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sold the Mustang III, bought a GT-100... bad move. :(

Discussion in 'Modeling Amps, Plugins and Apps' started by jbuonacc, Oct 7, 2014.

  1. jbuonacc

    jbuonacc TDPRI Member

    48
    May 11, 2014
    NY, USA
    i've been fighting with this GT-100 all weekend, i don't think i'll be able to keep it. i can hardly even explain it, but there's really something odd about the A/D converters on the Boss. the response just isn't there somehow, it always feels a bit compressed or something. coming from the Mustang amps where everything just felt "alive"(with some fine-tuning), i just couldn't understand it at first.

    for days i thought maybe i just hadn't come across some hidden "sensitivity" setting or something, but one does not exist. after all i tried something just didn't feel "right" with the GT, so i did some basic testing earlier today. my 'benchmark' (i guess) is a modified version of the "Johnny Marr Clean" patch on the Mustang. loved that patch, anything i put through it just sang and broke up nicely when pushing up the Gain. so, that's what i've got in mind when testing the GT. i figured if i could get that, then more high gain, fuzzed out stuff should be no problem. just couldn't get the GT to 'feel like' the Fender amp models on the Mustang.

    on the other hand, i found that i really like the overall functionality as well as a LOT of the sounds you can get from the GT-100. overall, i think the tone itself is there, but it felt like the strings went up to 13s from 9s. i found that for certain styles of playing, this 'hard' sound worked great, even with the lack of touch. the GT really has a crisp, punchy sound and i think the high gain and od/dist/fuzz sounds are VERY flexible. i'm just not finding much of any of that 'subtle growl' that the Mustang does so effortlessly. the cleans are either too clean (and don't really grrrr when you hit it), or too just generally 'overdriven'.


    ... more to say, have to run for now. pretty upset with myself that i didn't make sure to try one out before going ahead with this. i was so impressed with some of those YT demos, i really didn't see this coming. i'll write back with more of my findings.

    now that i mention the strings, i wonder what would happen if i went from 10s to 7s or something. :D the thing might open right up!
     

  2. TeleTex82

    TeleTex82 Friend of Leo's

    May 4, 2010
    San Antone
    We all make mistakes, I love my new Mustang III. Best modeling amp out there in my opinion and right up there with lots of tube amps too.
     
    DougF likes this.

  3. codamedia

    codamedia Friend of Leo's

    Apr 4, 2009
    Western Canada
    I really like Boss effect pedals (I'm not a Boss snob) - but I agree with you on this statement. I can't put my finger on it either, but I've owned a GT-6 and a GT-8 and felt the exact same thing... I tend to describe it as a "sterile feel". What is odd - is I didn't get this with the older Boss ME series (ME-5, ME-10) even up to and including an ME-50.

    In fairness - I have not tried the newer ME or GT series... so I can't comment directly on those. But what you are trying to describe sounds very familiar to me.

    Good luck!
     

  4. iluvchiclets

    iluvchiclets Tele-Meister

    171
    Jan 26, 2012
    Ontario
    Have no fear! You bought the best of the GT models ever offered by Boss. It might take a bit of learning on your part. Too bad the GT Central forums are gone...

    What amp are you playing it through? The Mustang has it's own sonic signature, and if you're used to sound coming from that speaker cabinet it's possible anything might sound/feel different.

    What amp models are you using on the GT to get close to Johnny Marr clean? I don' t have the manual near me, but there are advanced amps on the GT that are remarkable. Try the clean amps on both advanced and vintage. Don't be afraid to bump up the gain (on the GTs it goes to 120!) And make sure your gain switch is set to middle.

    ...or take a higher-gain amp model, drop the gain switch to "low", and play around with that.

    Remember the cabinet models on the GT only work if you are in Line-Out/PA mode, so make sure your output mode is set to that. Forget the manual when it says to use combo mode, or stack mode, or whatever...you're missing a whole lot of sparkle when you use anything other than Line Out mode. Try the other modes if you like, but you will not have speaker modeling.

    Others may disagree on these points, but they have been my observations over the years owning multiple GT6's, 8's, 10's, and the GT001. I would love to own a Gt100 when my finances improve! It's a very versatile piece of gear...great amp models and FX.

    (Do the latest firmware update for new amp models and effects!)
     

  5. Obsessed

    Obsessed Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Nov 21, 2012
    Montana
    Not to be jerk, but why not just get a tube amp and start collecting pedals? It seems that we are in the golden era for fantastic pedals and there are a huge assortment of tube amp available today. I started out on an amp with many voicings and effects, but I could never go back to that again. Just stating an obvious alternative.

    Good luck.
     

  6. iluvchiclets

    iluvchiclets Tele-Meister

    171
    Jan 26, 2012
    Ontario
    He might not like that either. I think he was happy with the Mustang, which sounded good to him ( and had no tubes) but wanted more flexibility.

    It's not like a tube amp is the magic elixir of all tonal problems. I've played quite a few tube amps, as I'm sure you have as well, that I thought, "Ugh, what were they thinking?". It's all preference.
     
    jenos likes this.

