Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups
Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups
Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups

my new theory about tube fans

Discussion in 'Modeling Amps, Plugins and Apps' started by mister natural, Apr 25, 2014.

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  1. Jim Dep

    Jim Dep Friend of Leo's

    May 23, 2010
    New York
    On the subject of tube snobs, can people imagine a guy that looks and sounds like this picture of Vince Welnick playing with .......The Tubes ?? Go figure.

    Oh yeah, I can clearly see this guy wearing a pink jockstrap, Alice Cooper mascara and Amy Winehouse lipstick.....NOT.
    Sorry for the visual.

    Nice video, Telepath. Good tune.

  2. JayFreddy

    JayFreddy Poster Extraordinaire Silver Supporter

    Nov 6, 2006
    Dallas TX USA
    Great tune. Seriously. Thanks for sharing. :cool:

    One major drawback to tubes that is often overlooked is how dirty they are. Manufacturing tubes is a filthy, poisonous, toxic process. As in, "really bad for the earth and the creatures that live here, including people."

    And tubes use boatloads of electricity too.

    I predict tubes will eventually fade out as digital alternatives get better and cheaper, while simultaneously the quality of available tubes will get worse and become much more expensive.

    However, this process will probably take at least 30 years, at which point, I may not even be around.

    I still own a dozen or so tube amps... :oops:

    TRUTH! :cool:


  3. mandocaster

    mandocaster Tele-Meister Gold Supporter

    Jul 2, 2007
    Houston, TX
    I like my tube amps and my newish Roland GA-112. I like that I can get a good sound and then set the master volume wherever I want. I play in a worship band, and stage volume is a real issue.

  4. teleamp

    teleamp Poster Extraordinaire

    Oct 17, 2006
    Prairie Hill, Texas
    it's all about the right tool for the job... nothing personal.

  5. collinsman

    collinsman Tele-Afflicted

    FWIW - I have a recent ' Fender modeling' amp ( only because I live in a apt) & a good tube amp & lets say ' no contest" for tone, tube wins hands down.

  6. Shuggie

    Shuggie TDPRI Member

    Jun 20, 2014
    Try this theory; Why not?

    Convenience: I spent years as a teenager playing sucky fender solid-state amps, frying one after the other playing them at 11. 30 watts, 75 watts, they never kept up with the drummer and they didn't sound good. Now my 1x12 boutique BFDR is perfect volume, don't even need pedals because distortion is part of the package when your band gets rowdy.

    Cost: They hold their value. I bought my hand wired Australian made amp last year, I know even if I throw it out my window all I need to do is replace the tubes. Maybe solder a wire. I can get rid of it anytime, just sell it. If you bought it secondhand like me, you might even profit. A well made one will outlast you. Generally can't be said for outsourced Chinese post GFC items. Its like renting for free, and mine has paid for itself in joy already. It is an investment. (I had to explain this to my dad when I spent my savings and brought one home)

    Sound: Life is short, nothing matters tone wise as much as your amp, so why not own a nice one? I have not played enough of the new technology, and I'm sure it sounds fine, and nobody cares but you at the end of the day. Even if you have a modeler that sounds exactly like say a crunchy tube amp, you know its digital and in a way not real, a copy/gimmick, no matter how accurate to the "real thing"!

    Charm: To some, the electric guitar is a funny instrument, some of my friends play acoustics exclusively, they don't like the idea of them. I felt similar before i discovered the simple wiring in my guitar and in tube amps, I understand it and it feels natural to me now, it inspires me to make music. The traditional electric guitar sound, except for maybe a perfectly clean one, was defined by the tube amp.

    Trial and tested: Lots of classic amps are tube. I will never waste another minute thinking I need a better amp. It gives me peace of mind, the type of amp I own has been selected for thousands of recordings. If it ever sounded wrong to me, I would clean my ears.

    Ive seen guys use modelers live, one sounded great. But for me I honestly see no reason not to buy a hardwired tube amp and call it done.

  7. Drubbing

    Drubbing Friend of Leo's

    If it sounds exactly the same to someone, then why must they feel inferior that it's digital, or superior that it isn't? That's much the same as any brand snobbery.

