Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com
Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com
Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com

I need the money! I need more gigs! I quit!

Discussion in 'Band Wagon' started by Big_Bend, Mar 20, 2017.

  1. Big_Bend

    Big_Bend Poster Extraordinaire

    Age:
    53
    Feb 19, 2010
    Houston, TX
    I told my other guitar player / singer in my band that I was letting another front guy have a few gigs this year at our monthly regular gig at a nearby biker bar. I figure having some fresh talent rotated through would be a good idea, keep it fresh for the bikers, and this new guy is top notch. The new guy has sat in with us before and done an awesome job.

    My regular front guy, who has been with us for 2.5 years and has not helped book a single gig (and he is retired) told me "I don't like this, you letting the other guy have a few gigs. I need the money. I need more gigs. I quit!"

    :(

    Before, our old front guy was going to get maybe 20 gigs with us this year, but with my new plans he would have only gotten 16 or so... but apparently some people feel entitled to book themselves in my band... while never contributing any other work to get booked.

    We'll go with the new guy from now on. He's awesome! Still, band drama.. oh well...
     

  2. Paul in Colorado

    Paul in Colorado Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Mar 17, 2003
    Fort Collins, CO
    Musicians. I am one and I can't figure them out.

    I hope it goes well with the new guy. Too bad the old guy will now have no gigs now. :rolleyes:
     
    viccortes285, RyCo1983 and Big_Bend like this.

  3. Milspec

    Milspec Tele-Afflicted

    Feb 15, 2016
    Nebraska
    For every member of the band, there are at least 2 personalities.

    (Read that on a bathroom wall in Nashville)
     
    h2odog, Obsessed, Piotr and 2 others like this.

  4. Big_Bend

    Big_Bend Poster Extraordinaire

    Age:
    53
    Feb 19, 2010
    Houston, TX

    I know right... old guy has always been sorta crotchatty. We love the new guy and wanted to slowly work him into our lineup. I was hoping to make a gradual transition.. but the old guy wanted all the cake and icing too.

    New guy is amazing! He is the first guy I've had in our band that I think could last 20 years. He is a peer, a few years younger than me, he tears it up on a custom shop tele, a Swart amp, a sweet pedal board.. and he is a tremendous player, singer, and song writer.

    We'll see what happens... the only constant is change. All I know is every time I've had to make a change, or someone has quit and we added a new member, the band has benefited.

    The road goes on forever and the party never ends it seems. :cool:
     

  5. robt57

    robt57 Telefied Ad Free Member

    Feb 29, 2004
    Portland, OR

    Considering that in the 9 years I was in Nashville, I observed citizens generally had two... So "at least 2 personalities" is a conservative estimation.. in my estimation..... :D
     

  6. christhee68

    christhee68 Friend of Leo's

    Aug 1, 2011
    south carolina
    That happened in my band. The bass player said we didn't have enough gigs so he was going to quit. Now he has no gigs, unless you count the $50 per man gig he booked using my band's name the next week after he quit.
     
    3-Chord-Genius likes this.

  7. Rod Parsons

    Rod Parsons Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    70
    Sep 26, 2009
    Winchester, Va.
    Big egos and big attitudes have always been a problem in bands, that I have been in. I can not tolerate them...They all have to go.. They ultimately destroy bands..You did good. The old guy is an egotistical fool, imo. The very first thing I look for in a potential band member is, "How big is his ego?" If it's too big, then bye. I auditioned for a band a couple years ago. They thought they were auditioning me... Nope! They were so full of themselves, I declined.. And so did the bass player, who was also auditioning. I auditioned the band and they flunked. Musicianship comes last, when I am seeking band members. One can always be taught to play, but I have never been able to teach one to be "all for one and one for all".. For many, that can't be taught.. The new guy in your band is a stroke of luck... I wouldn't ask the quitter to come back. Good riddance. And good luck to you..
     
    lewis likes this.

  8. teletimetx

    teletimetx Poster Extraordinaire Gold Supporter

    Jul 25, 2011
    Houston, TX
    ...that's pretty low, even for a bass player...
     
    68Telebass likes this.

  9. atomfissure

    atomfissure Tele-Holic Silver Supporter

    638
    May 31, 2010
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Quitting because you want more gigs doesn't make a lot of sense, but I can kinda see where this guy is coming from.

    I was singing and playing keys for a band a while back, and after spending a good few months getting their rather deep catalog down pat, and they started incorporating the ideas that I brought to the table, the guy starts talking about flying in his old singer to help finish a record. It steamed me up pretty good, but I didn't quit (not until later when he disparaged the bass player, who is also my wife. But that's a different story).

    Just as this is your band, it was his band so I figured "hey, he can do what he wants," but it killed all my buy-in and made me way less excited about continuing to work with them.
     