  7. sulaco

    sulaco Tele-Meister

    270
    Aug 24, 2012
    Nashville, TN
    (seriously) also not to be a jerk, but why are you posting in here if that's your belief? there are many happy modeling amp owners (especially mustang owners) who feel we've reached a golden era for modeling and that it's FINALLY a suitable alternative to $1500 tube amps. two sides to every coin.

    I'm not arguing with you, I just feel like that post should simply not be posted under the Modeling amps subforum. That's the antithesis of the entire forum; to come in here and tell anyone here "why don't you give all this up and get a 'real' tube amp" is just like me finding someone having issues with their DRRI in the glowing bottle subforum and chiming in with "throw that ancient crap away and get a fender mustang!" it's not helpful for anyone.

    for what it's worth, I do have a mustang III, and it's the best $300 I've ever spent on an amp. I've also had fender tube amps ranging from 1972-2012 of various types and loved them all in many ways. I totally "get" a good modeling amp just as much as I "get" why tube amps are so desirable.

    but the counterpoint to your post is pretty simple: maybe he doesn't want to stack up hundreds or even thousands of dollars into a collection of independently wired/powered pedals each with their own quirks/flaws/interactions and then require (at minimum) a $600 amp to project the sound?
     

  8. Lazer

    Lazer Tele-Meister

    280
    Mar 21, 2012
    Stockholm, Sweden
    Don't be to quick here, This is equipment which are at their best in different evironments.
    I have an old Roland GP100, and it is absolutely fabulastic at recording. On the other
    hand I cna not make it usable in a live situation. If You record it may be good to have
    both a powerful modelling unit with effects, and a tube (or other) amp for live situations.

    I truly beleive that for gigs a tube amp will make life easier, and for recording a modeller
    with effects will do the same.

    Cheers
    L-zr
     

  9. muffy

    muffy Tele-Meister

    111
    Sep 15, 2014
    GTA
    I'm just waiting for the day that modeling amps improve to a point where it's not even a question anymore. One can dream..

    Edit: Relatively happy Mustang II owner
     

  10. fender4life

    fender4life Friend of Leo's

    Sep 18, 2011
    los angeles
    You experienced exactly what i keep saying about the mustang. While the tone is very good, it's not what separates it from other modelers. It's the feel that does, the touch, dynamics etc. IMO thats entirely what make the mustang better than other modelers and pretty much exactly like a tube amp. It's also why not everyone loves them. Guys who's playing isn't based on dynamics like metal players for example aren't going to find anything special about it if they use a ton of gain and leave thier guitar on 10 all the time.
     

  11. jbuonacc

    jbuonacc TDPRI Member

    48
    May 11, 2014
    NY, USA
    i've collected stuff for years, really trying to get away from that. size and portability are also a big concern, so for my needs i was pretty happy with the Mustang.
     

  12. iluvchiclets

    iluvchiclets Tele-Meister

    171
    Jan 26, 2012
    Ontario
    Could I ask what you are using to amplify the GT100?

    Is it an amplifier, or a powered speaker?

    By the way, I liked fender4life's description of why certain amps work for certain players. I agree as well...certain brands work well when I want a hi-fi, tight overdrive. Other brands are good when I want a bluesy, loose kind of sound.
     

  13. jbuonacc

    jbuonacc TDPRI Member

    48
    May 11, 2014
    NY, USA
    actually, i'm mainly using headphones, and this is what i'm basing my experience on.

    lots of good info there, thanks. i've pretty much tried every combination of amp models, speaker cabs/mics (the 'Custom' amp and cab options are really pretty nice, been through all that as well). there's just something about how the input responds that's throwing everything off for me. as said, maybe someone with a different style could get along with it better. i have a pretty 'loose/light' feel most of the time.

    really, i think it's all down to the A/D input. i tested the GT-100 completely dry/bypassed and it still has this same 'stiff' feel to it. plugging direct into my MOTU UltraLite interface (for example) does not have the same negative effect. oddly enough, i've plugged directly into a Boss RC-300 looper to test out its onboard od/dist and didn't really notice this either (i'll try to test this again). i've wondered how it would react re-amping via USB input, but that's not what i bought it for. i've even tried bypassing the Input and going in through the FX Return jack. hard to say whether or not this made any difference, but even if it did that's a pretty big trade-off losing the FX send.

    spent some more time last night with it. like i thought before, it makes the strings feel like a heavier guage. it actually hurts my hand/wrist after a few minutes, because i must not be hearing/feeling certain qualities and am trying to compensate by playing harder. i think for certain people or styles this might be a plus, everything seems to sound/feel very tight/punchy/polished. there's certainly some gorgeous sounds to be had, and just ripping od/dist/fuzz tones. the Spring reverb is a serious letdown though, has the same problems that i found with the Boss '63 Spring pedal.
     

  14. iluvchiclets

    iluvchiclets Tele-Meister

    171
    Jan 26, 2012
    Ontario
    Very interesting reply,

    You sound like you have a pretty good feel for how the GT is reacting to your playing. That's very intuitive for you! And for sure Boss, Vox, Line 6, Mustang, etc,... All have different feels to them.

