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Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com

Newbie Tele build

Discussion in 'Tele Home Depot' started by brownale99, Feb 24, 2017.

  1. Macrogats

    Macrogats Tele-Meister

    Age:
    50
    300
    May 15, 2017
    Auckland, New Zealand
    Oh yeah. Those Forster bits rock! Had never used one till the other day. Certainly makes short work of certain routing jobs. :)
     

  2. NotAnotherHobby

    NotAnotherHobby Tele-Afflicted

    Oct 27, 2015
    Da' Magic Mittin'
    My wife bought me a 3 2/2 hp plunge router 20 son years ago. The thing is a behemoth. I can't image being able to route anything with it given its size and weight. So that is the one I dedicate to the table.

    I have a smaller DeWalt that I use for hand routing. But it does not have a slow start. I use it with caution.
     

  3. Macrogats

    Macrogats Tele-Meister

    Age:
    50
    300
    May 15, 2017
    Auckland, New Zealand
    Ha! Neither does mine. Always scary starting the piece you're working on off. :p
     

  4. brownale99

    brownale99 TDPRI Member

    44
    Feb 18, 2017
    Newcastle, UK
    Well it was only a matter of time before my first big catastrophe. Finished round over on the body and decided to drill the wiring holes.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    After that came the jack hole and that's where it started going wrong. I drilled a pilot hole through and it went through dead centre, I'd read somewhere to use a 20mm forstner bit and ream out rather than a 22mm as the 22mm will leave the hole slightly big so off I went. the forstner bit was real jumpy to start and it looks like it's started off centre I realised early on but by that point the damage was done :( so decided to continue with the idea of using a les paul style jack. The hole is still 2mm small but I doubt it would be salvageable for a recessed jack. That to one side I went on to routing the neck shape. Trimmed down on the bandsaw the added the template. Everything went swimmingly until the tip of the headstock, at which point the router grabbed it and flung it across the garden. Luckily the dog was at hand to bring it back.

    [​IMG][​IMG]

    I'm under no illusion the neck is game over now but I'm going to carry on with it and try a neck carve fro the practice. I've got some off cuts of sapele, is it worth cutting the end off the headstock and gluing a bit on to try a re-route. I'd like to know why that happened and try again before starting a new neck. I tried to follow guides on here and watched a few videos but wasn't expecting anything that violent. Any tips on routing the headstock tip?
     

    Attached Files:

    Mat UK likes this.

  5. Mat UK

    Mat UK Tele-Afflicted

    Feb 17, 2009
    London, UK
    Such a shame! But not a big deal.

    What finish are you going to do on the body? You could always try plugging the hole (not all the way through, just 1-2cm) and then re drill?

    How big was your pilot hole? I'd go very small diameter - if it's too wide the sharp forstner tip will not have anything to grab to and the main cutters will pull it about. I have recently discovered these bits, they are perfect for this type of operation as they have a properly piloted tip - you can buy them individually from eBay and buy replacement pilot guides.

    If I were you, instead of practising a carve on the damaged neck, get cracking on a new one. Carving has some significant stages (Marty has the perfect step-by-step in the DIY Channel forum) but it's time consuming - so best to spend that time on a neck you will actually use.

    As for what wrong with your the routing technique; it may be:

    - your direction of feed

    - taking too much material off in one go; that might be routing too much depth and/or too much thickness from the line

    - tipping the neck slightly would encourage the bit to bite and throw

    General advice here is to sand as close to the line as possible for all template router operations and take small 1-2mm depth nibbles until you get to depth... of course many people don't take the risk of routing a headstock and sand the whole thing to shape...

    No biggy!
     
    brownale99 likes this.

  6. brownale99

    brownale99 TDPRI Member

    44
    Feb 18, 2017
    Newcastle, UK
    Thanks Mat, I was going to stain the body so I'll likely just go with the square jack. The only bit I had long enough to go through to pilot was 6mm so maybe that's why, I think I'll bite the bullet and buy a pilot forstner for my next build. I may still have a little nibble at the hole to tidy it and see how close I can get it. I was a bit lost as to which way to feed the piece into the router at the top, the shock got me more than anything else and think that's when it tipped and likely doubled the damage. I had the shape roughed out pretty close but next time I'll use the spindle sander and get as close as I can and as you say possibly just leave the top and finish it with the sander. On the plus side the neck fit the pocket spot on and was dead straight. I'm beginning to wish I'd payed attention in woodwork at school now :/ learning the tools is harder than I thought. Oh well back on ebay for another neck blank.
     

  7. Mat UK

    Mat UK Tele-Afflicted

    Feb 17, 2009
    London, UK
    6mm is definitely too large, if you have a crack at it again with the same bit you'd be better off doing it with no pilot hole. Also, you don't have to drill with the forstner the whole way thought to the cavity, just enough to accommodate the jack, then you can drill through to the cavity with a 12mm bit for the wires.