    Tube maps were the default for older recording because that's all there was. Unless you listened to band that used SS. CCR were one of those…

    Lastly, the reasons people use modellers live is because they feel them to be just as good sounding, and more convenient. And less costly. Given the price of tubes in this country, I'm grateful for the choice.

  8. udoering

    udoering Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

    Mar 31, 2013
    near Cologne, Germany
    I am a little surprised that this thread is still alive; anyhow, here is my view:

    From former times I still have a Hughes & Kettner amp, all SS; didn´t sound bad, but too much distortion on the hot channel. Used it recently as second unit in stereo-setup, sounded good.

    When I started to play guitar again zwo years ago, I first got me a Blues Junior (tubes) after searching the internet, but it didn´t sound the way I expected. Maybe couldn´t play it luod enough at home. It is gathering dust now.

    Then I tried a Super Champ X2 (tubes + modelling). I liked both channels (until I played i with a 10 inch speaker, the modelling channel had an articial quality). But then I needed an amp for a gig with another sound, and I purchased an used Engl Gigmaster (tubes). While I liked the drive channel, the clean channel sounded hifi-ish and liveless to me.

    The next amp I tried was an Egnater Tweaker (tubes). I liked the clean sound as well as the breaking-up and the overdriven sound. I am still having it, and I will keep it as backup amp or take to other places and leave it there.

    The last amp I bought (again after internet search) was a Mesa Lonestar Special. And now: this is the first amp where I´m really loving the clean sound. It is alive in a way none of all the other amps could make it, the breaking-up is sweet as heaven. I never had an amp before sounding so organic.

    So what am I? A tube snob? I don´t think so. I often hear other players with a sound I like, sometimes they use tubes, sometimes modelling, sometimes amp simulations in their computers. I think there will be a time where tubes can be replaced, and this will be soon, I believe.

    But what I am is a "I trust my ears"-snob. This Mesa amp gave me the finest sound ever, and I am totally aware that I talk about my ears and my taste.

  9. SamClemons

    SamClemons Poster Extraordinaire

    Jan 23, 2011
    Jasper, TN
    Just an opinion...modeling amps sound fine for sitting around a music store or in your bedroom or recorded for that matter, but ramped up to concert volume...they fall flat. The louder they get, the worse the modeling amps sound and the better the tube amps sound. Speakers are part of that equation (a lot of the cheap modeling amps also have cheap speakers), but a lot of it is the technology of the tube.

  10. Larry F

    Larry F Doctor of Teleocity Vendor Member

    Nov 5, 2006
    Iowa City, IA
    I like a touch-sensitive amp. Are modelers capable of that, as well?

  11. Ash Telecaster

    Ash Telecaster Friend of Leo's

    Haters gonna hate. Sorry but that is a dumb phrase. It could apply to anybody based on their opinions, likes, dislikes, or even their mood at any given moment as compared to yourself and is just a way to ...hmm....hate.

    Tube snobs...yup, I'm one, not that anybody else should care. I have great fondness for my AC15, Tweed Blues jr NOS, Haze 40, 5e3 Proluxe and Twin Reverb. I am over joyed at my good fortune to be able to own such different and spectacular amps. They are more than just an electronic tool. They are art. They are beautiful and exressive and they bring me joy.

  12. johnreardon

    johnreardon Tele-Afflicted

    Oct 24, 2006
    Brackley, Northants, UK
    I play electric guitar, so to be heard I need an amp. Just because I happen to like using valve amps it doesn't make me a snob. :confused:

    I grew up playing valve amps and when solid state came out, I thought they sounded piercing. Of course they have got better over the decades, but I still prefer valve. Good luck to those who use other amps.

  13. tonytrout

    tonytrout Friend of Leo's

    Mar 19, 2003
    Brasstown/Murphy, NC
    One of my uncles had a SS amp that I absolutely loved playing through - all original and everything. I, of course, went to tube amps when I heard James Burton and haven't looked back!! However, I do think it'd be cool if my uncle would will me his SS amp when he passes.....


  14. Shuggie

    Shuggie TDPRI Member

    Jun 20, 2014
    I didn't say inferior or superior, although I admit I sort of implied it... I haven't met anyone who would forgo a nice tube amp for a nice modeling rig under circumstances where money isn't a reality. Besides this probably being due to misconception of them sounding different (I think they do respond/feel different however) I would say that classifies modelers as inferior. I know some pros use modelers but they are paid to do so. I personally would only use one in a metal band, or if I played in many different genres requiring a new tone all the time.