  10. brookdalebill

    brookdalebill Telefied Ad Free Member

    Age:
    60
    Nov 15, 2009
    Austin, Tx
    Avoiding drama is one one of the few skills I am very adept at.
    As a hired gun, it's fairly easy.
    I am a member of only 2 bands.
    I play with 25.
    I ain't bragging, or lying.
    Most bands have internal drama.
    Most bands have power struggles.
    Most bands have unequal skill sets.
    Most band members have agendas, like drinking, girl chasing, money(?), or the need to have a public forum for their opinions.
    I know this.
    I don't join bands, though I am often asked to.
    As a hired gun, most of the bands that use me are glad to have me.
    I allow them to do their gig if their regular guy can't make it.
    I do this 90% of the time with no rehearsal, paid or otherwise.
    If I'm as good or better than their regular guy, everyone's happy.
    If I'm not, hey, I'm not their regular guy.
    I can't be fired, I'm not a member of the band .
    I sing, play guitar and/or bass, and I do help moving gear.
    I get myself to and from the gig.
    I don't drink, sand bag or goof around.
    I just love to play.
    My only advice to those who are band members is this :
    Keep It Simple.
    The fewer members, the fewer problems.
    Unless the goal is to be "the next big thing", play, make em' dance, count your blessings, and don't worry about the next guy (in the band) too much.
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2017

  11. Wrong-Note Rod

    Wrong-Note Rod Poster Extraordinaire Silver Supporter

    Mar 4, 2009
    atlanta
    I want money, I want more gigs, I quit.

    Classic.

    I worked with a drummer who killed two bands by saying, "I lost my fulltime job, now I want this band to be my fulltime job so we need to play stuff we dont like to get more gigs".

    1) he wouldnt lift a finger to get these gigs. He simply assumed that play disco and the paying gigs will come.

    2) nobody wanted to play stuff he said would get paying gigs, so the bands would fold up
     

  12. Flat6Driver

    Flat6Driver Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    44
    Jan 14, 2013
    DC Burbs
    His excuse is weak, but it sounds like his reasoning is sound. I'm not sure how I would take it on any job if my successor was visibly training in the wings. Of course, it all depends on the terms of how he was brought on. If Big Bend's band is Him and the Subcontractors, then then is no expectation of continuity. (and I think it is the model he uses). If it was more of a "peer based" model, Old Guy has more right to be upset.

    Slightly related...Right now, the peer based band I'm in, I have scored some gigs and so has the BL. The other guys have not. I see how hard it is to follow up with people, sell yourselves, etc. Part of it is that, sadly, I'm the most connected of all of us. Next time I organize or join something, I will check on the "connectedness" of the band members as well (if a start up)...do you have a social network of people that will come, who else do you know? Etc. The best players in the basement are less valuable than an OK guy with a lot of friends that will fill a gig or a lot of good connections.
     

  13. christhee68

    christhee68 Friend of Leo's

    Aug 1, 2011
    south carolina
    Big Bend and the Subcontractors--Awesome band name!
     

  14. christhee68

    christhee68 Friend of Leo's

    Aug 1, 2011
    south carolina
    That's because he can't count higher than 50.
     

  15. tonytrout

    tonytrout Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    41
    Mar 19, 2003
    Brasstown/Murphy, NC
    Whooo, boy!!! Band drama. I hate it.

    It happened to me about, eh, four year ago, maybe?

    I joined up with a band that was then called "My Highway" and everything seemed to be going fine - until I started bringing my now ex-girlfriend to the gigs (this was done so I wouldn't have to hitch a ride with my drummer friend (who, for whatever reason, always wound up putting me in the backseat with all of his drums where I literally couldn't move).

    Well, when I started letting the ex come to the gigs, the crap started flying - and I don't know why. I let her come with me so I would have someone to talk to while on a break - I didn't see any big deal with that. They finally fired me and made up an excuse that "we thought he needed a break and time to rest" - in other words, trying to use my disability against me when there was no truth whatsoever to their silly excuse. Plus, they just plain didn't like the fact that I simply brought someone else along to lessen the load of my drummer friend having to haul someone else's ass (mine) to a gig.

    Well, now that band is playing under another name (without me) and I'm single (and believe me, I'm very happy being single). And what happened to the guys who originally started the band?

    One wound up leaving and divorcing his wife (and their young daughter) and found another lady.

    The bass player started getting heat from his pastor about playing secular music versus Christian music (I've been there, too) so he quit.

    The lead guitar player wound up working with my drummer buddy in the new band.

    And I'm back where I was originally in the band I started playing in around Fall, 1998.

    *sigh*
     

  16. Big_Bend

    Big_Bend Poster Extraordinaire

    Age:
    53
    Feb 19, 2010
    Houston, TX

    Several issues here. I don't blame the old guy for being upset.. because he was definitely a part of our "peer based" band model. But I've been planning for months to move away from that type of lineup and go to more of a "subcontractor" type lineup with multiple front people who can help us bring a variety of lineups to gigs.

