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Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com
Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com

Fretless, semi-hollow wenge/tineo guitar

Discussion in 'Tele Home Depot' started by lbridenstine, Dec 7, 2013.

  1. lbridenstine

    lbridenstine Friend of Leo's

    Feb 21, 2013
    Galesburg, MI
    Specs:

    -Single cut
    -Semi-hollow
    -Set-neck
    -Fretless with partial veneer lines in white
    -Floating ebony archtop bridge
    -Wenge tailpiece with brass plate underneath (for grounding)
    -Carved top
    -Grover Sta-tite tuners
    -Replacing the tuner knobs with ivoroid ones
    -Single humbucker - bridge position, no pickup ring
    -Haven't chosen the pickup yet, but I'm leaning towards something DiMarzio in either white or black (but not both), vintage or medium output
    -Wenge top
    -Tineo body (mostly one piece)
    -East Indian Rosewood neck (QS, one piece)
    -New Guinea striped ebony fretboard
    -White veneer between everything
    -White binding around f-holes
    -Mother of pearl/gold mop headstock inlay (haven't come up with a design yet)
    -Body end truss rod adjustment, with flush cover
    -Grain filling the wenge - white or grey
    -Tung oil finish, but unfinished neck

    So, these things will be new for me:
    -Soldering
    -Grounding
    -Semi-hollow-ing
    -Headstock inlaying
    -Making a tailpiece
    -Grain filling


    Here's the wood:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    I drew out my templates today. I somehow managed to fit that all on a 2' x 2' piece of plywood (Lowe's doesn't carry non-huge size pieces of mdf apparently).

    [​IMG]

    The body width is only 11.5" on this one because of the size of the body wood. But, then after making the shape, I found out that 11.5" actually doesn't fit on there either (one side of the wood is angled, looks like maybe the bark edge), so I have to just glue a very small piece to the side and I'm going to use epoxy with black pigment mixed in to hopefully make it look like one of the black stripes in the tineo. I'm leaving the width at 11.5" anyway, maybe it'll help with the weight.

    [​IMG]

    Here's the majority of the stuff I'll be using... The nut and electrosocket jack cup came after I took the picture. Still waiting on the knobs, brass sheets, and a new bandsaw blade. Oh yeah, and Sears is supposed to be sending me a replacement part to hold one of the blade guides on my bandsaw too.

    There's a 1/4" top bearing bit in there. I'm excited. The truss rod slot should be a breeze with that.

    [​IMG]



    I'm not sure when I'll get into actually working on this, but I assume it'll be sometime soon. I really wanted to wait for Spring and semi-decent weather, but I lost my job and don't have enough else to do to stop me from making this now. Plus, that should get me back to my "I'll make a guitar for someone besides myself in the Spring" promise that I've made to some people...

    Also-

    Has anyone made or seen a guitar/bass made out of tineo? If so, pictures? I've only seen pictures of 1 or 2 acoustics and heard that there's a grand piano made of it, but couldn't find pictures of that.

    And, I'm open to suggestions on headstock inlay ideas. I don't really want my name and I'm no good at naming instruments either. I'm thinking some kind of shape/image that I could make with 2 colors (white and gold) or with 1 color foreground, other color background. I'm kind of thinking an autumn leaf or something right now, but I'm not sure if that would go well with this.
     

  2. RogerC

    RogerC Poster Extraordinaire Vendor Member

    Mar 30, 2011
    Oklamerica
    Wow, Lisa! You've definitely kicked it into high gear! :D
     

  3. lbridenstine

    lbridenstine Friend of Leo's

    Feb 21, 2013
    Galesburg, MI
    Me?? How many builds do you have going right now? Haha.
     

  4. Shawn B

    Shawn B TDPRI Member

    67
    Mar 5, 2009
    Coeur d'Alene, ID
    That's pretty ambitious. Lookin' good, though. Interestingly enough, I've never seen a 1/4" top bearing bit before, only 1/4" bottom bearing. Would you take a close pic of it? I'm slightly baffled as to how one would put a tip bearing on a 1/4" router bit with a 1/4" shaft...

    As an aside, this is my favorite router bit ever - it's. 1/2" wide ~1/4" deep (super shallow) bit I use for routing everything except those pickup cavities that require a smaller corner radius. I *love* it.
     