    I personally think of digital amps are foreign weird and ugly mass produced technology. I like the feeling of having an amp made here in Australia, I ride a surfboard that I shaped myself, that kind of thing. I love it and I am weirdly proud of them.

    btw I don't fall for brand snobbery either, i don't care if people don't see a fender badge on my amp or guitar, thats why i got boutique amp.

  15. franchelB

    franchelB Friend of Leo's

    Sep 25, 2005
    Irving, United States of Texas!
    Tube snob? LOL! Hardly!! I have 2 SS amps, and 1 tube amp. I can feel the difference of the tube amp when I A/B my amps.

  16. tele salivas

    tele salivas Poster Extraordinaire

    Sep 5, 2008
    The newer ones are. I have used tube amps for 30 years, as well as SS, but I am currently totally happy with my Fender modeling amp. I was blown away when the buzz from my single coil Tele pickup came through. It sounded just like my old Fender Twin was in the room again. Ha!
    Once I wrapped my head around what I was dealing with and got over my bias :)lol:---:oops:), I was able to dial in some great sounds. I got the modeler that day and in a couple weeks sold a couple of my tube amps. Each thing is its own thing. Compare/contrast work to certain degree, but you can severely limit your experience if that's all you go by. Learn to work with what you got. For porch playing I still prefer a ratty little five watt tube amp.

  17. mabley123

    mabley123 Friend of Leo's

    Aug 21, 2011
    ashland kentucky
    I have a Mustang 5 head, Fender Cybertwin first edition, 69 Blackfaced Dual Showman reverb, Metro Amps Limited Edition GMP45 with mustard caps NOS GEC KT66 and Mullard 10M and GZ34 tubes

    No way.. To me..... does the CT or the Mustang have the same feel and respone as my tube amps.

    The feedback and overtones are also not the same and not as pleasing.. to me. in the CT or the Mustang.

    And the CT and Mustang both sound good but not on the same level as the DS and GMP45

    I also think the Cybertwin sounds Much better than the Mustang 5

  18. Telepathist

    Telepathist Tele-Afflicted

    Nov 19, 2013
    "Variety is the spice of life."

    I don't have the room to have separate tube amps and pedals for the variety of tones I'm after. Hence, a modeling amp fills that niche.

    I have a couple of tube amps to achieve the tube goodness.

    Best of both worlds.

  19. mabley123

    mabley123 Friend of Leo's

    Aug 21, 2011
    ashland kentucky
    Most of the time though the CT is my grab and go amp and I don't feel Im really missing anything and everyone always says how good it sounds.

    It has really nice echo and delay effects. Several of each and very tweakable

    I also rarely use the compressor. I just usually use 1 of the regular presets like Vintage stack, 66 Super Reverb, Various Champs, Deluxe reverb 2 different 1's, 59 Bassman

    I turn off all of their effects and start with a basic clean amp sound and go from there.

    I never use the other side of the amp with the things like.. Troweful, Frankenstein, Voodoo Haze.

    If I wanted just 1 amp and couldn't afford pedals ect I would get a CT hands down and I would feel like im missing nothing really.

    Its way more than enough amp to use at gigs and especiialy a nice amp to muck around with and get different sounds out of and is also Midi friendly and also is very good for recording.

    Also does have a Tube Preamp.

    For 500 dollars not may amps can do what the CT does. And 10+ years ago they listed for 1800 dollars. They are a good quality amp and more reliable than the Mustang from what Ive read. Ive never had trouble out of my M5 head but I got it on a trade and don't use it much

    They also made a CT head only. I almost got 1 of them and wish I would have. My 1st gen CT doesn't have an extension spkr input 2nd generation does. Many prefer the 1st generation though but I cant say as Ive only played mine. I got it new for 1200 dollars

  20. TwangyWhammy

    TwangyWhammy Friend of Leo's

    Jan 10, 2014
    Under the DownUnder
    Same here…

    What constructive purpose can this thread ever achieve?

    Why hasn't it been closed?

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