Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com
Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com
Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com

New 5e3 kit build

Discussion in 'Shock Brother's DIY Amps' started by Romartin, Oct 16, 2017.

  1. Romartin

    Romartin TDPRI Member

    Age:
    32
    48
    Aug 7, 2017
    USA
    Yes, it is a boot-Hill kit and I’m using a JJ 5y3 currently. It was a great kit, and everything in it was spot on! Would highly recommend it to anyone considering a new build. I’ll be using them again I’m sure.
     

  2. tombob

    tombob Tele-Meister

    Age:
    44
    379
    Jun 25, 2010
    Sonora, TX
    These amp builds are more addictive than heroine. I finished my 2x12 5f6a build but the handle I ordered was back ordered and the grill cloth shipped with the handle. I at least know for sure they are shipped and I'll get them Monday or Tuesday and I'll be able to put the finishing touches on. I don't want to start another build until I do and gig it once just for testing purposes but I've really got the "itch" bad to start a 5e3 build. I think building and trying different ideas on amps is nearly as much fun as gigging through them! Someday I want to do a "scratch" build using a blank chassis and make my own turret board, I'm thinking I might pick up a set of JTM45 iron and use it to build a Route 66 head clone with a EF86 in V1, they're about as simple as a 5e3 and I think they sound great.
    Maybe I need to go to a meeting of my local AA ( Amplifiers Anonymous that is :))
     

  3. Romartin

    Romartin TDPRI Member

    Age:
    32
    48
    Aug 7, 2017
    USA
    Lol, it really is addicting! I’m even having withdrawal symptoms now that the chassis is done haha. Although I do still need to replace the cathode resistor.
     

  4. theprofessor

    theprofessor Friend of Leo's

    Aug 8, 2016
    Chattanooga, TN
    I'm just starting to pay attention to 5E3's. @Romartin used the Classictone PT and OT that they recommend for exact replacements for a 50's Deluxe. How do the B+ voltages he listed compare to what others have found from vintage-spec'd iron, when one considers wall voltages at about 120-122AC? Also, does the fact that the tube in this case is dissipating about 14W simply have to do with the cathode draw of that particular tube, or can this higher number also be attributed to higher wall voltages and thus a higher overall B+ (if that is true). The reason I ask is because I'm thinking on a 5E3 in the not-too-distant future, and I'm currently under the impression that Classictone is the way to go for these. These numbers are making me think that one needs more than Classictone to get you to vintage voltage levels. Maybe zener diodes between the center tap and the B+ or the like. But it would be nice to use a PT that would give the right voltages, even in light of higher wall voltages nowadays...
     

  5. tombob

    tombob Tele-Meister

    Age:
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    379
    Jun 25, 2010
    Sonora, TX
    The voltages don't seem that far off to me, if I'm not mistaken I believe the perfect "vintage correct" 5e3 voltages on the 6V6s are 360v plate and 325v screen on the B+ so 370v and 329v is close. I would think using a larger value cathode resistor should be the best way to tweak the bias with those voltages. I've heard that the 250r that comes with most 5e3 amps are really a bit small anyway. I see a common substitute is a 270r 8-10W cathode resistor.
    By the way JJ 6V6S tubes are rated at 14 watts max dissipation speaking of 14W 6V6s.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2017

  6. theprofessor

    theprofessor Friend of Leo's

    Aug 8, 2016
    Chattanooga, TN
    Thanks, @tombob . After asking the question about voltages, I found this diagram on @robrob 's Proluxe page that was created by @Telenut62 :
    Standard 5E3_Voltages.png
     

  7. King Fan

    King Fan Friend of Leo's Ad Free Member

    Jan 1, 2013
    Salt Lake City
    Professor, 5e3 PTs is a topic I researched at one time. Let's see If I remember anything! :D

    I haven't looked back at which PT Romartin used in this excellent build, but IIRC ClassicTone recommends their 'reverse engineered' 40-18021 for the 5e3, and *also* IIRC, that 710V PT has often been noted to yield a B+ that's a lot higher than vintage even allowing for the increases in wall power over the years.

    That doesn't mean you can't use a ClassicTone PT, though. There are innumerable "which transformer for 5e3" threads on TDPRI, but you can find expert info about PTs from ClassicTone / Magnetic Components that fit the bill. After reading lots of those threads, and consulting that same Telenut62 schematic from Rob's page (nicely spotted!), I settled on the MC P-TF41316, which I think is the same as the 660V ClassicTone 40-18016, which just happened to be the one MuchXS liked in that thread.

    There are lots of PTs that work well, and actually some others from MC / CT. I'm just saying even though I love ClassicTone, I don't always follow their 'perfect for xxx amp' suggestions.
     

