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Have you ever had this problem?

Discussion in 'Tab, Tips, Theory and Technique' started by golfnut, Jan 10, 2019.

  1. golfnut

    golfnut Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    58
    Jan 15, 2008
    Canada
    Very simple pieces of music that you just can't seem to get to stick.
    I'm playing in a classic traditional country band (and working far more gigs than I thought possible with this genre) and 2 songs I've been working on Merle Haggard "Fightin side of me" and Dwight Yoakam the solo for Honky Tonk Man". 2 very simple songs. The first phrase of the intro for the hag song sounds like its coming in part way through a lick. So feels awkward and I don't know why I had a mental block with the Yoakam solo
    Anyway I have them now but it just seemed like I had to give it more time than it needed for the simplicity.
    I've played far more technical pieces from old country, new country and classic rock with ease.
    And my roots are originally in this traditional country.
     
  2. Sparky2

    Sparky2 Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    59
    Apr 15, 2017
    Harvest, Alabama
    What's funny is, once you get them down cold, you later have it so easily done with muscle memory, and you kind of wonder how you got from there to here.

    I LOVE conquering something that at one time vexed me.

    :)
     
  3. thunderbyrd

    thunderbyrd Friend of Leo's Silver Supporter

    Age:
    60
    Dec 21, 2004
    central ky
    I have had this problem and it mystifies me. This is embarrassing, but whatever. I was to play solo through the melody of silent night for our Christmas service. Played through it at home til I thought I could play it in my sleep. Got up and got lost. How is it possible?

    Days like that make me wonder what is wrong with me.
     
  4. Peregrino69

    Peregrino69 Tele-Afflicted Silver Supporter

    Age:
    49
    Dec 12, 2016
    Amsterdam
    I'm just guessing, but maybe it's the way you count the beat. The first note of the intro doesn't fall on beat 1 but 4, like so:

    [​IMG]

    Yoakam's either dropping half a bar here and there, or sticking extra half bar in. Most of the classic country is just straight-forward 1 - 2 - 3 - 4, so if that's the way you feel the beat this kind of embellishments can easily throw you off. I know quite a few people who have problem with these... I even know one who can't for his life play on a 1 - 2 - 3 beat :D

    LOL the video to Honky Tonk Man - '80s overload :D

     
  5. Tenderfoot

    Tenderfoot Tele-Meister

    Age:
    72
    315
    May 8, 2014
    Katy, TX
    Your not alone, even the guitarist playing on the mentioned artist songs don't play it the same way every time. Aside from the signature licks that allow the song to be identified with the artist - the guitarist will have some variability in how they play the intros, leads and endings. IMHO the only thing that sticks is what was played on the original recording.
     
  6. golfnut

    golfnut Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    58
    Jan 15, 2008
    Canada
    Yes I definitely know what the problem is and you are right on the money. Its a timing thing. As soon as I get the timing cemented in my head then I get the licks right. Once I get the timing right it doesn't even have to be the exact notes. But I like it to be as close as possible for songs like that have a more arranged feel.
     
  7. moosie

    moosie Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Age:
    61
    Jul 18, 2010
    Western Connecticut
    I usually mute the strings all the way, and just play the 'chunk' 'chunk-a-chunk' to get the rhythm down, before tackling actual notes.
     
  8. Tonetele

    Tonetele Poster Extraordinaire

    Jun 2, 2009
    South Australia
    It's a wonder that's not in soprano! Ever time I see Dwight Yoakam his jeans look like he's not getting any blood circulation.:confused:
     
  9. Peregrino69

    Peregrino69 Tele-Afflicted Silver Supporter

    Age:
    49
    Dec 12, 2016
    Amsterdam
    Maybe "Yoakam" is just a stage name hiding "Tipton"?
     
    Tonetele likes this.
  10. Milspec

    Milspec Friend of Leo's

    Feb 15, 2016
    Nebraska
    Happens to everyone and in any instrument. In the Springsteen broadway show, Bruce talked about his first drummer that was really good and could play anything...except "Wipe Out". No matter how many times he would try, he just couldn't do it.

    I was asked to sit in with a small trio for a night and they mainly played the usual classic stuff, but the lead wanted me to do a duet on Bob Seger's "Against the Wind" which is pretty much a beginner's song....I could never get it right. For some strange reason my change from the barre chord just never made it on the right note, I was always just behind it. I can keep up on far more difficult songs (the group is a big Alman Brother's fan) but that damn simple song just made me look like a fool. The more self-conscious about it I got the more I screwed it up.

    I just Porky Pigged it and changed it to something else.
     
    Nightclub Dwight likes this.
  11. Bergy

    Bergy TDPRI Member

    Age:
    34
    65
    Dec 12, 2018
    Denver
    One thing that might help on that Haggard tune, keep in mind you are starting on the V chord. It makes that intro feel sorta awkwardly mid-phrase when you come in. Our ears get really used to hearing the first chord of a song as the I chord, because it usually is! This tune kinda employs a deceptive cadence-version of an intro.

    If you haven’t considered it, it might be worth sticking to strict alternation on the picking for that Dwight Yoakum solo. That attack pattern is indicative of someone flat picking a lot like a bluegrass musician, to my ears at least.
     
    JL_LI likes this.
  12. Nightclub Dwight

    Nightclub Dwight Tele-Holic

    683
    Aug 12, 2016
    Pittsburgh
    I love your phase "Porky Pigged it!" It exactly describes my flailings whenever I get lost in a song. I guess I can be a proud master at Porky Pigging it now that I have a name for what ails me.
     
    duzie and Milspec like this.
  13. golfnut

    golfnut Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    58
    Jan 15, 2008
    Canada
    oops put this in the wrong section
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2019 at 3:14 PM
  14. schmee

    schmee Friend of Leo's

    Jun 2, 2003
    northwest
    I dont know about those songs, but there are some songs that appear to be very simple, based on 3 ...or minimal chords etc, that are very hard to do well. Some ZZ Top stuff comes to mind....
     
  15. JL_LI

    JL_LI Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    68
    May 20, 2017
    Long Island, NY
    Bergy says it right when he says “Our ears get used to hearing...” I had this happen trying to learn “Still right here in my heart”. I wanted to use a familiar chord progression in the bridge and it was a battle with myself to play it right. There can be something challenging in even the simplest songs. There’s also a sense of accomplishment when you get it right.
     
    stinkey likes this.
  16. codamedia

    codamedia Friend of Leo's

    Apr 4, 2009
    Western Canada
    There are certainly some songs that stump with with simplicity...
    The 2nd half of Marty Stuarts solo in "Tempted" will NOT take root in my head... even back in the 90's when I played it almost every night. It's a simple 1/4 note line that refuses to stick!
     
  17. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

    Mar 17, 2003
    Lubbock, TX
    Here is the original of Honky Tonk Man. Deewight didn’t create that odd change there.

     
    WireLine likes this.
  18. WireLine

    WireLine Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    62
    Mar 23, 2003
    Midland TX
    The most difficult intro passage I’ve tried to duplicate was Reba McIntyre’s “Little Rock.” Reggie Young was completely on another plane of existence when he came up with that
     
  19. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

    Mar 17, 2003
    Lubbock, TX
    Little bit of a stutter step, isn’t it??
     
    WireLine likes this.
  20. McGlamRock

    McGlamRock Friend of Leo's

    Jun 1, 2010
    San Francisco, CA
    With a lot of old country stuff, I've noticed that I have trouble with odd bar counts (If I don't know the song). I was playing a new (to me) song with a 5 bar intro, and man did it get to me! Simple stuff, but oh so difficult
     
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