazing music using this type of electric guitar. Definitely a classic and one of my faves!
    :cool: Heather
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2006

  2. TheGoodTexan

    TheGoodTexan Doctor of Teleocity

    Apr 28, 2003
    Nashville, TN
    My favorite one of the bunch was the standard issue Gibson ES-336....the one with the straight-stringpull-heastock:

    [​IMG]

    I know that the non-traditional Gibson headstock is a deal-killer for some folks, but the looks don't bother me.

    I worked at Gibson when these guitars were being designed and introduced, and I got to play a large handfull of them before they left the factory. When I bought my LP Custom at my employee discount (dealer cost), it came down to the LP or the 336. This was before the 336 was designated as a Custom Shop guitar. It was just made in the standard facility in Nashville, and the price was a little more reasonable.

    I loved the 336. It has so much "air" in the tone. Just a very lively and resonate guitar. Although it looks like a 335jr, it has a character all its own.

    I ended up going with the LP, but in retrospect, I might should have got the ES-336. They don't make it that way any more. I believe that it's now a CS-336, being made only in the Custom Shop, and Gibson has ambandoned the straight-stringpull-headstock (although it is a superior design).

    Also, at that time (mid-to-late 1990s), there were a very few number of 25.5" scale ES-336s made (with the narrow headstock).....believe it or not. Now that was a very cool guitar. It didn't sound anything like a Gibson, but it was dang cool. I'd bet that there were less than 50 of them made (just from what I remember). So that's a rare bird for sure.
     

  3. Maestro

    Maestro Tele-Holic

    I'm on the lookout for a gibson 330. a friend of my dad has a first year one pickup witch is really cool.

    But I'm also on the lookout for a short scale archtop/335 type.

    I didn't like the epi dot, but the sheraton I played was good but to elaborate.
    I would like to try the riviera.
     

  4. vic108

    vic108 Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    61
    Nov 25, 2005
    Greenbackville, VA
    I got ES fever bad............
     

  5. Telenator

    Telenator Doctor of Teleocity Vendor Member

    Sep 19, 2005
    Vermont

  6. Heather Anne Peel

    Heather Anne Peel Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    54
    Aug 29, 2005
    Nowhere
    Nice! Heritage made some great ES style axes. I believe Heritage was founded by former Gibson employees, if I recall correctly.
    Heather
     

  7. Telenator

    Telenator Doctor of Teleocity Vendor Member

    Sep 19, 2005
    Vermont
    Yes, several of the original Gibson people stayed behind in Kalamazoo when Gibson moved to Nashville. Heritage guitars are produced in one of the old buildings Gibson used to occupy.

    If you close your eyes and play, the feel is exactly like a Gibson. It just costs less!
     

  8. Heather Anne Peel

    Heather Anne Peel Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    54
    Aug 29, 2005
    Nowhere
    My Epi Dot and Dot Studio are really great, as well. Yes, I know a "real" 335 is better, but I can't possibly afford that. Well, I could, but I have chosen to buy more less expensive guitars! Anyway, I love my Dots. My cherry red one especially, but they are both pretty great.
    Heather
     

  9. Heather Anne Peel

    Heather Anne Peel Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    54
    Aug 29, 2005
    Nowhere
    My God, how could I leave Steve Miller off my list of ES players?! His semi-hollowbody tones on his first 5 LPs was nothing short of stunning. Steve sounds great on his Strats, etc., but his tone back then was killer! His solo on "Little Girl" from 1969's "Your Saving Grace" floors me. Awesome!
    Heather
     

  10. TheGoodTexan

    TheGoodTexan Doctor of Teleocity

    Apr 28, 2003
    Nashville, TN
    So is there a general concensus on the Epiphone Dot versus the Sheraton II?

    I'm not a big fan of all the extra "stuff" on the Sheraton II, but I think I prefer that neck over the neck on the Dot.

    And I'm not sure that I'd be able to deal with the tail piece on the Rivera, although I do think the mini-hums sound cool in the ES-style body.

    Since Epiphone is distributed from here in Nashville, there seem to be a glut of used Dots and Sheraton IIs around town from time to time. Over the years I've seen several used Dots around town that have been upgraded with Gibson humbuckers and electronics (pots and switches)....for $199! :eek: They feel great and sound terrific.

    And I've never really noticed much of a "snobbery" among ES-owners.....as far as Epiphones versus Gibsons. Sure, the Gibsons are generally better over quality, but that doesn't mean that there aren't some really great Epiphones out there too.
     

  11. Bill

    Bill Poster Extraordinaire Ad Free Member

    Mar 16, 2003
    London
    Thanks for including the ES-347! These were real sleepers until recently, but I've noticed they've gone up in price over the past few years.

    I posted about this in your other thread, but I love its versatility with its coil tap. It also plays very smoothly, and looks very snazzy with the ebony board, big pearl block inlays, and multiple ply binding. I can't play it that well, but in the proper hands (i.e. not mine) it could cover rock, blues, fusion (what it was designed for), funk, country, and jazz.

    Not so good for slack key Hawaiian or ragtime, I suppose.

    Oooh, I gotta go play it now.
     

