Self Driving Cars

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by Zepfan, May 23, 2019.

  1. memorex

    memorex Friend of Leo's

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    Fully electric cars are limited by batteries. They're slow to charge and have a limited life cycle. They're also an environmental disaster waiting to happen if enough electric cars come to market. Electric cars will never be fully realized until they develop super-capacitors that replace the drive batteries. Super-capacitors will eventually be able to hold as much charge as a similar sized converntional battery, plus they'll be able to recharge in seconds, and in theory, should last the life of the vehicle. We haven't got the technology yet, but then we should've started developing it forty years ago.
     
  2. Toto'sDad

    Toto'sDad Telefied Ad Free Member

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  3. memorex

    memorex Friend of Leo's

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    That's kinda what I'm talking about. Only 16 miles range in full electric mode and 8 hour recharge cycle, which means it will running on gas most of the time, except for short trips.
     
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  4. FenderLover

    FenderLover Friend of Leo's

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    ....And they are developing commercial avionics with current technology for electric planes.
    Most of what was available 20 years ago was foreseen 50 years ago, mostly because of what was known to be possible. What we can't seem to do is realize how long all this takes. I'd like to know where all these batteries will come from when the raw materials are scarce, hard to mine, and expensive to make useful product from. Another energy source would be a great invention. Maybe your kids will solve that one.
     
  5. L.A. Mike

    L.A. Mike Tele-Holic

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    Sometimes I think that people believe that electric cars aren't bad for the environment.
    First problem, when do they think that magical power called electricity comes from? Lightening?
    Then there is the pollution caused by the manufacture, then disposal of these massive batteries.
    As has been mentioned before in this thread, let's not forget the ongoing disaster called the Boeing 737 max 8
    That thing has to fly through the air. If they can't get that right, good luck with cars.
    And why no electric powered planes? Jet fuel is the standard. And all new contracts are for that kind of plane. Jet fuel.
    Makes you wonder why.

    I think electric cars and self-driving cars are here to stay and there is a place for them
    But people who are really into these things think they have to replace all cars and that they are some kind of solution to mass transit
    I feel they will help mass transit problems, but by themselves they aren't the solution.
    There is no ONE solution. Different types of transportation is needed for different areas. Rural vs. Urban vs. Commercial transportation all require different solutions.
     
  6. Toto'sDad

    Toto'sDad Telefied Ad Free Member

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    If you research it lots of very expensive model cars have really crappy electric car range. It's kind of like that guy who gives four thousand dollars for that first big screen tv, that in two or three years is on sale at Costco for 900 bucks, or maybe 700 bucks.
     
  7. FenderLover

    FenderLover Friend of Leo's

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    That guy was me... I remember my first blue ray was $500.

    Car manufacturers need to jump on the bandwagon for their own reasons, however impractical. Give me AC, power windows, and a refund check for all the extra crap they put on cars these days. I don't want any of it.
     
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  8. Toto'sDad

    Toto'sDad Telefied Ad Free Member

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    It is amazing how much they can tack onto the price of something like a FWD Chevy truck. My brother in law bought one with auto transmission, but a manually shifted four wheel drive four door big cab for under forty thousand dollars, it has power steering, power brakes, power windows, all the stuff that I would want, or need.

    Conversely, I looked at a tricked out version of his pickup at Costco the other day, and it was 68,000 dollars! Wow, someone is going to pay dearly for a butt massager.
     
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  9. memorex

    memorex Friend of Leo's

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    The only hybrid vehicle I would even consider at the moment is a Hyundai Ioniq. It's got 124 mile electric range, recharges in 4 hours at 220v, 24 hr at 110v, and a lifetime limited warranty on the hybrid/electric batteries. Costs about the same or a little more than a Prius. I think the Prius is as good a vehicle, but that lifetime battery warranty is huge.
     
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  10. Jim622

    Jim622 Tele-Afflicted Silver Supporter

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    How is it in the snow?
     
  11. Toto'sDad

    Toto'sDad Telefied Ad Free Member

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    It's been my experience with "limited" lifetime warranties is that they last until two days before you need them.
     
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  12. imwjl

    imwjl Poster Extraordinaire

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    What is way off? 6 years?

    The last time I looked VW was #2 car maker in the world and they're all in on electric. It's why current popular models haven't had engine updates like their competition. If I recall the news on their electric commitment was something like ship 3,000,000 electric cars by middle of the next decade. Related is VW and Ford have announced an alliance on next generation technology and producing products for each other.

    Volvo is relatively small output but they announced an all electric or hybrid strategy. They're owned by Geely who owns other brands so that will probably filter down.

    Electric and hybrid trucks and buses are more of a thing than many realize.
     
  13. FenderLover

    FenderLover Friend of Leo's

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    Look again?
    The #2 maker in the world doesn't have a lot of electric in the USA, so that's not really all-in.
    They project to sell 3 million by the middle of next decade, that's 10 years. I'd say longer. Tesla has grossly missed their estimates. They are not updating their gas models because they are still licking their wounds over their massive diesel recall. There are huge lots over here full of recalled VW's still. There's only so much money to throw at anything.

