PRS Private Reserve dye job - any idea what they are using in this video?

Discussion in 'Finely Finished' started by DHart, May 13, 2019.

  1. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    Thanks for that.

    Just when I was thinking of using water with the Transtints, now I'm thinking perhaps alcohol might be better. :lol: But for some reason I'm leaning away from spraying anything.

    Would you mind elaborating a little more on the 50/50 acetone and flowout enhancer/retarder? Is that the base you would add some Transtint drops too?
     
  2. urbandefault

    urbandefault TDPRI Member

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    Hard to tell. His color pads don't seem to dry out so he can work it like watercolors, but the wipe-down cloth stays clean, indicating a fast dry time.

    I'd say it's definitely water based. Or alcohol based. :p
     
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  3. Treadplatedual

    Treadplatedual Tele-Meister

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    You may not need any barrier, I've never used one. The lp I posted was straight tru oil o er dyed wood.
     
  4. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    . :lol:
     
  5. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    Was your dye water-borne, or alcohol?
     
  6. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    Some observations:

    There is a very large open container of a clear liquid by the cups... most likely the base for the dyes - likely water?

    His applicator pads are all lying there for some time after being dipped in dye, before the video even begins. His applicator pads are retaining the moist dye solutions for at least 5 minutes, laying on a cloth.

    He doesn't dip into the browns cups at all during the application, just picks up the pre-dipped pads, presses them into the workspace table fabric, applies color, and then puts them back down again.

    No dipping after the first wetting of the pads that took place before the video began... perhaps that might be an indicator of a water-base to his dyes? (Would an alcohol base dry out too quickly for his process?)

    He is obviously very careful to wring out any excess liquid tint off each pad - keeping as little moisture as possible on the applicator pads.

    After using the last brown tint pad, he picks up a seemingly wet, but un-tinted pad, that has been laying there the whole time - a water pad, perhaps, to blend the dyes around? That last pad, presumably with just water or solvent on it, definitely picks up some of the previously applied browns and blends the different dyes together.

    There are five cups and pads, with differing shades of brown, before the 6th and brilliant amber at the end.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2019
  7. Rufus

    Rufus Tele-Afflicted

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    This thread is very timely for me...
    I have recently been experimenting with dyes and a 3 piece mahogany body without any fancy maple top.
    I tried using Transtint in denatured alcohol on scrap mahogany but did not care for it. I watched a channel called BigD guitars on youtube and liked some of the results he got with Angelus Leather dyes.

    Be advised that the wood itself will have a huge impact on the staining results.
    For example, on a white-ish maple, the dyes will be much more vibrant and colorful than on mahogany, which will be more subdued and the nature of the wood may cause the dyes to be pulled in more of a brownish, reddish or even greenish spectrum.

    I applied Fiebings black dye on brown mahogany and the result looked more chocolate brown. On a brown mahogany, Angelus Purple came out black with golden specks and the Angelus blue came out a deep purplish-black...again, it would be much different on maple or ash.

    My results were obtained by applying by hand, straight from the bottle with a wadded up cotton cloth. Spraying will be somewhat different?

    If you're thinking of stains or dyes, I urge you to check out the Angelus dyes and youtube videos.
     
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  8. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    Can anyone recognize the brand of these dye bottles?

    And, note the large container of clear liquid... water?

    [​IMG]


    Five pre-mixed shades of brown:

    [​IMG]
     
  9. Luthi3rz

    Luthi3rz Tele-Meister

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    1. Water thinned Dye over Lacquer Based pre stain sealer?
    2. Water thinned Dye over Shellac Based pre stain sealer?
    3. Denatured Alcohol thinned Dye over Lacquer Based pre stain sealer?
    4. Denatured Alcohol thinned Dye over Shellac Based pre stain sealer??
    5. Lacquer Thinner thinned Dye over Shellac Based pre stain sealer??
    6. Lacquer Thinner thinned Dye over Lacquer Based pre stain sealer?
     
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  10. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    Does the large open container of clear liquid tell you anything?

    Does the fact that the cloth applicators have been sitting there for some period of time, after being pre-moistened, but before being applied, tell you anything? That they haven't seemed to have dried out while sitting there on the cloth?

    I don't know... just considering. If I had to guess, I'd guess water-based. But you guys know a LOT more about this than I do. :cool:
     
  11. Luthi3rz

    Luthi3rz Tele-Meister

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    Not me dude...I'm still learning.

    Funny thing about this video is that in another PRS video they guy says that
    " it's kind of hard to do a Burst with Dye" so they spray paint the burst colors...yet here is this video.


    My guess is they use a Retarder to prolong the working time.
     
  12. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    Another product I know less-than-nothing about and need to do some research into. :rolleyes:

    What a project this has become! Could be a very long time before I lay hands on my unfinished guitar body.
     
  13. Treadplatedual

    Treadplatedual Tele-Meister

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    Water :D
     
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  14. Luthi3rz

    Luthi3rz Tele-Meister

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    Thought you might want to check this out.

    https://woodrepairproducts.com/product/ultra-penetrating-stain/

    Mohawk has their own line of Stains and they have a Stain Retarder

    also https://woodrepairproducts.com/product/dye-concentrates/

    Trans Tint Dye
    http://homesteadfinishingproducts.com
    http://homesteadfinishingproducts.c...ansTint-for-Luthiers-Instructions-11-2018.pdf
     
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  15. Chunkocaster

    Chunkocaster Friend of Leo's

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    I have blended/faded stain on necks before. I use colortone wood stain diluted with water. Dampen the wood to raise grain a few times knocking it back down by fine grit sanding to super smooth. You can't have any scratches. swirls or sanding marks whatsoever or the color will highlight them.

    Then lightly and evenly dampen the surface with a clean wet rag before applying the stain to reduce the likelihood of a blotchy look. You can thin the color out or blend more by using a clean damp rag if you have to but try to get it right without the need to do that. If you go too dark you can also remove some of the color with a plain water dampened rag. You need to use clean fresh rags for every step. It's surprisingly easy to do but you really want to think about the exact look you want to achieve before starting. How will one color blend into the other, Dark first or start with lighter color etc. You can play it safe and build the depth of color with several light sessions if you want.

    If you want to really pop the grain/flame you go dark first and sand most of it off before you start. The dark color remains in the flame. grain and is highlighted as you progress with the staining. Of course everything will darken some when the clear coat is applied.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2019
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  16. maxvintage

    maxvintage Friend of Leo's

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    I think it's water based. As mentioned--sand to 220, wet to raise grain, sand again. Then start dye application. I think the last may be shellac with dye mixed in
     
  17. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    Ah... very interesting.

    A hand-applied, water-based shellac, with some amber dye in it? Hmmm.

    Would he wipe down a shellac with that big cloth, though?
     
  18. DonM

    DonM Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    From that I was trying to make sense of the WY on the yellow bottle; Waterbased Yellow?
     
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  19. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    Could be, man! I was trying to guess what that might be also.

    I am a total finishing novice, a nobody really, but I've watched that video on a 27" display, perhaps a dozen times and looking carefully at various clues, I just have a hunch that it's water-based.

    However, the more experienced finishers here, that we have viewing this, the more likely we are to get it figured out! :)
     
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  20. DHart

    DHart Friend of Leo's

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    I found a great resource for Transtint use. And, surprised to learn that a mix of water AND alcohol can be used as a base for Transtint!

    https://www.joewoodworker.com/transtints.htm

    This link has really helped explain a LOT about Transtint. It's an amazing product.
     
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