    I'd suggest, if you're going to do a bit of guitar building, find a local hardwood supplier and buy a board of your chosen wood - I bought a 3m board of hard maple for £25ish, I have enough wood for 12 necks!
     
    brownale99 likes this.

  8. Macrogats

    Macrogats Tele-Meister

    Age:
    50
    300
    May 15, 2017
    Auckland, New Zealand
    Ouch! Hard luck dude. Thought I had routing probs the other day, but nothing compared to that. My router jumped on me when doing a small control cavity. Luckily it wasn't a biggie as the damage will be covered.

    Are you sure you can't salvage the neck? Cut that end off at an angle and glue another piece on? I know I'd give it a go.
     
    brownale99 likes this.

  9. guitarbuilder

    guitarbuilder Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Mar 30, 2003
    Ontario County
    You could cut some of the tearout part off at an angle and glue on new wood to replace it similar to a scarf joint but on edge. I did this to a MIM strat neck I got cheap that was missing a chunk. If you look closely, you'll see the line between the two pieces.

    [​IMG]

    Find some of the scrap and cut the new part at the same angle of grain and it should match up pretty well. Make sure the rings are going the same direction too.


    This may help in the future...no template routing.


    http://www.tdpri.com/threads/lets-make-a-neck.755300/
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2017
    brownale99 likes this.

  10. crisscrosscrash

    crisscrosscrash TDPRI Member

    90
    May 8, 2015
    Montreal
    I had this happen 2 out of the 3 first necks I tried to build - it's just too difficult to keep the piece feeding smoothly and carefully in the right direction when the direction changes so quickly. Now I just DO NOT ROUT the tip of the headstock (or the heel of the neck) -- I do it with the ROSS. If you don't have that, a belt sander clamped on its side to a table will fill in (I did it that way for a few months). And even if you just attack the tip and heel with files and sandpaper, it will add 30 minutes or so, but save your neck (maybe literally!).
     

  11. Bugeater281

    Bugeater281 Tele-Meister

    Age:
    26
    128
    Nov 30, 2016
    Omaha
    That's happened to me also, you have to use really small passes on that part of the neck, I did an ash neck. Ash is already know for splitting, it gripped a bit too much and ripped the neck in half. Not sure if you have one, but a router table made a huge difference. It's way easier to control and take small passes then holding the router. Routers love to take of in random directions when holding them.
     
    Mat UK likes this.

  12. brownale99

    brownale99 TDPRI Member

    44
    Feb 18, 2017
    Newcastle, UK
    Cheers Mat, I had a look on the net and found a local supplier nearby and popped in on the way home from work. Picked up a 3m board of sapele for £21, next project is a router sled so I can get it thicknessed.

    I'll try and follow that to the letter on my next attempt. That's as comprehensive a guide as you can get, thanks.

    Thanks for all the advice guys, it's much appreciated. This is a whole new ball game to me, I've never picked so much as a saw up since school. I've got a typical male approach to things whereby I'll break something then research why it's broken as opposed to learning how to do it right first time, I'm now learning to change that approach. It's quite disheartening to see your work winging it's way across the lawn in bits.

    I've managed to cut away the damaged piece on the headstock and glue on another piece, the best I could get was a 45 degree cut so I'm hoping that's ok. It's not the greatest match but it was all I had that would fit, it'll keep me going until I let the new sapele settle in and start again. Is there an ideal time to let it settle, I've read varying times from a week to a year. I'm guessing it's hard to be certain without a moisture measuriser. There's moisture meters on ebay for £15 but I'm not sure I'd trust the readings at that price.

    Thanks again

    Dave
     
    Mat UK likes this.

  13. Mat UK

    Mat UK Tele-Afflicted

    Feb 17, 2009
    London, UK
    Exciting times. With that sapele, you've just signed yourself up for a good 2 or 3 more builds ;-)
     
    brownale99 likes this.

  14. brownale99

    brownale99 TDPRI Member

    44
    Feb 18, 2017
    Newcastle, UK
    Not much done on the guitar today, bandsawed the glued up headstock and rough shaped with the spindle sander. It's not the greatest match but hopefully it'll mean I can continue working on it. Started building a radius jig and router sled for thicknessing so I can start on the new sapele.
    [​IMG][​IMG]
     

    Attached Files:

    Mat UK, callasabra and guitarbuilder like this.

  15. Macrogats

    Macrogats Tele-Meister

    Age:
    50
    300
    May 15, 2017
    Auckland, New Zealand
    Looks pretty good to me man. :)
     
    brownale99 likes this.