    There is something different comparing the Mustang to the GT - your sore wrist is a telling point. I would think the A/D is top notch on the GT, in fact probably better than Fender's, though I am only basing that on Boss's long history of making pedals. My gut feeling is that there is a certain EQ, or sound, to the Mustang you have become accustomed to, and you are physically trying to compensate with your fingers and wrist to make it behave like you want it to. That is that "feel" thing everyone talks about. Why do some amps leave us cold, and others inspire us to play our best?

    Perhaps go to the global input page and increase your level so that you aren't playing as hard? Global presence as well?

    Definitely try playing through a speaker rather than headphones - is that how you used your Mustang, were you using headphones or the actual amp speaker? I don't think you can compare the two.

    It is possible that you simply prefer the Fender modeling. I too have sold many items after a few days, thinking, "I just can't get into this pedal (or amp!)".
    That was my first Mustang experience actually! I bought one, and thought, " Yuck...". But you know, my second Mustang I sat with for over a month and only then did I begin to really see what it was all about. I think the same applies to this scenario:

    - Try the GT the same way you enjoyed your Mustang (through speaker or phones)
    - try switching cabs as a way of quickly EQing so that you get a feel you like.
    - don't give up too quickly. Play with it for a week. The GT is a fantastic pedal. Heck, even Johnny Marr is using it!

    If you decide it's not for you, it should be easy to get another Mustang as they are plentiful.

    I sincerely hope you find some sonic goodness in your GT. Please let us know how your experimenting goes.
     

  15. jbuonacc

    jbuonacc TDPRI Member

    48
    May 11, 2014
    NY, USA
    i should have mentioned that i also mainly used the Mustang with headphones as well.

    i've experimented with pretty much every setting, including the global input, etc. then going back and forth seeing if this has any effect on the other parameters, amp models, etc. i've even gone as far as trying to make creative use of the Assigns by trying to modify the Gain via Input Level, but that doesn't work as i hoped. i come from a 10+ year background of synthesizers, samplers, fx, etc, so i was really looking forward to "getting under the hood" and programming the GT.

    i'm used to this sort of low-level tweaking, and quite enjoy it on the GT, but the response just somehow isn't there. i would have expected the Boss converters to be top-notch as well, so i'm suspecting that there's something going on a bit deeper, like there's always some sort of compression happening. no idea, but i can't bother fighting with it any longer. if plugging in clean and disabling everything gives me the same stiff feeling (and the MOTU, iPad, etc doesn't), then there's not much to be done.

    it's not really the 'sound' of it that's an issue, i'm generally happy with that. except for that spring reverb though, that's a major detractor for me. the one on the Mustang wasn't perfect, but it never stuck out to me as flawed. the GT spring is useless to me, and pretty much a must for guitar as far as i'm concerned.

    (more on cab models, etc in a bit...)
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2014

  16. jtees4

    jtees4 Tele-Holic

    916
    Jun 13, 2010
    selden, ny
    I love my Mustang III combo, sold my Cube 80xl when I got it. Actually I had both at the same time and to my own surprise....I liked the Mustang better. I fully expected to like the Cube much better. But I was wrong.
     

  17. iluvchiclets

    iluvchiclets Tele-Meister

    171
    Jan 26, 2012
    Ontario
    You sound like you know you're way around amps and pedals. I'm sorry I couldn't help you discover further.

    I hope you can stick with it for a bit to see if it grows on you but, if not, it's current enough for you to hopefully get a good return on the 2nd hand market.
     

  18. Jim Dep

    Jim Dep Friend of Leo's

    May 23, 2010
    Northern Colorado
    Your dream has come true. Mustang III owners understand that the glorious day you seek is already here.

    Those who still question will never be satisfied, IMO. Happiness continues to evade them. :cry:

    If you're relatively happy with a Mustang II, you'll be truly happy with a Mustang III. :)
     
    Vespa_One likes this.

  19. Guitarteach

    Guitarteach Poster Extraordinaire

    Aug 6, 2014
    UK
    I would concur with OP comments regarding how the GT100 sounds just with headphones. I've posted elsewhere on this forum recently that I thought I had missed a setting somewhere as it is quite 'hard' with headphones only - it's like the amp output models were missing and I was hearing raw fx pedals or just the preamp.

    Through a real amp it sounds just the same as a bunch of pedals to me. Also the digital out into a mix is good too.

    I think the headphone output section is what is weak on the GT 100 for me but for a live multi-fx or digital into a DAW I think it is good. Done the firmware update. It's not changed the fundamental sound but added some extra FX and amps.

    If you bought it for headphone practice you may want to look for an alternative or use it with GarageBand or similar program.
     

  20. Obsessed

    Obsessed Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Nov 21, 2012
    Montana
    I get your point and you are so correct about this being the era of modeling amps as well. My best friend and guitar mentor has a bunch of tube amps, but right now, his favorite is his Mustang III, so I understand the advantages of a modeling amp. However, the Op seems to be unhappy with his quest, so I was just trying to offer an alternative. I know that I stuck my head out in this section, but I did not intend to offend anyone with my suggestion. Sometimes it is difficult to see the forest through the trees ... me included.
     

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