  8. tombob

    tombob Tele-Meister

    Age:
    44
    379
    Jun 25, 2010
    Sonora, TX
    Every new production 6V6 made now should handle over 400 volts on the plates easily, JJs are good to 500v. Blackface 6V6 amps run 410-420v on the plates and they're making tubes that stand up to them now. I really like JJs for gigging amps but I think the Tung-sols sound great for smaller, recording amps for creamy, tweedy overdrive.
     

  9. Romartin

    Romartin TDPRI Member

    Age:
    32
    48
    Aug 7, 2017
    USA
    BCB6E590-9873-4684-B5A5-43ED9A16BCFF.jpeg I received my speaker in the mail today!
    It’s a Weber 12a125a. I went with the 8ohm 30 watt. I’m waiting on a cabinet from armadillo amp works. He’s a local guy here in the Texas hill country who really does some amazing work. I’ll post some pics once I get it all together. It might be a little while because he said it’ll take 4 weeks before it’s finished. Thank you again to everyone who has supported my build thread, it has been a very rewarding experience for me. I look forward to future builds and following you all along on the various threads. Stay tuned for the final product.
     
    tombob likes this.

  10. Wyatt

    Wyatt Tele-Holic

    804
    Nov 3, 2004
    Will's cabinets are nice. I have one of his 5E3 cabs and had him do a replacement baffle for another cab I sold off..
     

  11. Romartin

    Romartin TDPRI Member

    Age:
    32
    48
    Aug 7, 2017
    USA
    Yeah I’m really looking forward to getting the cabinet. Do you have any pics of your 5e3 cabinet from him?
     

  12. tombob

    tombob Tele-Meister

    Age:
    44
    379
    Jun 25, 2010
    Sonora, TX
    I've heard really good things about Will and Armidillo Amp Works. He's about 175 miles east of where I live. I bought the cab for 2x12 5f6a Bassman I built from Rawcabs (Sorrycharly on eBay) because they have half blind dovetail corner joints and I wanted to stain and finish it just to be different. The dovetails look great for that and I do have to say the fit and build quality on the cab from Rawcabs was great.
     

  13. tombob

    tombob Tele-Meister

    Age:
    44
    379
    Jun 25, 2010
    Sonora, TX
    I've got an idea for a future build using a 5e3 kit. I'm wondering if anyone else has thought about it or done anything similar. I'm thinking it would make a interesting amp to combine 5e3 iron and 5f10 Harvard ciruits. Harvards are fixed bias with a negative feedback loop and a single channel. The input stage runs through a 6at6 tube I think. I was thinking about using a EF86 in V1 or even using a 12ay7 and make the second half of it a switched extra gain stage (cascaded). It should make a amp that's a little louder with more headroom than the standard 5e3. It looks like it would be a great amp to partner with a standard 5e3 in a 2 amp rig and of course it's an excuse to build another 5e3...
     

  14. tombob

    tombob Tele-Meister

    Age:
    44
    379
    Jun 25, 2010
    Sonora, TX
    Since I finally got my handle I thought I'd share my last build, it's a 2x12 5f6a that I couldn't be happier with, it sounds incredible.
    I can't wait to start a 5e3 build now! image.jpeg image.jpeg
     
    crossroader and jsnwhite619 like this.

  15. Romartin

    Romartin TDPRI Member

    Age:
    32
    48
    Aug 7, 2017
    USA
    Wow that’s a beautiful build! Love the cabinet
     

  16. DrPepper

    DrPepper Tele-Meister

    Age:
    58
    125
    Nov 24, 2017
    Texas
    Looks good.
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2017

  17. Romartin

    Romartin TDPRI Member

    Age:
    32
    48
    Aug 7, 2017
    USA
    Well I put a 300ohm cathode resistor in and now at 111% plate dissipation. You guys think I should go up to a 350ohm resistor now?
     

  18. theprofessor

    theprofessor Friend of Leo's

    Aug 8, 2016
    Chattanooga, TN
    Give it a try, and see what your numbers are then.
     

  19. clintj

    clintj Friend of Leo's

    Apr 4, 2015
    Idaho
    What does pin 5 read? Hopefully zero. Also, is the amp doing anything odd when you play?

    Just making sure there's not a hidden problem pushing the bias hotter than it should be for this resistor value.
     

  20. MatchlessMan

    MatchlessMan Tele-Meister

    443
    Oct 22, 2011
    Wiltshire UK
    I measured the wall voltage where I live at 248V, way more than the 220-230V the circuit 'expects'. I ended up with a 470R cathode resistor to get the dissipation within spec. Eventually I installed a 270R dropping resistor to bring down B+1, and went back to 270R for the cathode resistor. The amp sounds great - gigged it last night. (Blue combo mostly obscured by me!)

    [​IMG]
     

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