    That being said, the old guy was really pissing me off lately... bad attitudes, complaining about gigs but never helping to book any, never arriving early to help setup the PA, always leaving early and never helping tear it down.. and frankly, I was bored with his song contributions too. Also the old guy has shown his short temper before, and has even quit our band a couple of times in a brief rage, then calmed down and reconsidered. That act gets old....

    New guy has sat in with us before, always eager to help out, helps pack up everything at the end of the night, and more importantly, I love the songs he brings to the table.

    Truth be told, I was ready to totally fire the old guy and immediately bring in the new guy, but I figured I'd try to keep everybody happy and involved as we more forward.. lets all grow the pie here folks and we'll have more slices for everybody. But the old guy wanted all the gigs, didn't want to share, and never did any help to make new gigs happen.

    I was glad he quit. Good riddance... but ya, band drama, no fun. Oh well, comes with the territory. Our new lineup will be even better than ever...
     
    Chester Burnett likes this.

  17. Revv23

    Revv23 Friend of Leo's

    Oct 9, 2009
    Michigan

    I loved reading in the motley crew bio how if nikki sixx was auditioning he would leave his bass in the car. After talking to the guys for about five minutes and if he felt they werent going to be a fit, he would tell them he was going to go grab his bass - then just take off!
     
    Rod Parsons likes this.

  18. Chester Burnett

    Chester Burnett Tele-Meister Ad Free Member

    337
    Aug 14, 2015
    Minneapolis, MN
    I suspected there was more to the story. It sounds like you wanted him gone but didn't want to outright fire him. Was the new guy not available to take all the gigs? I think letting him go cleanly would have been a better approach. Your plan was bound to hurt his feelings provoking what sounds like an inevitable, immature response on his end. It's a little like telling a girl you've been dating that you want to start seeing other people. That's usually the end of that relationship. The guy in that situation usually lacks the decisiveness to break it off so he makes it her decision to end things and then blames her for doing so. I'm not saying that's what you did here, I'm just trying to illustrate why clean breaks are usually the way to go.

    In a peer based group everyone needs to be comfortable with everyone's individual contributions. Someone who doesn't pull their weight in some way is going to draw resentment and lead to problems. It should have been addressed and worked out before it got to the resentment phase.

    I'll also say that I like my front people to have a bit of an ego. It usually translates into stage presence. You can have an ego without being a jerk though. It sounds like it was a bad fit in this situation.

    I do admire you for trying to keep the ball rolling and not have the band self destruct over a member who was a bad fit. I see too many bands go with the "take my toys an go home" approach. Taking ownership and responsibility for the band rather than watching fizzle is great. Leadership is hard and requires some nuance and the ability to be decisive though. Bringing in a new front man who you obviously like better was a invitation for band drama.
     
    skantzos and Bill Hubbard like this.

  19. bsman

    bsman Tele-Afflicted

    Jun 8, 2003
    Santa Clara
    It sounds like Thunderdome is the ultimate answer to every band problem...
     
    DarkKnight37 likes this.

  20. chris m.

    chris m. Friend of Leo's

    Yes, I think this is an example of, "You can't fire me because I quit". He saw the writing on the wall and quit.

    It's a very good point about two types of bands: total equality vs. the band has a boss. I'm in a total equality band right now. The up side is that everyone is very cool and very happy and we have a lot of fun. Everyone is a really good musician so we really enjoy playing together. The music we are making is some of the best we have ever performed in our lives, so we are feeling very fulfilled even just practicing, much less gigging. I think that's the ideal: where everyone is happy just playing and hanging out together, paying gigs are just icing on the cake, and no one in the band has any baggage.

    The down side is only two of us make any effort to keep things organized-- schedule rehearsals, talk to venues to get gigs, etc. I've become somewhat the de facto leader of the band, helping ensure the business stuff happens. In the ideal world we would have a band member who just loves doing all this stuff, especially since I'm not all that good at it. Or, we would get an additional member who is not a musician but is good at social media and helps manage the band. I'd be happy for that person to get an equal share of all revenues. If we found the right personality for that role it would actually be ideal.

    The reality is that we all have day jobs, have a hard time carving out time even for the music part, so I understand totally. If we were trying to make an actual living at this we would definitely need a manager. Either a straight-up manager, or a manager-player.

    I've been in bands where someone was the boss- the manager/player model. If the boss was cool and the band was doing well it was OK. It seems like a fair trade if the boss does a great job of keeping things organized-- getting a promo package together, booking gigs, developing successful set lists-- doing the manager part of the job. But I was in a band where no one ever felt secure because we knew we would be fired as soon as the boss got it in his head that he could replace you with someone better. He was always looking to upgrade and it ruined the vibe of the band. Once someone is put into the leader position then the vibe of the band depends heavily on the management style and personality of the boss.
     

IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.