    It's still too early to say what is a thing, IMO. Lot of talk though. Technology is being used. That's nice. When will we see charging stations at our place of employment? How much will that cost to install? How much per KW/h will they charge when you plug in? I have not seen or heard any plans for this massive infrastructure installation that is substantial by anyone's definition. You want to drive your electric to Dallas from Minneapolis? See you in about three days if you find a place to charge it.
     
  14. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    What I'm seeing in my area is that local businesses cannot get qualified applicants at the pay they offer.
    So they go through agencies and import foreign workers and rent them substandard housing at a profit.

    Maybe the USPS can't get enough qualified applicants that pass both background checks and have good driving records?
    If the driver doesn't have to drive, they may save money by not having to offer a high enough rate of pay to attract fully qualified applicants.

    Could also be Govt supporting developing tech?
    Like when Govt bought all those Chrysler K cars to save Chrysler form bankruptcy?

    We still have postal workers driving those RH drive Jeeps, maybe Jeep wants more for a RH drive with sliding door than for a self driving car?
    Or who knows, maybe OSHA decided those Jeeps are unsafe...
     
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  15. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

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    With all the Toyota hybrid owners now getting the bill for a new battery, after we've had them on the road long enough for mass battery failure to make a vast fleet of used cars the owners expected 20 years out of into "total loss" on paper; it seems the Hyundai warranty is an excellent marketing move.

    But how long can we expect a Hyundai to last?
    Longer than the battery?
    If the battery needs replacing when the book value of the car is less than the "value" of the battery, will they still replace the battery for free? Might they do what an inspection station does and say no battery unless the owner pays to bring the rest of the car up to new spec?
    Or might Hyundai owners have simply not spent the $1500 to repair their 9yo Car that booked at $1000 in excellent condition, when the inspection station told them what needed to be done for a sticker?

    My inlaws just had to replace an aging Prius battery in California, and it cost basically more than the car was worth.
    IOW the car was totaled, but they opted to get it fixed anyhow.

    Marketing is so much about pushing our perceptions.
    Subaru owners I know keep getting $3500 repair bills on their late model boxers.
    Subaru ads proudly state that over 90% of Subarus are still on the road after ten years.
    That's not much to brag about.

    Monsanto/ Bayer advertises that we've trusted Roundup for over 40 years.

    Poland Spring/ Nestle advertises that they put lots of money into the Maine economy.

    If we look into the backgrounds of these businesses histories we see that they are putting spin on old bad press.
    How many can be fooled how much of the time?
     
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  16. Buckocaster51

    Buckocaster51 Super Moderator Staff Member Ad Free Member

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    1) hydrocarbon powered cars are limited by fuel tanks.

    2) pumping oil out of the ground, refining it, transporting it, burning it - all environmental disasters that ARE happening

    3) super-capacitors will only be able to recharge as fast as the gizmo recharging them allows. A 15A wall outlet can only provide so many electrons.

    Throughout this thread, there seems to be a misunderstanding of what a "plug-in hybrid" is. They run on the battery as long as they can, then the hybrid part takes over and moves the car and recharges the battery. In my case, most of my trips are the 5 miles back and forth to "town." I would probably need to fill the fuel tank 1 or 2 a year as I do take occasional trips to the "city."

    Self-drivers, electrics, hybrids, hydrogen, smaller more fuel efficient cars, mass transit, car pooling, and things I can't begin to imagine are all in our future.

    [​IMG]
     
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  17. Zepfan

    Zepfan Poster Extraordinaire

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    A quick charge on a battery will discarge quicker because it's not a strong charge for most batteries, they need a slow charge to be strong to last longer.

    One thing I didn't think about with the post office is what Telemnemonics was saying about the driver's driving records and the potential savings for insurance on self driving vehicles.
     
  18. imwjl

    imwjl Poster Extraordinaire

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    That reads like general unhappiness or needing to choose some sort of hermit life with a horse or bicycle replacing your car. No product is perfect and you've chosen brand/product combos that are very popular and respected overall.

    Spin will always happen but with or without spin we are seeing or are about to witness a lot of change in transportation.
     
  19. Guitarteach

    Guitarteach Poster Extraordinaire

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    The next disaster is when we realise we have consumed most of the rare earth and exotic metals needed for this grand electric future. Most reserves are in China and some rough parts of Africa.

    Just trading one environmental mess for another one. We need to rethink commuting and workplaces and get back on bikes or foot for local stuff.
     
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  20. memorex

    memorex Friend of Leo's

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    Either that, or it's based on the lifetime of our CEO, who died last week.

    I'm just kidding. I have a 2006 Hyundai Tucson, and it might be the most reliable car I've ever owned. I also have a 2017 Hyundai Tucson. Since it only has 4,000 miles on it, it's too soon to tell.
     
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