    Attached Files:


  5. lbridenstine

    lbridenstine Friend of Leo's

    Feb 21, 2013
    Galesburg, MI
    Here's the link to the 1/4" bit with pictures and drawings of it. http://www.toolstoday.com/p-6238-mi...outer-bits-with-upper-ball-bearing-guide.aspx

    They actually have some smaller than 1/4" too. They're the only one's I've been able to find that has anything that small with a bearing. I looked all over a few times before and someone posted the link to this over on talkbass a while ago, so I saved the link.

    I was wondering if I should get something super shallow like the one you have, but decided not to right now. The shallowest I have is a 3/8" bit with a 1/2" depth I think.
     

  6. lbridenstine

    lbridenstine Friend of Leo's

    Feb 21, 2013
    Galesburg, MI
    Here's some more stuff for the build.

    I decided to try an electrosocket jack cup this time because I always do a big roundover and the jack plates (both football shaped and square) stick out a bit over the roundover. This is smaller and fits inside of the hole for the jack, so it should look better.

    [​IMG]

    I hope these knobs won't look too flashy on it. I almost got black knobs with white mother of pearl, but then I found these on ebay with black mother of pearl, so I thought they're at least somewhat more subtle.

    [​IMG]
     

  7. Shawn B

    Shawn B TDPRI Member

    67
    Mar 5, 2009
    Coeur d'Alene, ID
    I love Electrosocket jack cups. My favorite.
     

  8. lbridenstine

    lbridenstine Friend of Leo's

    Feb 21, 2013
    Galesburg, MI
    I wish I would have known about them sooner.
     

  9. lbridenstine

    lbridenstine Friend of Leo's

    Feb 21, 2013
    Galesburg, MI
    Here's a partial mockup. Ignore the headstock, that has changed.
     

    Attached Files:


  10. clsatt

    clsatt Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    32
    Mar 14, 2009
    virginia
    Thanks for the heads up on the 1/4" bit. This looks like a cool build! Rich Rice finished up a fretless guitar a little while back and made me a believer that they have some level of versatility beyond what I had previously thought. Good to see that template for the tailpiece aswell-- should be a fun new challenge.
     

  11. jkingma

    jkingma Super Moderator Staff Member

    Admin Post
    Cool design.
     

  12. Mike Simpson

    Mike Simpson Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    61
    Mar 19, 2006
    Gilbert, AZ (PHX)
    I do not like the lower horn hanging down like that... it looks like a limp... :eek:
     

  13. DrASATele

    DrASATele Poster Extraordinaire

    Jul 6, 2012
    North of Boston
    I love wenge, it's a very nice looking wood IMO. Very interesting design, fretless to boot, subscribed! That neck is going to be something else too, nice choice.
    Never heard of Tineo. I wonder how it is to work?
     

  14. Glen Smith

    Glen Smith RIP

    Aug 20, 2011
    Canada
    Lisa, what is this "white veneer"?
     

  15. lbridenstine

    lbridenstine Friend of Leo's

    Feb 21, 2013
    Galesburg, MI
    No problem. I probably won't use the 1/4" bit for too many things, but I've been wanting one to make the truss rod slot easier to line up and it should also help with f-holes.

    I'll have to search for that thread, do you know what it was called?

    My tailpiece kind of looks like a liver or something, I might make it a bit narrower. All I know is the ones they sell for archtops are WAY too big for this guitar (I think those are 7" long), so I have to make my own.

    Thank you. :)

    Sorry.

    I've been seeing a lot of wenge guitars/basses lately and it tempted me to try it. I really like the look of it too.

    Tineo is also known as "Indian Applewood" although apparently it is not Indian or apple wood. It's most common in Chile and Argentina according to this:
    http://www.wood-database.com/lumber-identification/hardwoods/tineo/
    and it says "Workability: Works well with both hand and machine tools. Glues, turns, and finishes well." It's a hard and heavy wood though. I'll let you know when I start working with it, the tineo is going to be the first wood I work on in this build.

    I did a search and found some acoustic guitars, a piano, and upright basses made out of it, so I would assume it's considered a "tonewood".

    It's fiber veneer from LMII.
    http://www.lmii.com/products/mostly-wood/bindings-purflings/fiber-veneer-sheets

    This will be the first time I work with it, it looks like it should work good.

    I was kind of bummed that they didn't offer any that are the thickness of fretslots, most veneer seems to come at that thickness, but I bought .02" and .03" and I'm going to use my bandsaw to cut the partial slots for the lines in the fretboard (they're only going to be at the top) and I think that cuts about .05" so I should be able to just glue two together and stick them in there.
     