  12. Heather Anne Peel

    Heather Anne Peel Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    54
    Aug 29, 2005
    Nowhere
    The 347 was a great model. I wanted one back in 1981 when they were new. I wonder what they go for on the used market? I'll have to check on that! On a related note, there was also the short-lived (1980-82) 335-S, the solidbody 335 shaped guitar. It was cool, but sonically it was more like an SG or a Melody Maker.
    Heather
     

  13. aznrambo481

    aznrambo481 Friend of Leo's

    My guitar teacher lent me his 1983 Ibanez AS-200. Extremely nice jazzy guitar, with 1 more switch than the regular ES's (i never figured out what it does, series/parallel?). Big MOP inlays, back of neck painted black and lacquered, and the most beautiful sunburst finish ever. One of the strap buttons was on the base of the neck, not on the side like the ES at the top of the page. The only dent on the whole thing was a 1 cm long one on the back, possibly from a belt. Played like a dream with D'addario 13 chromes on it. Really heavy though... and really loud unplugged. Pity I had to give it back.
     

  14. Heather Anne Peel

    Heather Anne Peel Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    54
    Aug 29, 2005
    Nowhere
    I also seem to remember the Gibson ES-325, which was like a "budget" 335, with a backplate for the controls, rather than the controls mounted in the usual fashion. I remember playing a cherry red one in 1979 through an Ampeg VT-22 at Veneman Music in Springfield, VA, near where I grew up. It was a nice guitar, but I ended up getting an awesome Bradley (made by Ibanez) 335 copy. It was cherry red, and believe it or not, it was the best ES type guitar I have ever played. I really wish I still had it! My cherry red Epi Dot is a great replacement, however.
    Heather
     

  15. Bill

    Bill Poster Extraordinaire Ad Free Member

    Mar 16, 2003
    London
    According to Gbase, they're asking $1800 to $2500.

    They were around $500 in the 80's, $800 - $1000 in the 90's, and I haven't seen them under $1400 in the past 5 years.

    Also, they underwent a bunch of incarnations, including removing the Sustain Sisters (heavy brass studs under the bridge or tailpiece), a brass nut (changed mine to bone), the distance between the bridge and tailpiece, whether there were fine tuners on the tailpiece or not (I love them, but others don't), what sort of pickups were in it (generally, overdriven ceramic ones--I changed mine for Lindy Fralins). So I expect the sound of these changed over time, as they became more like the other ES guitars.
     

  16. PK

    PK Banned

    Feb 27, 2006
    Ventura California
    CS-336...

    I have the CS-336 in Tangerine Burst. It's truley a dream come true guitar for me. I sold an old J-45 and a Les Paul Standard DC plus added a bit of cash to ease the pain of the cost..... I'd do it again in a heartbeat :). The 57 classic HB pups produce warm sounds on the neck pup, and screams thru the bridge pup (I generally play thru the bridge pups and full tilt overdrive thru my Marshall 50W half stack). I rarely use any effects except the amp overdrive and a wah pedal.

    Here's what Gibson says:

    "The CS-336 represents the fullfillment of a goal set forth over 100 years ago by Orville Gibson. The Mahogany back, sides and centerblockof the CS-336 are tonally carved from a single block of wood (this single piece construction was one of Orville's original goals) and, when joined to the carved maple top create a guitar with unsurpassed resonance and woody tone. It's scaled down body size and slim taper neck allow for more comfortable playing with no compromise in tone".

    Here's a pic:

    [​IMG]

    PK
     

  17. CharlieO

    CharlieO Friend of Leo's Ad Free Member

    Mar 2, 2003
    Sarasota, FL
    I had an ES-336 several years ago, and at the same time I had an Ibanez AS-80, which I still own. I really wanted to like the ES-336, because initially it seemed like the ideal ES-style guitar for me. Its smaller size was great, and it was comfortable, but in the end the shoddy workmanship and the fact that the $325 used Ibanez sounded better meant that the ES didn't stick around very long.

    I'm a big fan of the Ibanez AS series guitars. The Super 58 pickups make 'em sing beautifully.
     

  18. reverbbb

    reverbbb Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    59
    Sep 12, 2003
    Just Plano, Texas
    Ha! I just so happen to have one of these for sale on eBay at this very moment. Mine is the Paul Jackson Jr, version and renamed to ES-346. It has several upgrade features like AAA top and gold hardware. At the moment, the selling price is a STEAL for such a fine guitar.

    Paul Jackson Jr. ES-346
     

  19. TheGoodTexan

    TheGoodTexan Doctor of Teleocity

    Apr 28, 2003
    Nashville, TN
    I'm pretty sure that they are not the same guitar. I think the Paul Jackson Jr. signature guitar has a thinner body, no? Its also got a "belly cut" contour.
     

  20. eggman

    eggman Friend of Leo's

    Mar 18, 2003
    Bossier City,La.
    Howdy,

    I've got a 1980 Gibson ES-335 CRR. ("Country Rock Regular"). It came stock with a coil-split switch on the lower bout, brass nut, TP-6 and "Dirty Fingers" p/u's.
    I've replaced the p/u's with SD 59's-much closer to Ted McCarty's original design in terms of tone; sounds great. Replaced that bothersome TP-6 with a standard nickel "stop" model and refitted it with a black pickguard ala McCarty's original design. It also has small block inlays which add a graceful elegance to this lovely instrument. She weighs 9lbs!
    Looking carefully at the neck it APPEARS to be Maple. Hmm..Truthfully I spend little time with my ES-335; it's a tad heavy and it's got humbuckers! She does play like butter though; so maybe I need to spend more time reaquainting myself. Sounds great through my '65 Princeton (BF) with the volume up to 7 or higher. Nails the tone from the theme to "The Rockford Files". I'm a disciple of Chuck Berry, so a 335 is a must for me :)

    Eggman
     

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