  16. brownale99

    brownale99 TDPRI Member

    44
    Feb 18, 2017
    Newcastle, UK
    How do folks, not had much of a chance of late but in the little time I did have I managed to ruin a neck trying to drill the truss rod access at the peg head. I had made a 3 degree angled wedge with a channel in for the bit but the bit has lifted as I was drilling and it's opened up the hole. I've cleaned the damage up and made a dowel to fit so no drama's there. I've got a dual action hot rod truss rod from SM this one. Is the 3 degree hole just for the single action rod as that's the angle it comes out at the peg head and does the adjuster have to be at the bottom of the route. I guess my question is what's the best way to drill for a hot rod. I've done a search of the forum and a lot of the discussions have all of the reference images missing so I'm a bit lost. I was looking at the pocket jigs like the Kreg one but they are 15 degree, I'm not sure if this would be too much of an angle to get the allen wrench in. My apologies if I've missed something whilst searching. I have ordered a heel adjusting rod to make the neck in guitarbuilder's lets make a neck but it would be handy to know how to do both. Cheers.
     

  17. guitarbuilder

    guitarbuilder Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Mar 30, 2003
    Ontario County
    A hot rod nut would require a hole or slot parallel to the top of the fretboard. The 3 degree angle is to access the threads on the curve of the vintage style rod.

    For a peghead truss rod nut access, you can rout a slot at the peghead end to accommodate a hot rod nut. I'd choose the smallest diameter one for that application. You can also mount the hot rod upside down to get the top rod to have the nut closer to the top surface of the peghead.

    I would say drilling the 3 degree hole for a single vintage style rod may be the hardest part of making that kind of neck. I ordered long brad point bits for the occasion recently.

    http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5338148343&icep_item=112479842279
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2017
    brownale99 likes this.

  18. RickyRicardo

    RickyRicardo Friend of Leo's

    Mar 27, 2012
    Calgary, Alberta
    The dual action rods aren't installed at an angle. The vintage rods are. I think dual action rods are easier to install the other way around - heel adjust. That's how I do it but YMMV.

    Brad point or Forstner bits make a nice consistent hole. A regular drill bit tends to wander if you're going through end grain.
     
    brownale99 likes this.

  19. Barncaster

    Barncaster Poster Extraordinaire

    My drill set didn't come with one of those!
     

  20. brownale99

    brownale99 TDPRI Member

    44
    Feb 18, 2017
    Newcastle, UK
    Cheers for the replies folks, always appreciated. My apologies for the slow pace of this thread, between the weather in the UK and work it's hard to get time. Anyhoo, made a little progress the last few days.
    First thing was a new bandsaw blade. I decided to look up setting the bandsaw up on youtube and found a plethora of clips and what a difference, to anyone on their first build with a new bandsaw get it set up right before you start. Don't trust the numbers on the guides, set the table angle with a square and adjust the guide to suit, then check your fence is square with the table. I assumed mine was at 90 degrees but the table and fence were both out. Gave it a quick try on some scrap then took a bit off the neck as it was too thick.
    [​IMG]
    Decided to repair the damage to neck as mentioned above and persevere with it before I start with the new one. The hole was 5mm so took a piece of metal and drilled a 5mm hole, took a bit of scrap from the neck and put it into a drill and forced it through the hole Just like this, worked a treat. Hole re-drilled with an extra long brad point.
    Managed to make a fret radius jig and got the fret board down to 9.5. Fretboard glued on and sanded down on the ROSS rather than used the router as they don't like me very much. Finished off using a plane and fret leveling beam.
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Moved back to the body and finished drilling the string through holes which is kinda scary without a decent drill press. Marked the holes on the front and back of the body using the template and drilled just over half way through from the top then flipped over and drilled through from the back. If your template is good then the holes should meet half way. Slowly drill from the front all of the way through. This left the holes a little out of skew on the back when I was finished so I made a template from a body off cut and drilled it through with an 8mm bit. This was then stuck onto the body square to the string holes and drilled deep enough to take the ferrules.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Next was back to the neck and attempt to carve it. Bought a Japanese shinto rasp to rough out once the first facets had been marked on the neck.
    [​IMG]
    Things went a little pear shaped after that, the weather started to turn and instead of packing up I tried to rush a bit before the rain came. I struggled getting the transitions blended in and in the process I think I've created a "w" profile neck lol. I'm glad I carried on with this neck as I've I much better idea what to expect when I make the next one. Didn't really get anymore pics after this until I tried a rough put together. Just waiting for the fret dots to turn up before I put the fret wire and nut in. In the mean time I'll try and tidy the neck up a little and may do a bit chambering under the scratchplate as the guitar weighs a ton.
    [​IMG][​IMG]
     

    Attached Files:

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