  16. lbridenstine

    lbridenstine Friend of Leo's

    Feb 21, 2013
    Galesburg, MI
    Another note on the tailpiece, I got the idea from this:

    http://www.victorbakerguitars.com/blog/?p=1491

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    I'm not going to copy it exactly, but before I saw this, I didn't know how I could do a tailpiece without using an endpin and a fastener. So, I'm going to do something similar to this guy for fastening it to the guitar, except my guitar shape wouldn't work too great with that bottom piece going at a perfect 90 degree angle like that, it's going to have to be kind of twisted probably, and I want to stick my strap button through that piece to help hold it there, maybe that's all it will even need?

    I'm not exactly sure how to drill out the "keyhole" string slots though, I mean, as far as the thin line part of it that extends from the holes. I know I can just drill it and file it, but it seems like that would take forever to do with a hardwood and I'd have to use a really tiny file to fit in there. So, I might just do regular holes instead of key holes. I haven't decided yet.
     

  17. clsatt

    clsatt Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    32
    Mar 14, 2009
    virginia
    I've done tailpieces on most of my guitars. For the key hole, I usually drill two holes (one big and one little) and connect them with a needle file. I have a scrollsaw that I plan to try next since it really does take a lot of time. If you'r. Using a wooden bridge, start thinking about how you're going to ground the strings. The last wooden tailpieces I did wound up getting brass inserts that the strings passed through and a wire that I epoxied into a channel on the bottom where no one would see it. I could probably have done it cleaner if I thought further ahead.

    Rich has been awol for a while here but he updates fb still. No build thread as far as I know.
     

  18. lbridenstine

    lbridenstine Friend of Leo's

    Feb 21, 2013
    Galesburg, MI
    I was originally going to do string through instead of a tailpiece, but I started a thread asking about grounding and from the answers I got, it sounded like either a ferrule block type thing or a tailpiece was the way to go. I was going to buy a ferrule block, but then later I decided maybe a wooden tailpiece would look good.

    I'm going to put brass on the bottom like that guy did in the link/pictures above, so I think the strings would be touching the brass. Do I solder the wire directly to the brass? And does it matter if the wire is shielded or not? I bought this shielded wire for my wiring, I wasn't sure if that works for grounding too. http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Electronics,_pickups/Supplies:_Wire,_cables/Humbucker_Hookup_Wire.html

    Thanks for the video, it sounds good! I think playing fretless will be pretty fun. I'll probably use my other guitar for chords and stuff and use this one for weird/fun stuff.
     

  19. orangedrop

    orangedrop Friend of Leo's

    Aug 20, 2010
    New York
    Subscribed!

    You indeed solder right to the brass.

    Polish it with steel wool, clean it with Acetone, swipe a little rosin paste flux on the spot you want to solder to and have at it.

    The wire does not need to be shielded here, shields drain RF to ground and this is the ground.

    For making your keyholes, you can make the blind hole with a small Forstner and cut the slot with a 1/32 carbide spiral bit in a router or Dremel in a router base.

    If you plan on getting into inlay, the Stew Mac Router Base is almost a must have.

    It is very nicely made, and I chamfered and polished all the edges on mine as well as lapped and polished all the brass.

    Very pretty now.

    I hope I'm not overstepping here, but you might consider swapping the spade bit for a 7/8" Forstner to make the bore for the Electrosocket.

    Since the wings on a spade bit also do cutting, it is very easy to ovalize the hole.

    They tend to dull pretty quickly so after a few holes in hard abrasive woods, you may really be leaning on it.

    A Forstner from Freud is pretty good, or if you want to go hog wild, the Famag, with its little scoops relieved from the skirt is a beauty.

    I had bought a set of Porter Cable Forstner bits from Home Cheapo, and after spending several hours honing them to get them properly sharp, found the geometry still requires a good bit of downforce to cut a hole.

    I saw the Famag bits in a catalog, Lee Valley perhaps, and could not resist the 7/8".:rolleyes:

    I can't wait to see what your lumber really looks like once you open up the figure.

    What does the tineo sound like when you tap it?

    Is it glassy, bell like, deeper and woody?

    Does it remind you in tone of any other woods?

    Thank you.
     

  20. Glen Smith

    Glen Smith RIP

    Aug 20, 2011
    Canada
    You say the tineo isn't quite wide enough but you could use that flat spot for the electrosocket.
     

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